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June 1

stock

how old do you have to be to purchas buisness stocks? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.14.124.175 (talk) 02:05, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Anyone can buy stocks. Just contact a broker and they should set up an account for you - although if you're under 18 (or 21 in some places) one of your parents would need to sign off. See this. Zain Ebrahim (talk) 10:24, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Basically, you need to be old enough to legally sign a contract. That age and ways around it (having a parent sign for you) depend on where you live. -- kainaw™ 19:16, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Veto power in the United Nations.

I have a question. I know that the United Kingdom, the United States, Russia, France, the People's Republic of China and Germany have the veto power in the UN. But my doubt is: for example... If the Security Council imposes a sanction on China. Could China save itself using the veto power?. Thanks and if the answer is 'Yes'... the UN is the curse of our World! Maru-Spanish (talk) 04:01, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Do you mean the United Nations Security Council veto power? In that case Germany does not have a veto. Otherwise, yes, China can veto sanctions against itself, although I don't know if imposing sanctions is within the jurisdiction of the Security Council. The veto page has a bunch of examples of the US, USSR, and UK vetoing actions which were against their own interests, so such an event would hardly be unique. Adam Bishop (talk) 04:38, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

The Security Council has the power to impose economic sanctions, like those on Iraq, or on Rhodesia earlier. There was absolutely no chance that the UN charter would have been adopted in 1945 without the veto, it was a major struggle at San Francisco to restrict it only to substantive, non-procedural matters. In the old Council of the League of Nations every member had a veto. Not vetoing threatening actions would be the surprising thing, the Korean war and the Soviet Union being the only such case. China has used the veto very little. And of course, the veto hardly made the UN the curse of our world, more the reverse.John Z (talk) 07:15, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

China has used the veto six times, less than any other member of the Security council. (According to that page, France has vetoed 18 resolutions, the UK 32, the US 82 and the USSR/Russia 123. Russian vetos were most frequent in the Cold War and US vetos in the 70s and 80s. Another chart on that site shows vetoes were most common overall in the Cold War, and although the data only goes to 1992, it looked like the trend was for vetoes to affect fewer and fewer of the total number of UN resolutions over time. WikiJedits (talk) 15:05, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

As I recall, some of the more surprising non-vetoes were a result of non-attendance. For example, the Korean War intervention vote wasn't vetoed by the Soviets because they were boycotting the council at that point. — Lomn 18:49, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Sennosuke Yamaguchi's Fujiya Hotel Book 1939

I found this book a while ago and have not been able to find out any information on it. The title is in cursive Japanese kanji and is very difficult to make out, but the book was published in 1939 and autographed by the author, K.M. Yamaguchi, in 1947. From what we can figure out, K.M. Yamaguchi is a relative of Sennosuke Yamaguchi who founded the Hotel in 1878, but we have not been able to find out anything further. The book is a detailed history, in Japanese and English, of the Fujiya Hotel with pictures and hotel statistics. I was wanting to find out if there is any other information regarding this book, such as title, the author and Yamaguchi family. Basically, anything anyone can come up with will be helpful. Thank you very much,

Rachel —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.61.84.54 (talk) 04:12, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

How about asking them? Oda Mari (talk) 15:24, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

I did, but no one has gotten back to me as of yet. I was trying every venue open to me. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 170.164.50.119 (talk) 01:52, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

buddhism

please give some information on the impact of buddhism and jainism on literature ,art and architecture in India.124.7.76.158 (talk) 10:12, 1 June 2008 (UTC)Sagnik Mukherjee,India

Here you go Sagnik: Indian literature, and more specifically Pali Canon, Charyapada, and Tamil literature; also follow the links in all those articles. Indian art and Indian rock-cut architecture. Indian architecture#Buddhist_and_Jain_architecture. WikiJedits (talk) 14:51, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

economics

what is ASSESSIBLE VALUE ?? how do we calculate INCIDENCE OF TAX ? Mmsr (talk) 11:37, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Have you read Tax incidence? From a quick google search, it looks like "assessable value" is an asset's value for tax purposes (see this). Zain Ebrahim (talk) 12:39, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

The incidence of tax (aka "tax burden") is determined by the elasticities of demand and supply. For example, the quantity demanded of luxury goods tends to be highly sensitive to changes in price. So, when the government imposes a tax on luxury goods, producers prefer to pay the tax via reduced profits rather than to pass the tax on to consumers via higher prices. Conversely, the quantity demanded of gasoline tends to be relatively insensitive to changes in price. So, when the government imposes a tax on gas, producers prefer to pass the tax on to consumers via higher prices rather than to pay the tax via reduced profits. The interesting conclusion is that the government has no control over who ultimately pays a tax. For example, in the US, the employer "pays" half of a worker's Social Security tax while the other half is withheld from the worker's paycheck. In fact, studies have shown that workers end up paying the entirety of the Social Security tax via reduced wages. Wikiant (talk) 12:49, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

The term for In courtship, to open the legs and invite the male...

A long time ago I was reading something about how female lab rats would offer themselves to the male rats by opening their legs and showing their genetalia as if to invite the males. What is the term for this? I think it starts with 'L' and has a 'b' in it. Thanks Rfwoolf (talk) 16:48, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Minerva Minnie Mouse - not a rat but, at least, a rodent - having attended the introductory Lectures to Freudian Principles, given by the famed Professor Ludwig von Drake from Vienna called it "libido". O dear me, I just discover that I am less famous than a non-existing two dimensional psychoanalytical cartoon mouse oops, duck! Sniff, Boooh... --Cookatoo.ergo.ZooM (talk) 21:12, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Perhaps Lordosis. Edison (talk) 23:47, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

That's it! Thanks Edison. I've been trying to recall the word for a few months now - not ardently though, but when my mind wonders I keep on trying to recall it. Rfwoolf (talk) 03:55, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Better make that Lordosis behavior; those of us homo sapiens suffering from swayback have a posture problem not necessarily related to come-hither posturing! -- Deborahjay (talk) 21:11, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Refinement is appreciated. But back in the day I am sure behavioral scientists and textbooks just called it "lordosis" or the "lordosis reflex" [1] [2] [3] when a female rat prepared to be mounted by her suitor. And I have known swayback horses (and humans) who were not averse to courtship and all that it may entail. Edison (talk) 00:10, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Osaka/Kyoto in 1506?

I'm doing research for a novel that's set as per the title above, and so far it's been going well, although I seem to have chosen a rather 'dead' year, with veeery little info on the turn-of-the-century there. Out of the info I've managed to collect has arose a couple of questions: who would have in charge locally? Also from the Shugo page I don't know whether to use the term 'Shugo' or 'Daimyo'...I don't know, I think I've cobbled together a decent picture, but any certain info on what/who was/wasn't there at that time would be nice...?

--Lady BlahDeBlah (talk) 19:54, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Settsu Province and Izumi Province were governed by Hosokawa clan. kyoto was governed by Ashikaga clan. Read Ashikaga shogunate and Muromachi period and Daimyo#Shugo daimyo. Oda Mari (talk) 08:47, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Writing a song as a poem

All songs with lyrics can be considered poems. However, often in songs there are repeated refrains or choruses. If I am quoting a poem that is a song, could I leave out the repeated choruses, or leave out the choruses altogether? Can I state that song "Example X" is the poem "Example X without the choruses" ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.131.181.242 (talk) 21:26, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

I'd say that it depends on what you're doing. It's usual when displaying lyrics to label the chorus as such the first time it comes and just put "chorus" every other time. If I wanted to render a song as straight-ahead poetry, I'd include the full text of every chorus every time. Good poetry bears repeating. --Milkbreath (talk) 22:08, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Are you writing it as lyrics, or making it into poetry? As lyrics, I'd go with the chorus written once then noted every other time. If a poem turned into a song with choruses, they would be for the purposes of song writing. If you want to find the core poem, I'd leave them out since it's not Greek theatre, or is it? Julia Rossi (talk) 00:36, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Does Bangladesh export medicine to USA ?

Bangladesh Pharmaceutical Industry is a very promising sector for the growth of the Country's economy. Bangladesh exports medicine to a number of countries mostly in Asia and recently to some countries of UK. If any information on the query mentioned above with authentic reference is available that would be greatly appreciated.

regards !

--Riz1 80 (talk) 22:40, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Beximco intended/intends/has. If that helps. Fribbler (talk) 23:16, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Mr Ketchum getting hot

After getting help with the name of a movie that I only remembered one scene from, I thought I might try with the author and name of a short story I read as a child. The story is about "Mr Ketchum" (I think) who gets caught while speeding through a godforsaken place somewhere in the usa. he is sent to prison to wait for his trial. There he is served enormous amounts of tasty food, while waiting for the judge (who is supposedly sick) to be able to sentence him. in town there are banners proclaiming "barbecue tonight!", but Ketchum does not realize what is going to happen to him until he is placed in another cell where the walls are burning hot! Does anyone recognize this? /Marxmax (talk) 23:36, 1 June 2008 (UTC) Yes, I do remember it but think it was either a TwilightZone episode or part of a "compendium " film.I've asked my friends and everyone recognises it so a search is going on as I type.hotclaws 14:28, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

June 2

contracts

how old do you have to be to sign a contract in california?? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.14.124.175 (talk) 00:21, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

If this random website is to be believed, the age at which one can enter into a contract without parental consent is 18 throughout the United States. Algebraist 00:27, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Wikipedia agrees (for most states - there are some exceptions). See Age of majority#Countries and subdivisions and scroll down to the US (this is assuming that the age of majority is the same as the age at which one can sign a contract - the article mentions it but doesn't include a reference). Zain Ebrahim (talk) 01:15, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Emancipation of minors might also interest you. --Lisa4edit (talk) 18:43, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

evictions

Can the owners of our 6-unit apartments shut off our water while in the beginning of the eviction process?--Lisalisa1977 (talk) 00:25, 2 June 2008 (UTC)lisalisa1977

Where?Edison (talk) 01:07, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Assuming the United States, rental codes vary from state to state. Usually there is a "Renter's Rights" group that you can check with on such things. --98.217.8.46 (talk) 01:16, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Most U.S. jurisdictions require that landlords meet the housing code for occupied residential properties, and the housing code generally specifies clean, running water. So, in most jurisdictions, the landlord would be violating the housing code by shutting off the water before an eviction is ordered by a court and carried out by constables. As the previous poster suggested, you should contact a tenants' advocacy group in your jurisdiction, who can advise you on your options. Marco polo (talk) 01:53, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Remember wikipedia can't be a trusted source of legal advice, you might want a solicitor. SGGH ^speak! 14:41, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Who invented the presumption of innocence?

The article on presumption of innocence does not talk about the origins of the concept. What king, judge, legislature, constitutional convention, or other authority was the first one to declare that anyone has a right to be presumed innocent until proven guilty? Or if that's not known, what is the earliest known legal system to have operated on that basis?

--Anonymous, edited 08:11 UTC, June 2, 2008.

Jeralyn Merritt tries to trace The History of the Presumption of Innocence here. ---Sluzzelin talk 09:28, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Enlightenment Painting

I'm looking for an Enlightenment painting that has a young noble boy dressed aristocratically, learning farming techniques from a peasant. --Gary123 (talk) 15:28, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Surnames

What are the common surnames in Iran among the Shi'a Muslims, What are the common names in Bangladesh among the Muslim population, what are the common names in Pakistan and What are the common names in Afghanistan? Is there any website about these thing I ask about? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.64.129.52 (talk) 15:30, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Vienna Convention on Diplomatic immunity

How many countries have ratify it and signed it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.64.129.52 (talk) 15:45, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

I found a list (linking to Google cache to avoid password requirement). Algebraist 16:30, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Jefferson corpus

How would one go about obtaining a corpus containing all the recorded words of Thomas Jefferson as text file suitable for Markov analysis (thus, his words only without introductions other and crap that litters books of his writings)? I would have liked to think someone'd have already created such a file, but a cursory search was not availing. Sometimes I despair of the internet. 153.1.47.242 (talk) 15:48, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

The nineteen volumes of The Writings of Thomas Jefferson are available in electronic format: OCLC 43904757. Internet Archive seems to list them all available in plain text [4], tho you would need to strip out those parts you did not want.—eric 17:17, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

basis for naming of historical ethnic groups

When historians refer to ethnic groups from ancient times, such as the Assyrians and the Akkadians, what is the basis for this classification? What do you need to call yourself an Akkadian, for example? Does it depend on language, culture, or both? Thanks in advance, 203.221.126.29 (talk) 18:11, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

They usually use the terminolgy of historians of the time. i.e. the Greeks refer to the Celts as the Keltoi, but it is no assertion of ethnic similarity other that the greeks thought them to be the same. See Barbarians and Celts. Fribbler (talk) 00:00, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Iskhvakus / Ikshvaku - same or different?

Hi,

While reading the article on Skanda I came across these lines : The deity was venerated also by the "Iskhvakus", an Andhra dynasty

The article on Rama speaks of "Ikshvaku" dynasty. Rama was the prince of the Suryavamsha (Sun Dynasty) House of Ikshvaku

Iskhvakus / Ikshvaku - Are these two words with different spelling actually referring to the same clan or dynasty?

Writesprincesswiki (talk) 19:14, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Hi Writesprincess, they seem to be the same. The first as plural and the second singular. Of the dynasty, describes its members (Ikshvakus) which also belong to what is the Andhra Kingdom/tribe. The House of Ikshvaku would be the collective, and singular, afaik. (illustration: ...was venerated by Texans, an American state. X was leader of Texas. Clunky, but does that make sense?) Julia Rossi (talk) 11:35, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Her examples are spelled differently though. Since we have a bunch of Ikshvaku articles I would assume "Iskhvaku" is a typo, easy to make since those consonants never appear together in English. Adam Bishop (talk) 11:59, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Graven Image

In the 10 Commandments, does the term graven image really include photographs? If so, how come so many Christians take photos? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.119.61.7 (talk) 20:47, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Only if you were to worship the phtograph as an idol. :-) Fribbler (talk) 20:49, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Exodus 20:4? Some understand "graven image" to mean a carved idol or representation of a god used as an object of worship particularly in the context of the world the Hebrews moved through and its influences. Peoples around them used objects: trees, stones, sculptures and images which weren't only worshipped as representations (afaik) but as the god itself. It was important for them to distinguish themselves against this background as a select group dedicated to a rather abstract power. Others take it to mean any twoD or 3D representation. The key seems to be "idol" as something that might replace or distract from the Hebrew god. Julia Rossi (talk) 00:24, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

I've wondered the same about Muslims not being suppossed to create pictures, yet they all seem to watch tv and have illustrated newspapers and magazines etc, even the most devout/fanatical. 80.0.108.118 (talk) 00:28, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

(econ) I forgot your Christian snappers: it looks like the more abstract statement in Ex 20:3 applies, "Do not have any other gods before me", so rationally imo, a Christian as such (who is not defecting to the Antichristian Church of Photographic Worship) can snap away. Julia Rossi (talk) 00:32, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

About Muslims, for background there's the Islam article: in the Qur'an, "No vision can grasp Him, but His grasp is over all vision. He is above all comprehension, yet is acquainted with all things" (Qur'an 6:103). Here the emphasis is on the overarching oneness of God rather than banning images or physical likeness representations of god – one of the possible mis-representations of the indefinable. This article in the Wall Street Journal[5] discusses Islam not forbidding images as such, and that different groups activate Islamic traditions differently.[6]. Christianity had its anti-images activations as well in Protestantism, the Reformation and Puritanism afaik, mostly in reaction to interpretations of Catholic practice and aligning themselves with a strictly direct reading of the bible. Hope this helps, Julia Rossi (talk) 00:46, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Naked Nazi

I saw a life-size statue out back of Buda Castle that I could swear I've seen depictions of, but I can't put my finger on it. It was a blackened bronze, I guess, of a naked man bareback on a smallish horse. The horse was in a crouch, as if about to spring. The man had on nothing but a helmet very much like the one worn by the Germans in WWII. He was blowing a post horn, one of the bugle-shaped kind, not a round one. --Milkbreath (talk) 21:33, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

I only thought of naked riders on already rearing horses. Is it one snapshot before this? I found it and links to other pictures at de:Budapester Reiter, which has no article on en.wikipedia. Leonardo did sketch a lot of rearing horses, with and without nude riders wearing helmets. Perhaps it is a modern interpretation (Wehrmacht helmet)? ---Sluzzelin talk 10:46, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

The horse's posture was something like that (I described that badly), as was the rider's. The overall impression was not so bulgingly mythological, though, more realistic-heroic, if you know what I mean, but not quite state-approved, either. It looks like one was after the other, but which, who can say? --Milkbreath (talk) 11:01, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

The only two statues of a listed for Buda castle that come close are these [7] (3rd from the bottom) and [8]. None of them is naked. There are however tombs from the Turkish era listed for outside of the castle. So maybe you saw a Turkish grave marker. --76.111.32.200 (talk) 20:58, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

OK, I found it online: here. The plaque in the ground in front of it has the name of the sculptor (Petri Lajos) and the date (1935). I've been able to get some of the words. "Erdélyi" is "Transylvanian". Székely is a Hungarian enclave in Transylvania. "Huszárok" is hussar. The range of dates has me buffaloed, and what's up with the helmet and the nudity, not to mention the horn? Is it a mythological reference? --Milkbreath (talk) 01:24, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Catcher in the Rye

Where is Holden Caulfield meant to be writing the book from ?? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.5.206.57 (talk) 20:55, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Moved from language desk -Elmer Clark (talk) 21:41, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

It's never made clear. I've heard people suggest that he's writing it from a mental hospital, but I don't feel that there's a whole lot to support that. -Elmer Clark (talk) 21:43, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Supply and Demand

My name is Bob,

I read the supply and demand page, but I'm still wondering, how would a business owner, for example, calculate how much to charge for say, a dozen bananas?

If you would like to contact me

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.113.19.14 (talk) 21:56, 2 June 2008 (UTC)
Sorry, Bob, I removed your email as per the Desk guidelines. See above. 200.49.224.88 (talk) 22:28, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

You don't have to calculate anything - whether as seller nor as buyer. Just push the price until nobody buy it or try to bargain until nobody sells to you. 217.168.1.158 (talk) 23:40, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Are you producer, distributor or retailer? You will find retail pricing in the the last one and check out Production, costs, and pricing, cheers Julia Rossi (talk) 00:11, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

There ought to be a diagram somewhere that has price along the x axis, and profit along the Y axis. Since lower prices mean (in theory, and with some exceptions) more sales but less profit per item sold, and higher prices less sales but greater profit per item, then there is an optimum price that gives the most profit overall. Profit = (number of items sold (price - unit cost)) - overheads.

In practical terms, you'd probably look at the price other grocers were selling bananas at and either sell at the same price, or perhaps slightly less in an attempt to get more sales. Or a higher price for a better quality product. 80.0.108.118 (talk) 00:24, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

The picture isn't quite as simple. You could even have 3 or 4 different prices. The "executive bananas" - hand selected for quality, size and appearance; the exclusive bananas not everyone can afford. The "quality bananas" - the ones you know and love. The "family bananas" - buying in bulk won't make you go broke. The "great bargain bananas" - lowest price around. The funny thing is that they could all be the same bananas, as long as your customers think they are different. Product differentiation Why wouldn't you sell them all at the same price? You might not find enough people who're willing to pay the higher price, but some will. By convincing the buyers there's a difference you can sell to each group at the maximum price they are willing to shovel out. 76.111.32.200 (talk) 20:02, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

I'm with the multi-pricing and competitive comparison mostly. It also depends on your market and demand, and we could be talking niche market here – will you sell bananas in an up-market district where people are willing and expect to pay more (and would have to given your increased overheads in that location) or in a more general location where price scaling applies? Some people believe the price should be the same for everyone, so perceived product differential is important. And if you sell bananas next to a discount chain supermarket, it's important there, too. Julia Rossi (talk) 00:14, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

See Price discrimination for more. Zain Ebrahim (talk) 00:43, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Bob, in Economics, the Supply and demand model is an economic model which is primarily used to explain economic theories and other economic phenomena. For example, it would help an economist predict the impact of a rent ceiling or an agricultural subsidy.

In business, a retailer (or a guy who sells bananas) would price his offering based on some pricing strategy such as Cost-plus pricing. Zain Ebrahim (talk) 00:43, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

June 3

Median population line(s) for Britain

Where would the west-east line lie that has 50% of the population to the north of it, and 50% to the south? And similarly for westerners and easterners. 80.0.108.118 (talk) 00:12, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

According to this source it says Appleby Parva in Leicestershire is the center of population for Britain. In other words, 50% live north, 50% live south, 50% live east and 50% live west. AlexiusHoratius (talk) 01:12, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

The centre of population isn't necessarily the same thing as saying 50% of people live either direction north/south and east/west (as far as I can determine). It takes distance into account, so it is actually the geographical point nearest to all the inhabitants of Britain, on average. Or in other words, if everyone in Britain weighed the same, then the point of balance would be around Appleby Parva. But because Britain is relatively small and densely populated, I think one could probably approximate it pretty well. Rockpocket 01:35, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

It depends on how you define "Britain". Do you mean Great Britain or the United Kingdom (including Northern Ireland)? If you mean just Great Britain, then the north-south median line would be around 52°20' N, to the south of the southern border of the West Midlands metropolitan county. If you are including Northern Ireland, then the line moves a few miles further north to take in the southern fringes of the West Midlands metropolitan county. (This is based on the data at Citypopulation.de .) In either case, the line is more than 15 miles south of Appleby Parva. This is probably because Appleby Parva lies the smallest mean distance from the inhabitants of the UK. While the population of the UK north of Appleby Parva is not quite as large as the population south, the mean distances per person are greater due to the lower population density. This pushes the center of population north of the median north-south line. Because there is less of an east-west skew to the UK population, I would expect that the east-west median line (running north-south through the UK) would be fairly close to Appleby Parva. (While the largest population center, London and the South East, is to the east of Appleby Parva, most other population centers are to the west: the West Midlands, Greater Manchester, Merseyside, most of West Yorkshire, and all of Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland. Unfortunately, I don't have time to perform the calculations to confirm this.) Marco polo (talk) 20:25, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

I'm most interested in the mainland - England, Scotland, and Wales. I'm not certain if the centre of population mass would be the same as the median line or point, in the same way that the arithmetic average is usually not the same as the median average. 80.0.110.206 (talk) 20:49, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

They would not be the same, because a person at a greater distance would shift the center of population further than a person at a smaller distance, since the center of population is the point from which the mean distance for all persons is minimized. The way in which this works mathematically is analogous to the way in which a lever works physically. Marco polo (talk) 00:51, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Pledge of Allegiance

Do American children have to swear the Pledge of Allegiance every day in school, or is it only done very rarely? Isnt it inconsistent with the freedom that Americans go on about a lot? 80.0.108.118 (talk) 00:31, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

When I was in elementary school we did it every day. As for freedom, well, it's been a controversy for awhile (see Pledge of Allegiance criticism), especially the question of the non-religious having to swear that the USA is "one nation, before God", and whether they can opt out of the Pledge without it being socially ostracizing or facing formal punishment. I'm fairly sure they're not allowed to do formal punishment anymore for people who want to quietly opt out. In my day, at some point I stopped saying much of it that I didn't agree with, as I got older (I have never been religious, though it wasn't clear to me that this was exceptional until I got to a certain age). I doubt anybody noticed; when you do something like that every day it becomes rote, you stop paying attention. It was years before I even thought about what the words actually meant (the idea of an indivisible republic is a little abstract for a 6 year old).

As for whether it is inconsistent with freedom—Americans talk about freedom a lot but what they generally mean by that is not very well articulated and thought out. Much of our visions of what it means to be "free" come from WWII-era/Cold War era propaganda about Nazis and Soviets and gosh-isn't-it-great-we-don't-have-the-terrors-here. But of course the US has had many, many periods in which people who said things that weren't considered kosher (of all political points of view; right and left alike) were immediately forced out of public office, out of jobs, out of civic society. No, they weren't killed, except in rare cases, but that's just it—for most Americans, the question of what freedom is, is anything less than murder by the state. Which, when you think about it, is something of a rather low bar to set. Anyway. I digress. --98.217.8.46 (talk) 00:47, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Our school says it everyday. Just remember we aren't actually forced to say it; its not like we would get into any trouble if we didn't and if the teacher were to yell at a student for not saying it the teacher could get into trouble with the parent. I live in a rural area so everybody in my school says it without compaint; it is patriotism. If the student just were to skip saying God there would be no problems. All the problems are just sparked by some atheist that just can't let things be. - MOFILA —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.119.61.7 (talk) 01:15, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Or, conversely, all the problems were sparked by some zealous anti-Communists who thought that having school kids drone on "under God" would somehow make the country better. The Pledge lacked "under God" for most of its existence; the phrase was only added in 1954, at the height of McCarthyism. It's not exactly a neutral sentiment. Personally I think the entire pledge is dubious—it is Orwellian to say the least. Blind patriotism is not something to be celebrated, in my opinion—if patriotism it be, make it committed, honest, heartfelt, not rote, routine, and uncritical. That's bureaucracy, not patriotism. --98.217.8.46 (talk) 01:42, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

One of the jobs of the school under public education is to create good citizens. You can't expect little kids to be able to deal with the ins and outs of politics. Abe Lincoln was honest, and so was George Washington. Don't point out that in saying that you imply that all the others were maybe not so much. Let the little kids feel good about their country and about their piddling participation in its political life. The pledge was just something to be recited, like the intros to the Superman TV show and the Lone Ranger, and we got the words wrong, anyhow. It marked the opening of the school day, like a flag-raising ceremony. That's what it was, a ceremony, and not a contract between the state and its children. Sure, it seems like forced indoctrination, but a child can't be held to a promise he doesn't understand, and nobody expects him to follow through. I think that in my case the whole business served to alert me to the dangers of propaganda. As for freedom, the freedom to talk about the pledge of allegiance any way I want is enough for me. --Milkbreath (talk) 13:08, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

"A thundering horse with the speed of light, under God, a cloud of dust, and a hearty 'Hi-yo, Silver' …" Deor (talk) 18:29, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

No patriot would just let things be when he saw the government undermining his country's highest principles. --Sean 14:00, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, up to a point. The question is what would it take to make you get Old Bessie down from over the fireplace and head for the village green? We hardly feel the death of a thousand cuts after the first few hundred, but we can still scream anyway. --Milkbreath (talk) 18:35, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

By the time I was in high school, too many years ago, I think the pledge was read over the intercom about once a week or so. Nobody cared if you recited along or not. In fact, at that age, most kids (including myself) were too "cool" to be caught saying the pledge. The few kids who proudly pledged out loud were in fact the maverick minority. The silent ones were going along with the crowd, as high school kids are wont to do. —Kevin Myers 14:14, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Comparative cost of American NHS and space exploration

How much would the cost of providing an American health service like that of the NHS in the UK cost, compared to the cost of space race / space explortation. Would it be more, or less? Half as much? Twice as much? 80.2.202.232 (talk) 00:40, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

There are a wide variety of possible space exploration and universal health care programs, but for comparison the Space Shuttle program will end up costing $173 billion (2004 dollars) to fly until 2010, over the lifetime of the program, while providing full coverage for America's uninsured would cost an estimated $34–$69 billion (2001 dollars) per year. Maybe your sister Nell can help with the math.—eric 01:26, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

(edit conflict)Some extremely quick and rough estimates:

The article on National Health Service (England) notes that the Department of Health has a budget of about £100 billion, "most" of which is spent on NHS. So let's assume about £85 billion (about $165 billion). This only covers health care for England, which has a population of about 50 million, about one sixth of that of the US. Multiply by six, and wha-la! a budget of just under $1 trillion. By comparison, NASA has an annual budget of about 17.3 billion, about 1/60th of that. But again, these are extremely rough estimates. --Ybbor^Talk 01:34, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

(ec twice!!) According to the NHS article, the 2008-9 budget is £91.7 billion and "serves" a population of 50.8 million people (£1805/per person or approx $3540). Scaling up to the USA's population of 304 million would suggest a total budget of a little over $1 trillion. That is a very simplistic calculation, but it is more than 60 times NASA's $17.3 billion budget for 2008. Astronaut (talk) 01:35, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Just a note on the apparent conflict of numbers, I imagine much of the conflict between myself/Astronaut and Eric, is that when looking at the budget for NHS, we're taking into account the total cost of health care, while he's taking into account the additional cost from what we already spend. In terms of the space budget, we're each looking at a fiscal year, while he's looking at the life of a single (very expensive) program. --Ybbor^Talk 01:39, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Perhaps the OP was thinking that if money hadn't been "wasted" on space exploration, then the US could have afforded to set up an American NHS. In fact I think space exploration is pretty good value, and scrapping that avenue of research and exploration would not yield the benefits that it's critics would imagine, whilst (funnily enough) four years of war in Iraq have cost the US economy around $3 trillion.

I also think both mine and Ybbor's estimates are probably on the low side because American health care is generally recognised to be the most expensive in the world.

Astronaut (talk) 01:53, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Yes, I was thinking of that. I was also thinking that the US might save a bit from economies of scale, but I think those benefits start maxing out once you've corsssed well into the tens of millions. In fact since the population density of England (976/sq mile) is far higher than that of the US (80/sq mile), the cost even for identical care would likely be far hihger (since you'd need more local offices to reach the same number of people) --Ybbor^Talk 02:06, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Right Ybbor, the shuttle cost i gave was for development, hardware, and thirty years of missions, while the cost of insuring the uninsured is in America is nowhere near what the cost of a program like NHS would be.—eric 02:00, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

The question of best utilization of government spending is a difficult one. Should we scrap funding of national-parks and state-provided libraries etc in favour of more on healthcare and social-welfare? The US spends a huge amount per-person on healthcare, and the UK public system is far from a shining example of how to provide publically provided healthcare. You have to look further a-field for a more intelligent hybrid of private and public provision. I can't remember the country but it is Sri Lanka or somewhere - one of the smaller nations in the far-east that has the system that many consider to be the best. The space-program seems to be the first thing people want to drop, because they can't tie the spending back to something that benefits the citizens that pay for it. That's a pity because the space-program is hugely important and one of the greatest things that the US does for mankind the world over. 194.221.133.226 (talk) 09:56, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

"the UK public system is far from a shining example of how to provide publically provided healthcare." Could you be more specific about this and give the evidence your beliefs are based on please? While the public health care in France is said to be better when international surveys are done, it is also more expensive. 80.2.204.80 (talk) 14:39, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Question asked, general estimates given. This thread is pretty much done. Remember, Wikipedia is not a soapbox.--Ybbor^Talk 18:09, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Somebody above referred to the "extra cost of providing full healthcare", but that's not actually the case. As you can see above you could probably pay for full healthcare with a total expenditure of about $1 trillion. But right now the US spends more than $2 trillion on healthcare. US healthcare is by far the most expensive in the world. You could provide full healthcare, at the same level as the UK now does, and halve the total US spending on healthcare! How can that happen? Partly it's because the UK health system has fewer resources per person - a UK patient will typically get longer wait times than a US resident (those who can afford it) but a typical US private healthcare organization will also spend 20-30% of its income on non-healthcare related matters. That doesn't mean hospital administration, it means advertizing, legal fees, dividends to shareholders, bonusses to CEOs etc. A typical government healthcare organization spends 1-3% on non-healthcare expenditure. DJ Clayworth (talk) 18:44, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Who owns the copyright to the Gospel song "I'm Going Up Yonder" from 1976?

I am looking to verify the who the copyright owner is to a gospel song from 1975 or 1976 titled "I'm Going Up Yonder". It is not in the Copyright Office online records (nothing before 1978 is listed), and I have done much random internet research. Please help!

Thank you, FierySarai —Preceding unsigned comment added by FierySarai (talk • contribs) 02:52, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

You will need to ask the publisher.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 06:05, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Outlaws of Wild West

Hi to all you guys 'n girls out there. My question is: I've searched all of the pages about famous outlaw's of the wild-west era for one thing:

Once I read (i think it was even in wikipedia!) about an Outlaw who was riding around with another one, when they got spotted by some Gunmen who noticed their ID and hanged them upside down from a tree. The Guys then shot one of the outlaws, killing him, the other one was missed - the Gunmen even hit the rope and the Outlaw dropped to the ground, where he eventually grabbed a gun (or got the chance to grab HIS gun/guns) and shot the few Gunmen (I guess they were vigilantes).

• Correction*: The "Guys" were (90% possibility) Vigilantes, also I can remember it may have happened near the Border of southern States of the USA, or when the two Outlaws went riding towards the Border.

But I can't find the exact article in Wiki, so could someone who REALLY is a crack in these fascinating thing about american history, help me?

P.S.: With "ID" I mean their "IDENTITIES", or "FACES" or "LOOKS" - how they LOOKED like, as you may have heard or read of someone saying "You look familiar, just like a guy I'm searching for!" - maybe really from mughots or short descriptions; not their "PASSPORTS" or something like that (If thats what English-speaking People call an ID; sorry for that mistake, my English is not so well, aber in DEUTSCH ist es einfacher zu erklären.). May be possible that the Article was a FAKE and has been deleted, it was over 1 and 1/2 Years since I read it once.

Thx alot!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.177.218.12 (talk) 15:17, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Sounds more like a Hollywood plot than a real gunfight. I watched a documentary recently that claimed that, in fact, most gunmen were killed by being shot in the back rather than in gun duels. Rather unromantic. Rmhermen (talk) 16:09, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

MythBusters (season 4)#Gunslinger Myths disproved the idea that you can sever a rope with a single bullet (unless you're the Man with No Name of course). Clarityfiend (talk) 16:24, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

The Sharon Stone character in "The Quick and the Dead" has a flashback scene that involves taking a shot at a rope in a similar situation... (more detail would be a *spoiler*), FWIW. -- Deborahjay (talk) 17:40, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

There was no Department of Homeland Security in the Wild West, so "they got spotted by some Gunmen who noticed their ID" makes no sense. Edison (talk) 06:08, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

It's likely the ahem, lawmen might claim they ID'd (pr: aah-deed) them from mugshots on a wanted poster as an excuse to plug'em *sorry* er, string'em up, but I'm writing fiction now... whatever really happened, 84.177, it sounds pretty exciting. Hope you find the source, Julia Rossi (talk) 11:17, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

In MythBusters episode 65 [9] they found that shooting a rope with a pistol does not cause it to part. It would take multiple carefully aimed shots at close range from a rifle. The myth, if not the rope, was BUSTED. Edison (talk) 14:16, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Confederate political parties

Were there any formally-organized political parties in the Confederate States of America? Did Southern Democrats continue to refer to themselves as Democrats, or were there no formal parties? Corvus cornix_talk 18:06, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

While I have no expertise in this topic, these guys have an interesting discussion. It seems as though the confederacy was basically a one-party state for its lifespan. They also discuss some possible issues that might create a partisan divide. Generally though, the south was too worried about fighting a war to get most of its offices filled, let alone organize sophisticated parties to fight elections.

See previous discussion: CSA a one-party state?. --—— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 09:39, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Monarchy of the UK

If a situation arose where a baby was first in line to in inherit the throne, i.e. William died right after having a son, how would the baby give royal assent or perform the state opening of parliament? I know Edward VI did it through a council of regency --Hadseys 19:10, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

The next person in line for the throne and qualified to occupy it would serve as regent until the monarch came of age. See Regency Acts. Marco polo (talk) 19:28, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

That's the current position, but a Regent isn't always the next heir to the throne. The Regency Act 1953 provided for the Duke of Edinburgh to become Regent if the Queen died. Xn4 23:58, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Trying to locate color image of plague doctor

I've found a nice color picture of "Doctor Schnabel von Rom", the plague doctor. The problem is, the only place I found it was on a MySpace page: link. (Update, I found it here too) It is low res. I'd love to track down a larger color image. I don't mind scanning it from a book if someone has a reference. (The image is hundreds of years old, there is no copyright issue). Thoughts? --98.217.8.46 (talk) 19:42, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

It looks like an etching. There probably aren't legit color versions. Corvus cornix_talk 21:15, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

(after ec)Yeah, as far as I know it's an etching or a woodcut. There will be no colour version of that particular image. Though it may be possible to find a later coloured interpretation of the image given it's notoriety, perhaps oil-painted. Wouldn't know where to start looking for that though, I'm afraid. And copyright may be dodgy if at all recent. Fribbler (talk) 23:09, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

It is a copper plate etching from 1656, presumably by an artist named Paulus Fürst (1608 - 1666) of Nuremberg after J. Columbina. --Cookatoo.ergo.ZooM (talk) 23:13, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Does it qualify if you photoshop areas of plain colour undersorry, hit the wrong button behind the etching lines? Julia Rossi (talk) 23:44, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

The original is well out of copyright, so I guess as long as you released the photoshopped image under an acceptable licence then it's god to go! Nes pas? :~) Fribbler (talk) 23:47, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

Well, there seem to be a variety of copies of the same basic image, some in color, some not. Yes, I know one of them is something like an etching (I'm not sure it is, it looks just as likely to be a bad reproduction of something with more detail—the Wikipedia one practically looks photocopied!), but it was not uncommon in woodcuts of that time for them to be hand colored (they weren't exactly large print runs), water colors over the original etching, etc. No, I don't want to color it in myself (and I would need a copy of higher quality anyway to do that, the Wikipedia one is awful). --98.217.8.46 (talk) 00:46, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

The modern decorative print trade has colored more etchings and engravings in the past fifty years than were ever originally colored. We have many illustrations at Wikipedia where the tinting is modern.--Wetman (talk) 04:01, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

June 4

WWII STATISTICS

I understand there was a large number of Christians killed by the Germans in Europe that were Jewish sympathizers. Do you know the numbers? I didn't see any posted for this category.74.237.246.9 (talk) 03:45, 4 June 2008 (UTC)jr

While our Holocaust article does not have a section on Christians, it does note that 2,500 - 5,000 Jehovah's Witnesses were killed for refusing to swear allegiance and that some Catholic priest were labeled homosexuals so they could be confined. Some other Christians were classed as political activists and detained. Dietrich Bonhoeffer is a famous example of a Christian killed by the Germans. Our article notes that Jews made up only 6 million of the 9 to 11 million killed. Rmhermen (talk) 15:28, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Kristian?

In the article "list of Swedish monarchs", there is the following line: "1457-1464 : Christian I of Sweden (Kristian I)". However, the article Christian I of Sweden makes no mention of "Kristian". What is "Kristian" — is it the Swedish spelling of the name, the Danish spelling of the name, the Norwegian spelling of the name, some other alternate spelling of the name (such as an archaic historical spelling), or a mistake?

Also, what is the name "Kristian" in general? I'm guessing it's the standard spelling of "Christian" in some particular languages? Which languages?

—Lowellian (reply) 04:34, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Judging from the interlanguage links to Scandinavian wikipedias: "Kristian" is used in Swedish and Nynorsk. Christian is used in Danish and Bokmål. Icelandic uses Kristján. I found no corresponding pages on the Faroese Wikipedia. (Finnish, not a Scandinavian language, also spells them Kristian). For other languages that spell the name with an initial letter "K", the article on Christian (name) also gives Kristián in Czech, Krystian in Polish, and Keresztély for the Danish kings in Hungarian. ---Sluzzelin talk 05:21, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Kristian is most common in Norwegian (both forms, both Bokmål and Nynorsk), but Christian is also frequently seen. As most (all?) kings with that name have been Danish, their names are usually written Christian in Norway as well. 129.240.49.10 (talk) 09:10, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

In this context, "Kristian" is simply the Swedish spelling of his name.[10] Just to complicate things a bit further, he was born in Germany but Denmark was the leading nation in the Kalmar Union between Denmark, Norway and Sweden. In both Danish and German, his name is spelled "Christian". In Danish, he occasionally also referred to as "Christiern".[11] 83.89.43.14 (talk) 22:43, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

History of South America from 1900-1950

Where can I find information on the history of South America from 1900-1950--Goon Noot (talk) 09:26, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Try here, here, and Category:History of South America. Fribbler (talk) 11:41, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Red=Stop Green=Go

When (and how?) did the Red=stop & Green=Go convention come about? Looking at Traffic lights suggests that it hails from something nautical, but what? -- SGBailey (talk) 09:29, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

See Right of way, which has a nice illustration of why ships would be allowed to go when they see a green light from the other ship -- Ferkelparade π 09:36, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Also see red, which calls attention to its association with blood and fire, and green which is related to the word "grow".--Shantavira|^{feed me} 12:48, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Traffic lights for automotive use came about long after the railroads developed the "red-yellow-green" system. Red has meant stop as long as the ability to relate an action to a color has been around. There is a believe that this has to do with red being the color of blood - but who knows. It is just something embedded into the human DNA. As for the "go" color, the railroads originally used white. That was destined for failure. There are white lights all over that could be mistaken for a "go" light. Also, there is a case where the red lens fell out of a stop light and the driver thought it was white and drove at full speed into another train. So, the railroad adopted green for go because there was plenty of green lenses and it contrasted well with red. Why was there plenty of green lenses? They had been experimenting with green for "caution". So, once the caution light became the go light, they needed another caution color. Yellow was chosen. Well after the railroad had the red-yellow-green system, the first traffic lights were made. The first ones were red-green. Shortly afterwards, the red-yellow-green ones were adopted and, now, are standard. -- kainaw™ 13:17, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

One more important point is that colored lights as railway signals were originally only used at night (by day they used semaphores or similar devices) and consisted of a colored glass in front of an oil-lamp flame. (As that article shows, the two devices were normally combined into a single unit.) Later railway signals used colored glass in front of an incandescent light bulb, and so did traffic lights; it's only quite recently that LED signals, which are intrinsically colored, become available. What this meant that a signal color could only be adopted if a suitable color of glass existed. The color also had to be sufficiently distinct from similar colors, and it had to work with an oil flame (which ruled out any strongly blue color). So the use of red and green doesn't come from maritime tradition so much as from the absence of any other available color. There was a specific research project to develop a yellow glass suitable for signals at the time when the railways were realizing they had to abandon white. --Anonymous, 21:51 UTC, June 4, 2008.

There are two aspects to red. One is that it is a color which grabs human attention, universally. Not all cultures have the same recognized number of distinct colors, but if they have words for colors other than "dark" and "light", then the next one is always red. I (and others) suspect this is the relevance of red to blood.

But the other aspect is cultural. It does not necessarily mean "stop"; it means "attention." For this reason it has long been used for street signs, in particular ones as important as "stop". But in other cultures it has different meanings as well—don't get too hung up on things like "green is related to the word grow", that's not the case in all languages. In China "red" has associations with good luck, marriages, summer, and happiness—very different than in the West.

Of course, in one way, the choice of Red and Green for the binary street lights is horrible—Red-green colorblindness means that some 10% of the population has to just remember the position of the lights because they look identical to them, which is quite a lot (if it was red and blue, there would be no problem, for example). --98.217.8.46 (talk) 15:58, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Red-green colorblindness doesn't work that way. Red and green are easily distinguishable from each other. My difficulty is distinguishing close-together shades of red and orange. Imagine an orange light gradually shifting toward red. The point at which it becomes hard to distinguish from a pure red light comes a little bit earlier for me than it does for other people. If traffic lights were red-orange-green, I'd probably be depending on their geometrical arrangement. --tcsetattr (talk / contribs) 20:50, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

There are different types of red-green colorblindness. Some people cannot tell them apart at all; this is not uncommon. Don't generalize your own experience for all others. I had a friend who could not tell red from green whatsoever. --98.217.8.46 (talk) 16:06, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

-- Thanks folk -- SGBailey (talk) 16:44, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Seriously

Why is every country covered in counties, especially in seemingly uninhabited areas? This makes the world seem less natural. And could someone please tell me the furthest land point from any inhabited area (not including Antarctica)? Interactive Fiction Expert/Talk to me 11:03, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

The furthest land point from any inhabited area (not including Antarctica) would be the Arctic. 80.0.100.95 (talk) 00:55, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Well, they're not. Not every country has uninhabited areas, either. And doesn't the fact that countries exist make the world less natural, nevermind counties? What is "natural"? For the second question, does Extreme points of Earth help? Adam Bishop (talk) 11:54, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

ooch edit conflct but Adams right. Your first q cant be answered because it is inaccurate: not every country is covered in counties and your concern, "less natural", is so vague it can't be substantiated or easily answered. However even uninhabited areas are part of countries who do require that their regions need to be looked after and administered by local government even though they interpret that as meaning they should protect or exploit them.Your last question is interesting,but you arbitrarily exclude one continent. I would say north pole leaps to mind but you might not like that either; hopefully the answer you get will be more accurate , subtle and interesting than mine has been, or indeed your question allows. Mhicaoidh (talk) 12:18, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

The North Pole is not on land, though/ Adam Bishop (talk) 13:10, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Extreme points of the world#Remoteness might answer your second question. --Tagishsimon (talk) 12:55, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

It doesn't. Small islands don't count. Only the major landmasses - America, Australia, and "Eurafriasia" - count. Though it might be on an island (a relatively large one only). —Preceding unsigned comment added by IntfictExpert (talk • contribs) 13:13, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Well, if you are counting large islands, then you have to count the largest: Greenland. The furthest land point from any inhabited area on a large landmass other than Antarctica (if that accurately summarizes your criteria) would certainly be a point on the Greenland Ice Sheet in north-central Greenland. The exact location of the point would depend on whether you consider the scientific and military base of Nord, Greenland, to be "inhabited". Marco polo (talk) 14:13, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Good point Adam! And the OP has just wiped the place I live off the face of the earth so I guess I can't help here! Mhicaoidh (talk) 21:21, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Here in Ontario, the province is divided into different types of entities, essentially according to the population density. See List of Ontario counties. There are "single-tier municipalities", mostly called cities, such as Toronto; "regional municipalities" such as Niagara Region; "counties" such as Wellington County; and, in the sparsely populated parts of Northern Ontario, huge "districts" such as Kenora District. It's not all just counties. --Anonymous, 22:00 UTC, June 4, 2008.

There are no counties in Alaska or Louisiana. Corvus cornix_talk 23:10, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Luitpoldarena & Luitpoldhalle, Nuremberg

My query, posted on the Discussion page for Nuremberg, is about these two structures named for Luitpold, Prince Regent of Bavaria. -- Thanks, Deborahjay (talk) 11:25, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

There is a bit on them here, if that helps. And on the same page in the .de wikipedia. Fribbler (talk) 11:30, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

sales promotion

is there any relationship between ethical issues in sales promotion and consumer confidence in a product or service?

mohammed kamil farid —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.87.83.248 (talk) 14:35, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Hugo Chavez's image

Hi, I would like to know what Hugo Chavez's image is like to the people of Venezuela —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.152.221.179 (talk) 14:41, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Did you read Hugo Chávez and other relevant articles (such as Media representation of Hugo Chávez and Presidency of Hugo Chávez)? I think those should give you some idea of how he's seen by the citizens of Venezuela. -- Captain Disdain (talk) 15:03, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Operation Orchard

I was wondering if anyone could hazard a guess as to why the IDF risked sending in large numbers of men (4-8) and a number of aircraft including F16s and F15s undisclosed ELINT and tanker aircraft in Operation Orchard.

It seems clear that the mossad had a man on the inside that gave precise coordinates of the nuclear facility in Syria. With this information would it not have been safer to use cruise missiles to do the job instead of risking planes being shot down and having to have search and rescue teams in a hostile country. A spy satellite or the man on the ground could have given BDA.

The range was not that far in terms of the Tomahawk and a salvo of 10 or less could have destroyed the buildings causing the Syrians to panic and bulldoze the area?? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.17.35.174 (talk) 17:14, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Just a guess, but perhaps the Israelis wanted to show the Syrians that their airspace could be penetrated. This sends a strong signal to Syria and other countries in the region (I'm thinking specifically of Iran, which I believe has similar air defenses). GreatManTheory (talk) 17:26, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

I really don't think you could even come close to comparing the air defences of Syria with Iran. If Iran was as badly defended as Syria surely they would have been bombed by now? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.17.35.174 (talk) 17:57, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I remember hearing that the two countries had relatively similar air defense capabilities. Moreover, as far as I know Syria had what was considered fairly advanced air defenses, so it's nothing against Iran to compare the two. As for your contention that Iran would surely have been bombed, I believe that's the point--so easily defeating Syria's air defenses tells Iran that it is vulnerable to this sort of attack, hopefully (from Israel's point of view) dissuading Iran from engaging in anything that seriously rocks the boat. GreatManTheory (talk) 19:59, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

As far as I know, Israel has no Tomahawks. Only the US, the UK and Spain have some. And those last two have only 60. GoingOnTracks (talk) 06:41, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Court and Constitution

Is it possible to challenge a state constitution law as against the constitution of the US and ultimately overrule it? E.g. 26 states in the US. have outlawed marriage between a same-sex couple. Isn't it possible for a couple to go to the US supreme court and put charges against their own state's constitution because of that? If it is possible what prevents them to do that? Thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Nyeditor (talk • contribs) 20:22, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

To your initial question, it's entirely possible. The US Supreme Court can (and has) nullified portions of state laws and constitutions. However, the USSC does not hear initial cases, known as original jurisdiction, (so a couple can't just go to the USSC)* and is under no obligation to hear appeals that have reached their level -- so that's the prevention, such as it is. — Lomn 20:42, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

*Exceptions exist, but not that apply to this sort of example. See the article above for details. — Lomn 20:44, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

So in what way can an individual resist the tyranny of the state? I mean take for example Lawrence v. Texas, that was initiated by an average couple. So, why not such a scenario is probable in the case of same-sex marriage? Is it possible for a group of lawyers across the country to take the case to the US supreme court? Is this also considered original jurisdiction? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Nyeditor (talk • contribs) 22:11, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Barry Goldwater's Eligibility For U.S. President.

To be eligible to serve as president of the U.S. you must be a natural born citizen or living at the time the constitution was adopted. Barry Goldwater was born in Phoenix, AZ 01-01-1909 and Arizona was not admitted to the union until 02-14-1912 so does that not prevent his serving as president???? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.242.73.38 (talk) 21:16, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

See[12] a NY Times articleand [13] a Washington Post article on this topic. In Goldwater's case, opinion was that being born in a territory which later became a state was good enough to be "natural born." The Puerto Rico Herald [14] considered whetner someone born there would be "natural born" enough to become U.S. President and says that perhaps the "statutory American citizenship" Puerto Ricans gained in 1917 would make one eligible to be U.S President. The article considers other scenarios. Surely there has been a law review paper on this. As in December 2000, it could all boil down to what the Supreme Court thinks, and we all know how that can work out. Edison (talk) 21:54, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

There's no requirement that the territory later become a state. John McCain was born in the Panama Canal Zone, then a U.S. territory, but now part of Panama, never a state. Legal opinion is near unanimous that he qualifies for the presidency. --D. Monack | talk 22:09, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Legal opinion of five members of the Supreme Court is all that is required, although I suppose the Senate could find someone ineligible despite the Supreme Court's findings. [15] is an article by John Dean who discusses a law review article on the topic. One interesting tidbit: a child of a foreign diplomat could be born in the U.S. but not be eligile to become President. Edison (talk) 22:15, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

And likewise being born outside the US is not an exclusion. Even If McCain had been born in territory completely unrelated to the US, to US parents, he would still be natural born. See previous discussion of this. DJ Clayworth (talk) 17:32, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Also, being alive at the adoption of the Constitution has nothing to do with it and doesn't exempt you from the "natural born citizen" requirement. There is some speculation that that clause was included to specifically prevent Alexander Hamilton from becoming president. --D. Monack | talk 22:21, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

If you are born outside the U.S. to American parents, you are a citizen. United_States_nationality_law#Acquisition_of_citizenship --Nricardo (talk) 03:27, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Yes, but that's where the question as to the precise meaning of "natural-born" comes into play. — Lomn 03:49, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

I'm not sure why it should. Was jus sanguines considered the law of the land at the writing of the Constitution? --jpgordon^∇∆∇∆ 14:26, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Inventor of Lie Detector -- atomic bomb security?

On p. 107 of Now it can be told, a history of the Manhattan Project written by General Leslie R. Groves (military head of the project), it says:

Early in 1946 an additional safeguard was adopted (at Y-12, Oak Ridge)—a lie detector. It was used chiefly on people who had access to the final product (enriched uranium) chemistry building, to make sure no one had taken, or know anyone who had taken, material from the plant. The first tests were carried out under the supervision of the inventor of the instrument, and one of his assistants was retained at Y-12 to conduct tests whenever necessary.

Does he mean William Moulton Marston? Any way to tell? Any guess as to the name of the assistant? (The book doesn't say, and has no real footnotes or anything.) --98.217.8.46 (talk) 23:55, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

According to The Polygraph and Lie Detection the Oak Ridge tests were carried out by Leonard Keeler. Another source is In Search of the Magic Lasso: The Truth About the Polygraph, which says "Following the Manhattan Project, the AEC actually began a polygraph screening program at Oak Ridge in the 1940’s. It was initiated by Leonard Keeler, who was one of the original creators of the physical machine we call the polygraph today, and at the time the foremost polygraph tester." Gandalf61 (talk) 13:54, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Excellent, thank you very much, precisely what I wanted to know. --98.217.8.46 (talk) 14:08, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

June 5

Animal peace

Recently, I saw this on CNN. It was a video of a man walking with his dog, cat, and rat somewhere in Santa Barbara, California. On the video, I saw other people taking videos of everything. I had a feeling they'd be posted on YouTube. I hit the jackpot. In one video, there were two rats with the cat and dog. But on the rest of the other videos, there was only one rat. I'm confused. Are there two rats or just one? What kind of dog is the dog? Do all the animals have names?72.229.139.13 (talk) 02:40, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure you're referring to this video. The dog looks like some sort of Rottweiler mix. The face isn't really wide enough to be a full Rottie. Dismas|^(talk) 03:01, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Could you maybe post a link to the video with the two rats? Then it might be easier to see what's really going on here. Maybe you could email the poster of this video and ask them what they really saw that fateful day. --Richardrj ^{talk email} 07:34, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

I can't remember the video's title or the poster off the top of my head. How could that day be fateful? No one died.72.229.139.13 (talk) 22:52, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

True, 72.229! "Fateful" often does have bad notes, but it can be used like "fated" as destined to happen, turn out, or act in a particular way. This time, you happening to catch the unusual peace footage at that time. : ) Julia Rossi (talk) 02:41, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

I found the poster. He/she goes by the name wanderingwilson. In that poster's video, I saw two rats, a cat, and a dog.72.229.139.13 (talk) 23:17, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Bernau, Germany

A photograph dated 1933 shows Adolf Hitler visiting a formation of uniformed SA holding swastika flags, at "...der Reichsführerschule in Bernau." How might I determine which Bernau this is? A look at their pages here and in the German Wikipedia (a language I don't read) hasn't yielded anything informative. -- Thanks, Deborahjay (talk) 07:04, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Since Bernau bei Berlin is the largest of the towns listed in the disambig page, and since it's close to Berlin, I would have thought it's likely to be that one. --Richardrj ^{talk email} 07:29, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

And in fact the German Wikipedia confirms this, see here. --Richardrj ^{talk email} 07:38, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

I took an overlook at "http://de.wikipedia.org" (what good to BE a German!) and you're right. The "Reichsführerschule" (of the DAF) was located in Bernau so it is clear that Hitler was there. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.177.189.93 (talk) 16:57, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Witch trials in Poland

Hello! I am interested in witch trials, and have contributed to some articles in the subject myself. I think there should be a coverage of cases from alla European countries here on wikipedia. Now to the question. I am stuck now that I have arived to more "unusal" countries (= countries which are less translated into English). Three of those are in particular interest to me now, and I'll divide it into three sections and hope that I'm doing this right.

Does anyone here no anything about the witch trials in Poland? To feel a country have ben "covered", i think there should be about; the first case; the last case; the largest case; and the most well known and famous case. I hope there is someone here who knows and are willing to answer. I have heard about a case in 1775, 1793, and 1811. Does anyone know more about those? Hoping --Aciram (talk) 13:10, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Witch trials in Portugal

Portugal, is, if my information is correct, a country with very few witch trials. but I have heard about the few that did excist; a case in Lissabon 1599, where a groupdof women where burned at Rossi square; a case just a few years after; and one woman burned in Evora in 1626. This is very hard to find anything on, and I would be most grateful if anyone was willing to give me a bit of information about these three cases, or direct me to an English link about these cases. What were the names of the executed, what were the specific charges? I would, of course, also be grateful to know if they were more cases than this! Hopefully--Aciram (talk) 13:17, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Witch- and Vampire trials in Hungary

I have heard, that the witch trials in Hungary often included accusations about vampyrism. I do not know if this is true, but I must admit that sounds very intruiging! There seems to be some information about this on the net, but unfortunately, I cant' speak Hungarian. I have heard, that they were a witch craze in Hungray in 1738. Does anyone here know anything about the Hungarian witch trials? The first time, the last time, the largest trial, and if it was combined vampire trials? I would be most grateful for an answer! I can't ask for anyone to creat an article, of course, but I anyone would wish to do so, i would appreciate the smalest stub! Regards--Aciram (talk) 13:24, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

We have a stub on the Szeged witch trials which mentions vampirism. But see Witchcraft and Magic in Europe, Vol. 5: The Eighteenth and Nineteenth Centuries, at p. 161: "Hungary, moreover, had to contend with vampires, as is apparent from various vampire cases which occurred on the periphery of the kingdom in the first half of the eighteenth century." The citation for this is to Gábor Klaniczay. Xn4 23:30, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Thank you for your answer! I would like to know more about these vampire/witch trials. I can't ask for a description of a case, but perhaps someone can recomend an english speaking site on the net about this? It's hard to look if you have no specific words to google; for example names of the people involved, years and places. --Aciram (talk) 16:29, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Recruitment of executioners in the United States

I made a question on Talk:Capital punishment in the United States. How do federal and state governments in the United States recruit executioners for capital punishment? Are they recruited from prison officers? Do they receive special training? /Yvwv (talk) 13:40, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

aside from the controversy involving those who have taken the Hypocratic oath participating, I don't know anything about how they are choosen. From [16] here] I found a little detail: "Seventeen death penalty states require physician involvement and all practicing jurisdictions employ medical personnel...lethal injections are administered remotely..." Rmhermen (talk) 18:56, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

consequences of one party state.

over the year analyst have fear that Nigeria might become a one party state,what could be the consequences effect on the Nigeria comtemporary society? Riel. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.254.189.64 (talk) 13:51, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

If you phrased your question slightly less like it was direct from a homework/assignment you'd probably get a better response. Suffice to say consider the key words/phrases used in the question and focus on them. Nigeria itself isn't important because the overall themes would be expected to be the same regardless of the specific nation - though showing some understanding of historic political culture in Nigeria within your answer may help. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.221.133.226 (talk) 14:15, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Wikipedia articles to read: Nigeria (Nigeria article on Italian Wikipedia), Politics of Nigeria (English only) and Single-party state (English only). I disagree with 194.221.133.226 - I think the specifics of the Nigerian situation are going to have to be in your answer. Nigeria has had a lot of trouble getting democracy going and there have been corrupt and brutal regimes in recent memory; this probably affects (in both directions) how much people are willing to push for political changes and what kinds of compromises look good. Have a look at Ibrahim Babangida, Moshood Kashimawo Olawale Abiola, Sani Abacha and Olusegun Obasanjo as well as Human rights in Nigeria. WikiJedits (talk) 19:06, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Poem analysis?

Hello everyone. I asked this first at the Language desk and they told me to ask here: Would it be okay (and helpful to me :) if I put up a poem here for analysis? It's not homework or anything, I just want to know what it's about ^^. (If this is absolutely not the place for such a thing, please tell me where I can go to get some help!) Thanks in advance, Kreachure (talk) 21:48, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Is it possible you can post a web link to the poem? Inserting the text of the poem here might not be appropriate for a couple of reasons: copyright, and length. --Tagishsimon (talk) 22:33, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Well, the poem is short, but it's probably copyrighted (not sure really). After looking a while for the page I got it from, the page doesn't exist anymore. The only place I could find it is in (oh boy...) a Harry Potter message board. (Well, that was depressing!) If you find that less cumbersome than posting it here, then be my guest (otherwise if someone wants me to post the poem please tell me!) Anyways, will you help me out? Kreachure (talk) 22:53, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

The only poem I could find at the Harry Potter link is a short exerpt from Wordsworth's "The White Doe of Rylstone". I don't have access to the full poem, and don't know it well enough to comment further. ៛ Bielle (talk) 01:10, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

(ec) The title, Phoenixology (Phoenixologie), is from the third film in Cocteau's Orpheus trilogy, Testament of Orpheus, according to one Anne-Michèle Fortin. It refers to the poet's multiple resurrections in the story. She says "Cocteau calls phoenixology the science which allows him who controls it to die and return to life at will."

As for the poem, it's pretty arcane. It's also in English, which means it's been translated from French, so for my money all bets are off when it comes to interpreting it. I was unable to find it in French on the Web. A wild stab at it as it stands: The first stanza is a mish-mash of images and references, the tight-lipped dream life and the rest its conversion in death, the mirror image of life. The second stanza is weird. I think he was having a go at somebody he knew, some actress, I'll bet. The twelve young soldiers surely refer to something specific that I'm unaware of. I really like the last stanza. He is trapped within corporeal existence, choices matter, a refutation of MacBeth's depressing dusty death, a stony one of his desiring in Les Baux. I'd sure like to see the original. --Milkbreath (talk) 01:14, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

I think Milkbreath and I were looking at different poems at the link. This is what I saw:

"I am no Traitor," Francis said,

"Though this unhappy freight I bear;

And must not part with. But beware;--

Err not by hasty zeal misled,

Nor do a suffering Spirit wrong,

Whose self-reproaches are too strong!"

"The White Doe of Rylstone" by W. Wordsworth ៛ Bielle (talk) 01:25, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Right, same thing happened to me at first. The Cocteau thing is also here. --Milkbreath (talk) 01:40, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

That would be because I put it there (some time after). So yeah, it's Phoenixology (I warned you that link would be cumbersome!). And I, too, would love to see the original (especially after all the trouble I went through to find the poem at all). Kreachure (talk) 02:00, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Well, um... I guess I'll have to do with just one interpretation. :P Thanks. Kreachure (talk) 14:44, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

June 6

Why does Sikhism require men to have the last name Singh and women to have the last name Kaur to be equal?

I'm a Muslim that have interest in Sikhism. Is having the last name Singh or Kaur removes their caste or social status? Does it makes Sikhs equal? Jet (talk) 00:02, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Traditional legal practice that makes Sikh women equal to the men (same status). In the article Kaur, it explains that it's a compulsory middle or last name for women Sikhs as Singh is for men. It means "Princess" or "Lioness". Not a family name, but is "the final element of a compound personal name or as a last name". Hope this helps, Julia Rossi (talk) 02:21, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

There are many kinds of equality, but for practical purposes what this sharing of names seems to achieve is essentially a very public bond of shared interests. And although it runs against the teachings of the Sikh Gurus, many Sikhs are actually divided into the equivalent of castes. Xn4 14:12, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Book search

Not having much luck, so thought the infra-minded deskers might. Looking for a small book on arguments from the Talmud. It might have been called "Five (?) Arguments from the Talmud" (in English, about 10 years ago). At the time I couldn't afford to buy it so quickly flicked through it and now can't refind it on the net. Contents included setting out and explaining arguments from authority, tradition, scripture, precedent and I forget the other (unless it was only four). And if someone knows what that list is, would be helpful. Thanks, Julia Rossi (talk) 02:33, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Is this it? The Talmudic Argument: A Study in Talmudic Reasoning and Methodology has the dimension of 8.5 x 5.4 x 0.7 inches and was published in 1984. Not sure though since I'm unfamiliar with the field but I hope this will remind you of something.--Lenticel ^(talk) 03:48, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Thanks Lenticel, a good find – it's put me on a trail to some libraries here. Somewhere said it was orange, so I should add the other was creamy yellow, though the price is about right (~=>*hand above head*) – must be very obscure or limited release, Julia Rossi (talk) 05:28, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Native Americans

I need information on how the Native American's treat their elderly. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.240.106.66 (talk) 08:04, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Do your own homework. You know, though, you might really want to know which nation you mean, and then which tribe you mean, as well as which period of history you're aiming at. Geogre (talk) 12:01, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Yep. Your question implies that they are a monolithic block, when in reality, there are many nations and tribes, thus many traditions and customs. Even the use of Native American is not universal and can be controversial. See Native American name controversy. --—— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 19:17, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Links Between Secularism and Islam

Possible links ?

• Averroes was a major muslim philosopher who is said to be the pioneer of secular thought in Europe

• Islam (sunnism) is secular because it has no clerics
• Islam (submission) subjugates faith and reason.
• Islam has embraced multiculturalism because it is a network of clans and tribes
• Islam views itself as inherently democratic as being itself the Ummah.

See Turkey as well —Preceding unsigned comment added by Steelersfan7roe (talk • contribs) 18:06, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

69.157.232.25 (talk) 12:37, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

And your question is ... ? --ColinFine (talk) 18:29, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Creating a fake history for a viral campaign

Hi there Im looking to create a fake history for our viral campaign. We are creating a dance event in the uk which is based on the venue being built on an old mental asylum. Permisson has been granted by the club for us to do this, we would like to add a wiki page explaining about this asylum and the projects that happened there. The Event is called the Advokate Project and is based on doctors testing on patients to create a super soldier in the world wars. The Doctors used many different methods including the paranormal. Unfortunatly this all went wrong and the patients became possessed, shortly after the asylum burnt down. We will say it was exactly 100 years ago, with there being paranormal activity escalating over the past few months within the venue. That is a brief overview of the story, but we are wondering if it is ok to put something like this up so people believe it. I understand that you look for factual information but this is for viral promotion and need to know what the rules are on this. Hpe you can help

Regards

Advokate project team —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.240.200.252 (talk) 13:13, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Are you asking if you can create a Wikipedia page containing a fake history of a building in order to support a dance event? If so, then the answer is no. The rules on using Wikipedia for promotion are "You're not allowed to do it". If you're asking whether you can create another website somewhere to support the event, feel free. DJ Clayworth (talk) 13:17, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

And I might add that (IMHO) viral marketing of this kind is extremely silly anyway. --Richardrj ^{talk email} 13:51, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Buy some server space, then buy up a bunch of cheap webdomains and have them point to different directories. Make two that look like serious academic pages, but make another look like a total crackpot conspiracy page. Make the first two talk about experiments and say that none of them were successful, make the last one say they were successful and the government is hiding it and etc. It'll be more believable if you subdivide the conspiracy into multiple pages like that, in my opinion, because in real life it would be obvious that something was up if the "official" pages talked about all sorts of crazy shit and nobody noticed. Get the web design right and it doesn't matter a whole lot what the content is. As a (very complicated) example of a "fake history" website, there's none better that I know of than Boilerplate. --98.217.8.46 (talk) 14:06, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Thesis

What would be the thesis that diplomatic immunity should not be used to protest the diplomats when committing a crime? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.30.202.29 (talk) 14:44, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Have you read our comprehensive article on diplomatic immunity?--Shantavira|^{feed me} 16:15, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Christians

the christians in Lebanon and Syria are called the Maronite, but what about the christians in Palestine and Jordan? What are they called based on their beliefs? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.30.202.29 (talk) 14:45, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

• Some are called Roman Catholic, some are called Eastern Orthodox, depending on what they are. (One of my favorite couples is Palestinian; she's Catholic, he's Orthodox.) --jpgordon^∇∆∇∆ 15:19, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

The Maronite Church is one of a subset of Catholic churches (along with the Roman Catholic Church, the Armenian Catholic Church, the Byzantine Catholic Church -- I believe that there are 5 in total). Each church's Patriarch (or, "pope" in the case of the Roman church) traces his ecliastical ancenstry back to one of the original 12 apostles. Most Roman Catholics are taught that the Pope is the head of the Catholic Church. In fact, he is head of the Roman Catholic Church and considered "first among equals" among the five(?) Patriarchs. Wikiant (talk) 15:54, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

See Palestinian Christian for a good list of the many different denominations. --98.217.8.46 (talk) 15:56, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Not all Lebanese Christians are Maronite, though it is the largest group in that country. Christians in the Middle East belong to five broad groupings of churches:

1. Greek Orthodox (called Rūm Orthodox in Arabic) are the largest group, use Arabic (and some Greek) in their worship and are in communion with the Eastern Orthodox churches in Greece and beyond. There are Patriarchs of Antioch, Alexandria and Jerusalem.
2. Oriental Orthodox are a group of churches that broke with the Greek Orthodox in the fifth century. Each church uses its own language. They are the Syriac Orthodox Church (using Syriac), Armenian Apostolic Church (using Armenian) and the Coptic Orthodox Church (using Coptic). There are other Oriental Orthodox churches in Ethiopia and India.
3. Church of the East is a church that's strong in Iraq and uses Syriac as its liturgical language.
4. Catholic churches are numerous throughout the Middle East too. Some people are Roman Catholics, belonging to the Catholic mainstream (called Latīn in Arabic). However, there are semi-independent Catholic versions of all of the above churches: Greek Catholics, Syriac Catholics, Armenian Catholics, Coptic Catholics and Chaldean Catholics (from the Church of the East tradition). The Maronites kind-of fit in here too, as they are Catholics, but are a historically independent group using Syriac as their liturgical language.
5. Protestants are not so numerous in the Middle East, but there are some small churches.

I hope that makes things a little more clear. — Gareth Hughes (talk) 16:59, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Ph.D. thesis at a trade press?

I'm still some time off from finishing my Ph.D. thesis in History but I think it's probably a topic of sufficient general interest that there would be a chance that a trade press (like Knopf or FSG or Norton) would want to pick it up (and I write clearly enough and without excessive jargon for the transition to not be too painful). But I'm wondering if that would be perceived as a bad thing by prospective academic faculty hiring committees. Obviously the audience for both types of presses is different, and that would naturally necessitate being written a bit differently, but let's assume all other things being equal, and no intellectual rigor has suffered from being turned into a trade book, would it be terribly horrible to one's potential academic career to do such a thing? Am I totally wrong in assuming that the trick with trade books is to write clearly, not that one has to "dumb down" the text (as many academics seem to think is the case—and end up writing very poor trade books)? Any thoughts? --98.217.8.46 (talk) 16:15, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Some thoughts: on aiming at your target audience, I agree, clear communication is everything. The best kind is to be able to explain complex ideas in clear language without insulting them. Dumbing down implies patronising the reader and I think it does. Afaik, getting it published as PhD dissert would come first, then approaching a publishing house. As for reflecting on you, ground would have been broken by people like David Starkey and others who get into mass communication. When you say "trade" press, do you mean as a text book or for other historians? I'd talk the kind of people you feel might affect your prospects; and ask some professors. They'd probably give feedback to someone who hasn't crossed their desks as yet – you can then sift it through. Mike Dash (PhD in Naval history) wrote Tulipomania published by Gollanz and he's got a user page here. Julia Rossi (talk) 02:18, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

and a cheerful set of contributions! - some displacement activity; mind you those brief descriptions are intriguing...the man's obviously a talented writer... I'm just going to have a brief look at those entries... and I may be gone for some time... Mhicaoidh (talk) 09:38, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

In my cynical experience, academic dissertations should have as much waffle and as much jargon in them as possible in order to get high marks. If you follow normal rules of good style such as being concise and avoiding jargon (eg using the word "story" instead of "narrative") then you get a pooorer assessment. 80.2.197.210 (talk) 11:47, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Count of population

What's the best way to count the population of a nation? and how ? explain with much details? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.64.91.147 (talk) 18:27, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Try Census and demographics. Most/all of what you need should be in there. Fribbler (talk) 18:38, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

wittgenstein on popper

Hi, I seem to remember reading in an article in the Guardian Weekly that Wittgenstein criticised Popper simply because his philosophy wasn't merely footnotes to Plato, on the (apparent) assumption that all good philosophy was in fact just that. Have I got this right, because I can't find it by googling, or could it have been someone else levelling the charge at Popper? 203.221.126.3 (talk) 18:42, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

You are correct. Fribbler (talk) 18:47, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

That's a gripping story, but it doesn't seem to support 203.221.126.3's memory of what Wittgenstein may have said about Popper? The only mention of Plato is ascribed to Wasfi Hijab. Xn4 23:06, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Ah. On careful reading it was indeed Hijab. Fribbler (talk) 23:10, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for those answers. I think I actually came across that article googling, but only read the bit about Plato, and moved on. It may have been the actual article that I read in the first place. Even so, if anyone can add to this, I would appreciate it, since it may throw further light on the subject. But presumably I had just misremembered the article. 203.221.127.200 (talk) 17:25, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Presiddential Term of Office

Under the Constitution, the President can only serve two elected terms. If, after serving those terms, is he or she able to sit out a term and serve again? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.183.124.245 (talk) 19:43, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

From the article Term limits in the United_States: The Twenty-Second Amendment states that "no person shall be elected the the office of President more than twice..." So since serving a third term, whenever that may be, means being elected more than twice, then it can't be done. Fribbler (talk) 19:49, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

And the common follow-up question... He cannot be Vice-President either because he cannot be in a position to immediately become President. Now, if he get a cool shiny robot body and ceases being a person, can he be re-elected? -- kainaw™ 19:53, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Of course that was President Of Earth, so a different office entirely :-) Fribbler (talk) 19:55, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Any two-term President could be Vice-President. However, if the President died, resigned, impeached, etc., the VP would be ineligible to accede to the Presidency and it would go to the Speaker of the House. I'm assuming the second question refers to Futurama; we wouldn't know until it is brought to the Supreme Court. ~~

Really? What if there was less than 2 years left when (s)he was VP? Cause a VP can serve for up to 2 years if the president dies and still get elected for two full terms, no? --Wirbelwindヴィルヴェルヴィント (talk) 20:36, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

The 12th amendment states, "no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States." A two-term President is constitutionally ineligible to the office of the President, which is why I feel that he cannot be Vice President. -- kainaw™ 20:36, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

That's the generally accepted interpretation, but the actual wording makes it unclear — it makes you wonder, or it makes me wonder anyway, what on earth they were thinking of when they drafted the 22nd amendment the way they did. See 22nd Amendment#Interaction with the Twelfth Amendment. --Anonymous, 22:12 (yes!) UTC, 2008-06-06.

501(c)3 and State Universities

Is a state university (particularly in Ohio) a 501(c)3 organization? The 501(c) article is a little vague on the subject, and it seems that the foundation that supports scholarships and so forth at my university is one, but I'm not clear on if the university is. Thanks! Cigarette (talk) 20:01, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

I doubt that location makes any difference in relation to tax-exempt status. The 501(c)3 is a federal classification which is offered to organizations dedicated to, for example, education. Not only is the 501(c)3 classification designed to help educational organizations spend money most effectively, but it would also be awkward for the federal tax system. If state universities would be obligated to pay sales tax, their operating expenses would rise dramatically, thus requiring additional federal funding, which would in turn come from the money they had just paid in taxes. As you could imagine, this makes a very ineffective financial cycle. My local university is a 501(c)3 organization, as evidenced by [17] .

If you are in a legislative mood, please read [18] for more concise information. Freedomlinux (talk) 21:00, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Printers' current practice in their relationship with authors

It used to be, when an author had created a writing - a fiction or non-fiction work - that he/she would submit an handwritten (a long time ago), or a typewritten (not so long ago) or a computer printed facsimile of his Work. I should like to know what the accepted practice is to day among the leading printers, if there is a commonality of practice. I take it that, today, every writer or would-be writer uses a computer and a printer. Would an author still send a printed set of pages to editors of his choice or would he simply send a CD, or, if his computer is old, a set of diskettes? Would the author have to go through an agent and if so, what would he send him ? Perhaps he is expected to do both or something else yet? Wildhobo (talk) 21:35, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

First off, the writer would need to approach a publisher rather than a printer. Most publishers will accept manuscripts in a variety of formats, and they will often specify what they want on their website. Sometimes their requirements are very specific, e.g. that you must supply the manuscript in Microsoft Word format, but most are more flexible than that. Also most publishers will not have the time to read an entire manuscript from an unknown author; they prefer to receive a synopsis of the book and a sample chapter only. They can then assess whether they want to see more and perhaps suggest improvements at that stage. Some writers hire a literary agent who understands the market and knows which publishers are most likely to be interested in that particular book. The agent can also advise the writer on editing matters, which fewer publishers are willing to do these days. Beware of vanity publishers. If your book is worth publishing, you will not need to pay a publisher in order to do so.--Shantavira|^{feed me} 06:54, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Shantavira's advice is quite right, but doesn't discuss format - I get the impression you may have a text you wish to distribute to publishers/agents who you hope may be interested. As Shant said a synopsis and up to three chapters is standard, and in terms of format check what each wants but generally a printed manuscript and equivalent on a CD is standard - not many firms like emails with attachments unless you are known to them. However most of these submissions are doomed never to be looked at. What is much better is to arrange a meeting directly with the publisher to discuss the project and what they are interested in. They have a business plan and you need to make your self part of it. This is where agents can be very handy, they have an existing relationship and can get you in the front door, at a price.

Shant and myself have both assumed that your original question meant publisher rather than printer, but if indeed you did mean printer, just remember that printing is the easy part! Distribution and sales are very, very difficult to achieve on your own. Mhicaoidh (talk) 09:18, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Plato's Allegory of the cave

What is the meaning of Plato's allegory of cave? --24.193.17.140 (talk) 22:25, 6 June 2008 (UTC)Abrar Ahmed

As with many allegories, there just isn't a definitive answer to that question. But see Allegory of cave#Interpretation. Xn4 00:00, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Hmm, looking at the article, I think the lead section should include a brief mention of the meaning/interpretations/issues-raised. Fribbler (talk) 00:04, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Josephus and the dance of the seven veils

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Please clarify what seems to be an error on the page describing the dance of the seven veils.

Wikipedia states that Josephus provided a name for the stepdaughter of Herod Antipas (correct) and also provided the name of the dance she performed before Herod.

This makes the reader assume Josephus named the dance "the dance of the seven veils".

In reading Josephus I could NOT find where he names the dance.

Where does Josephus name the dance, as you claim on that Wikipedia page, and what did he say its name WAS?

Thank you. 71.111.153.129 (talk) 22:23, 6 June 2008 (UTC)J. Salkieldt

Looking at chapter XVIII of Antiquities of the Jews, it seems to me (as it does to you) that Josephus does not name the dance. And of course he has no reason to mention Salome anywhere else. Xn4 23:54, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Tracing this back through the history, it appears that at some moment there was a true statement: "Details enriching the story in later Christian mythology include providing a name for the dance, and describing the purpose of the dance as being to inflame King Herod with incestuous desire so that he would treat John as she wished". Another correct statement was added: "The historian Josephus gives the stepdaughter's name, Salomé". These two statements were coupled in a very ambiguous way: "The historian Josephus gives the stepdaughter's name, Salomé and other details ..."). This was next misinterpreted, and edited to be unambiguous, but in the wrong interpretation: "The historian Josephus lists the stepdaughter's name as Salomé and provides other details ...".  --Lambiam 05:57, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

June 7

Nguni Use of space and acquisition of territory in the nineteenth century

Does anyone know about the way migrating Nguni (especially Zwangendaba) conceived of space and used territories in the nineteenth century southern Africa. Possible answers might refer to ways of territorial acquisition, the meaning of public and private space, etc. References will be well appreciated. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ndzesop (talk • contribs) 00:48, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Why should I keep my father's surname if I change my name to a Arabic/Muslim name?

I was thinking about changing my name to Abdullah Muhammad Ahmad. I'm using Abdullah Muhammad Ahmad as my pseudonym. But some other Muslims say I can't drop my surname (change it). It's orthodox to retain the surname but unorthodox to replace it. I rather go with the unorthodox way because it too have to say to some people, uncommon, and adoption of religion/culture purposes. I have a long last name with 10 letters. Writing and spelling is like this: C*o*a*a*d*. I may want to adopt a Arabic/Muslim because I'm Muslim and Arabic is important in my religion. My family is from Thailand where one one family can use a given last name so the last name I'm having is too long. I'm the only Muslim in my family. My family are all Buddhists. I would like the family to adopt a new last name (surname) since we may have that surname that is too long. My future family will be "Muslim". This is like Arabization to my family because of the Arabic/Muslim surname. Should I keep my surname or I have choice to change it? Note: I am not asking for legal advice. I just want simple answers. Jet (talk) 05:14, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

I doubt there is a factual answer for your question. Changing your name appears to be a matter of personal preference based on, in your case, religion, culture and family. Whichever you choose is a statement to your family and others of what is most important to you. Before you decide, you might consider that your children may have the same options, both in choosing a religion and in choosing a name. What you do now may set a standard for what you expect of them and for what your actions establish as permission for their choices. ៛ Bielle (talk) 06:30, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

After a recent court case in California, the husband can take the wife's surname there. If you are unmarried and plan to marry someone with an Arabic surname there, that'd work. User:Krator (t c) 07:09, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Why is a ten-letter name too long? What's wrong with "Washington" and "Eisenhower"? If your name was Pichaironnarongsongkram, I'd sympathize. Surnames are a recent invention. In the Islamic Golden Age Muslims did not have surnames, and a notion that changing one's surname goes against orthodox Islamic teaching must be based on a misunderstanding.  --Lambiam 07:43, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Absentee ballot

I'm going to be at school in NC during the election this november but since I'm a CT resident and I'm (about to be) registered in CT I won't be able to vote there. I know I would need to do an Absentee ballot, but I have no idea how to do something like that and could use some instructions if someone has them. Thanks :). Chris M. (talk) 06:13, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

This webpage of the Secretary of State of Connecticut contains information about absentee ballots, including links to application forms. A phone number you can call for information is 1-800 540-3764.[19]  --Lambiam 07:54, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Thank you. Chris M. (talk) 17:34, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Stock exchange and share things

I just turned 18 and I really wanna start putting small amounts of money on the stock market and turning it into large amounts :P. How do I go about buying shares firstly and which shares are the best ones to buy?

First of all, try reading the Efficient market hypothesis article. This suggests that it is practically impossible to predict or forecast the market or individual shares - or else (I think) you need a PhD in maths or statistics to do so after a lot of research. So if you want to invest, choosing shares at random is as good a method as any, or you need very high levels of skill, experience, or luck. In other words, it is practically impossible to know which shares are the best ones to buy. But apart from that, buying a set amount of shares every month would probably suit you - I do not know what specific investment products are available. Of course, investment businesses of various kinds spend a lot of advertising money trying to convince people that the EMH is not true.

On the other hand, there are some market anomalies (a too brief article - see http://www.investorhome.com/anomaly.htm instead) which could be exploited perhaps. High yield is another one. 80.2.197.210 (talk) 11:05, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Formula for price and sales graph line

Generally (with some exceptions) lower prices mean more goods are sold, higher prices mean less sales. If price and sales is plotted on a graph (which may be "chart" in American English), its probably going to be a curve of some sort. Has anyone actually worked out a formula that relates price to number of sales? Yes, I anticipate you may point out that the sales volume depends on many other things apart from price, and it may be difficult to determine the relationship even under experimental conditions. 80.2.197.210 (talk) 10:56, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

This is a basic homework question in economics. See supply and demand for plenty of information on the interaction between price and demand. -- kainaw™ 15:06, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

It is an actual mathematical formula I am after please, preferably one obtained empricably. If its so basic, please be so kind as to tell me such a formula. 80.2.207.208 (talk) 16:08, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Apparently I wasn't clear enough... There is no formula. The creation of a formula is a common homework question. You are given a bunch of price/demand/supply values and asked to draw the graph for that specific instance. Since it is a completely different graph for any product at any point in time, you have a different formula. If, by chance, you happened to read supply and demand, you would easily see how there are common types of graphs/formulas for certain types of products. -- kainaw™ 16:13, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

I did look at the article and also the demand curve article. Cannot see any formula. It is a formula I am after. I have studied economics among other related subjects for a number of years, by the way - I won't dazzle you with my qualifications. In all the decades that economics has been discussed, it seems likely that somebody at least has tried to do an empirical determination of the formula for such a curve - that is what I am after. 80.2.207.208 (talk) 16:21, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

There is no formula. Within limited price range fluctuations, reasonable fits can sometimes be obtained by a formula of the form Demand = C × Price^−E, in which C and E are positive constants. (E for Elasticity.) However, for most commodities there are usually sizable fluctuations in demand all the time even when the price remains fixed, which makes any empirical construction of a formula precarious and of dubious value. A slump in sales after a price raise is often temporary. Demand may even increase when the price is raised because the consumer is inclined to ascribe higher quality to higher-priced goods.  --Lambiam 17:16, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

There is no formula, and yet there is a formula. That's very Zen. Anyone know of any papers that have tried to study the price/demand curve empirically please? (And so, as many other people have noted, the whole edifice of economics is not based on any empirical basis). 80.0.100.139 (talk) 19:58, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Meta-themes of making money

I'm wondering if it is possible to list all the possible ways of making money. In the abstract rather than specific cases. For example money can be made by 1) putting two or more things together to create something with a value greater than the sum of the value of the parts, 2) buying something now which has a higher value in the future, 3).....? What other themes of making money are there please? Buying a lottery ticket might be another. 80.2.197.210 (talk) 11:40, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Don't forget about the value of labor itself. Give me a piece of wood, and it's worthless. If I apply some labor to the wood (carve it into a little statue), suddenly I can charge for it. --98.217.8.46 (talk) 14:29, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

This would be covered by 1) above, as you are putting wood and labour together. 80.2.207.208 (talk) 16:02, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

And don't forget about intellectual property. By carving that wood in a statue of Mickey Mouse it enters into a whole other regime where the labor and the materials are not the only salient aspects to its cost. Personally I don't think there's an easy way to parse out all of the "ways of making money". There are different ways to talk about value itself, which is probably more worthwhile. I think someone has tried that before, though. --98.217.8.46 (talk) 14:30, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

If Das Kapital does provide such a list (which I rather doubt), please could someone point out where it can be found. Thanks. 80.2.207.208 (talk) 16:11, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

I assume that it can be reduced to two possibilities:

1. Take money (or something of value that may be sold for money). For example, stealing.
2. Make the appearance of value and exchange it for money.

The first one is obvious. If you steal something, you can get money - especially if you steal money. The second isn't so obvious. In selling objects, the appearance of value is the object itself. In the labor example above, the labor is the appearance of value. In entertainment, the movie, game, show... is the appearance of value. Even in something like a telephone scam, the scam is the appearance of value that generates money. I just thought of counterfeiting. In that case, the fake money is the appearance of value that is traded either for money or something that may be sold for money. -- kainaw™ 15:04, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

OK, so 3) could be "steal it". But neither of the two comments above include 2), suggesting that there may be other themes also. 80.2.207.208 (talk) 16:15, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

(N+1). Begging.

(N+2). Extortion.

(N+3). Finding lost coins (e.g. under slot machines or in the beach sand).

(N+4). Insider trading.

(N+5). Bounty hunting.

(N+6). Marrying old rich people.

 --Lambiam 17:27, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Thanks. I think begging and marrying old people could be 4) being given money by sympathy or affection; extortion would be 3) stealing it; insider trading would be mostly 2) and in the past was not illegal. Finding lost coins and bounty hunting (is that getting a reward for capturing criminals?) is interesting - could be 5) searching for lost assets. This reminds me of Vladimir Propp's (sp?) narrative morphology. 80.0.100.139 (talk) 20:17, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Question about copyright renewals

Let's say you had a poster from a film that says "Copyright so-and-so Pictures, 1950." The U.S. Copyright Office renewal database the copyright for the film was renewed in 1978 or so. But it doesn't say anything about a renewal of the copyright on the poster itself. Are they one and the same, or is the poster is in the public domain? Is the poster necessarily a derivative work of the film, and thus covered by its copyright renewal? --98.217.8.46 (talk) 14:26, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

spanish sailing ships of the 17th century

Did any spanish fleets sail from Spain to New Spain during the year 1640Thetreasurehunter (talk) 16:06, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Vice President term limit

Can a person who has already served two terms as U.S.vice president serve as U.S.vice president again under another U.S.president? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.251.251.221 (talk) 16:16, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Yes. DAVID ŠENEK 16:52, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Yes. However, if a person has already served two terms as as the President of the United States, he or she cannot be a running mate as a Vice President. Jtg920 (talk) —Preceding comment was added at 20:32, 7 June 2008 (UTC) 20:34, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Medical cost that can be covered by the state

For practical reasons, (I think) the Dutch government must limit the expense that can be paid by the state for an individuals medical assistance to €80,000 per year. Is there a list of these values for other countries? How might they be derived? How does the average "value" of an individual factor in? I suppose it has to do with gross domestic product? Like if a person brought a certain amount of money into the country, it might not be sensible to allow them to pass for a sum below this amount. How does it work? ----Seans Potato Business 16:49, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Oh, no; oh yes.

I watch more BBC America than is good for a body. I keep hearing reference to a sort of catch phrase, seemingly from theater, where one side says something like "Oh, no it isn't!" and the other side says "Oh, yes it is!" One example is in a Monty Python sketch involving Puss in Boots. I just heard it again on "Cash in the Attic". What is the origin of that? --Milkbreath (talk) 17:00, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Pantomime -84user (talk) 17:32, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

O'Rly? Chris M. (talk) 17:33, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

It is a common way for English kids to conduct an argument regarding the factuality of a disputed issue. How do they do this at the other side of the North-Atlantic divide?  --Lambiam 17:35, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

"Uh-huh!" "Uh-Uh!" Wrad (talk) 17:41, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

That's one way. Beyond that, if it the matter is a particularly convoluted issue involving, say, a double dog dare, the one kid's lawyer will call the other kid's lawyer. Or they have a gunfight. --Milkbreath (talk) 17:48, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Are you sure that kids use it that way, Lambiam? It doesn't ring for me (though it's true that I'm not around kids very much). To me it is only the pantomime riff, as 84user said (usually augmented with a 'Look behind you!'). I remember hearing American children on television and films retorting to "It is not!" with "It is so!" and thinking how lucky they were to have a way of doing so: our "It is" sounded weak beside it. --ColinFine (talk) 18:49, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

ontario canada

question: although this township covers alot of ground, the british name means little? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kcron (talk • contribs) 19:29, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

According to our article, the name is derived from a Huron word: ontarí:io, meaning 'Great Lake'.—eric 20:22, 7 June 2008 (UTC)