Talk:George Stephenson

points for any expansion

a) the inventor of the 'Geordie lamp' (and dispute over priority with the Davy lamp b) Chat Moss / Kilsby tunnel

possibly also what GS's loco improvements were, and his difficulty with L&M survey Rjccumbria 06:55, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Legacy

George Stephenson High School, situated in killingworth, North Tyneside is also named after him.

Hydrogen vs Fire Damp

Apropos of nothing, I assume it would be methane. Chevin 15:57, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Yep. I'm using the terminology of the time.--Old Moonraker 16:25, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Business dealings

I believe Stephenson was also accused of being involved in some shady business deals in his time, surely the article should mention this. PatGallacher 00:19, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

If you could perhaps cite what you say with some evidence it might be something an editor looks into. Unfortunately I don't know anything in particular about what you're intimating, and it might be that nobody else does either. Given it has been 3 months since this topic was flagged for a reason I have yet to see evidence on, I am removing the "neutral" flag unless someone can come up with something.--Koncorde (talk) 18:24, 2 February 2008 (UTC)

Family tree?

The page on George Robert Stephenson (engineer) has this little gem:

Stephenson was born to Robert Stephenson Senior in Newcastle upon Tyne. He was born into a great family of civil engineers, his father was engineer of Pendleton Colliery and Nantlle Railway, his elder brother George Stephenson was a prolific railway engineer as were his uncle George Stephenson and cousin Robert Stephenson.

Has anyone got a brief family tree of the Railway Stephensons? I am having trouble telling all the Georges, Roberts and Robert Georges apart! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.171.3.126 (talk) 12:00, 19 May 2008 (UTC)

Reference to Robert Stephenson

The following reference occurs in the article: Robert Stephenson had tried a locomotive on the freight line between Kilmarnock and Troon, in 1815, nine years prior to the Darlington Stockton railway line, however it had proved unsuccessful. Robert was about twelve years old at the time. Is this meant to refer to George? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dposte46 (talk • contribs)

Fixed. Thanks for pointing this out. --Old Moonraker (talk) 11:04, 12 November 2008 (UTC)

HIs life was great —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.172.18.179 (talk) 17:21, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

Word order

"That he invented to grow his cucumbers in" is wrong, citing preposition: "a preposition...precedes its phrase". Perhaps editors have overlooked this, and the name preposition (clue!). Should be reverted, once again, to the correct version from 15 March. --Old Moonraker (talk) 18:37, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

However I don't agree with the version to which the article has been reverted. You can't say 'in which he invented' about the glass tubes. That implies that he was inside the tubes when he made his invention. I have therefore changed the sentence to avoid the use of 'in. Dposte46 (talk) 11:35, 26 March 2010 (UTC)

Looks a bit lumpy, but as a compromise works well.--Old Moonraker (talk) 11:59, 26 March 2010 (UTC)

Geordie theory

This derivation is now labelled a "theory" in the article. My initial response was that the OED doesn't do "theory", only fact. However, the work is quite specific about the lamp so describing the later transfer of the word to Tynesiders generally as "theory" wouldn't directly contradict the source. I suggest, once again in the "spirit of compromise", leaving the new introductory sentence as it is but in the second sentence attaching it just to this bit, thus allowing the distinction. --Old Moonraker (talk) 17:34, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

My attitude to this is that despite what the OED mights say (and I don't think the OED is infallible) there is more than one theory regarding the origin of the word "Geordie" and that there is no concrete evidence to support either. The two main theories seem to be the one regarding George Stephenson's lamp and the one based on the fact that the town of Newcastle stood out against the Jacobite Rebellion of 1745, and in favour of King George. Both theories only seem to be based on anecdotal evidence which is fairly insubstantial. A lot seems to depend on the earliest recorded date in which the term "Geordie" was used. I don't personally favour either explanation, apart from the fact that the earliest use of the term "Geordie" was restricted to people from Newcastle and was only later extended to people from Tyneside. Given that north-east miners were spread all over the region, if they all used George Stephenson's lamp, why would Geordies be restricted to Newcastle? I think that the Wikipedia article on "Geordie" covers the question adequately without coming down on either side. I don't suggest that the idea of George Stephenson giving his name to the Geordies is wrong, but I am concerned that it is not an established fact and I don't think that alternative theories should be ignored. Dposte46 (talk) 20:40, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

The OED (my 1933 anyway) don't claim that the Geordie people derive their name from a safety lamp anyway, merely that it's their term for it. The OED also gives earlier examples of the name being applied to Newcastle people, pitmen and also colliers (ships) from Newcastle.

Probably the best counter-example though is at the Newcastle Lit & Phil, where Davy first demonstrated his safety lamp, and where their records describe the lamp as being demonstrated "to an audience of Geordies" (probably meaning pitmen, more than locals). As Stephenson's and Davy's lamps are close contemperaries, it's unlikely that Stephenson's lamp could have been influential in any change of name by then. Andy Dingley (talk) 20:59, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

I am trying to comply with WP:V, which prizes "verifiability", while accommodating your well-reasoned doubts. As there seems no difficulty about the origin of the name for the lamp, in the first part of the second sentence, is the very minor tweak of moving "theory" to the second part of the second sentence acceptable or not? It would read: "The miners of the north-east called their lamps geordies and, according to the theory, the name soon attached to the pit men themselves." As your initial sentence would not be changed your doubts about this etymology will remain in place. I have now linked to Geordie so interested readers may get the full story, as you explain above.

The OED second edition (1989) from which I cited seems the same as the 1933: it is only definitive about the lamp. --Old Moonraker (talk) 21:27, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

The theory that Geordie people take their name from a lamp is completely unsupported by WP:V sources. Therefore it should only be mentioned here, at all, in the most cautious of terms: we might mention the existence of the theory (and definitely link to geordie), but shouldn't give any credence to it. There is in contrast at least some evidence that the name was in use for pitmen at a time before it's recorded in reference to the lamp. Both of these recorded uses are long after the lamp was in use, so don't prove much conclusively either way.

If anything, the likelihood is that "Geordie" was in widespread use in reference to pitmen before any of the lamps, and it spread from them to the Newcastrians. Andy Dingley (talk) 22:00, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

Moved from the article

In a book I have just read "Beating the Record" by G. Stebbing written about 1905 it indicates he was only married once to Fanny who died after giving birth to a little girl who also died and it does not indicate he ever married again. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.54.130.47 (talk • contribs)

Pop Culture Reference?

This is a tad odd, but elements of Stephenson's biography (death of Fanny Henderson, father blinded) are recited in the Firesign Theater sketch "Coal!" I don't know whether that's an appropriate detail to add or not, so I thought I'd just toss it out there.David A Spitzley (talk) 16:55, 23 October 2012 (UTC)

"Jesse Hartley's skew arch bridge"

If it's Jesse Hartley's bridge, what is it doing on George Stephenson's page? The cited reference doesn't mention Hartley at all, and says that Stephenson built it. Chuntuk (talk) 16:31, 22 November 2016 (UTC)

Accent/Dialect

I've heard it claimed that Stephenson's accent/dialect was so thick that he had to take an interpreter with him in order to be understood in London. Anyone know of any evidence for this or is it just a myth? Cassandra Cassandrathesceptic (talk) 12:44, 30 November 2016 (UTC)

London? He had difficulties just in Newcastle. Look at some of the descriptions of his presentations to the Lit & Phil. Stephenson was looked down on by many urban Newcastle sophisticates. He was from a village outside the city, he was poorly born, he worked with his hands, and he had the accent of a coal miner. Oh, and he revolutionised three whole industries, near single-handed. He was lauded by miners (and why his lamp was accepted so readily) because he sounded like "one of them". Amongst the affluent merchant class of Newcastle he'd be understood, but he was regularly snubbed socially, even after he'd become rich enough to buy them all for cash. Andy Dingley (talk) 13:23, 30 November 2016 (UTC)

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Inventor of the flanged wheel?

Wikipedia seems to have nothing on who invented the flanged wheel, which was essential to high speed rail transport and highly non-obvious, as tramways had operated for millennia with ordinary wheels, and late 18th/early 19th railroads often used flanged rails. This source says George Stephenson invented flanged wheels, but its source link is broken. Enon (talk) 17:10, 23 November 2017 (UTC)

The cited blog is vague more than inaccurate. Stephenson does seem to have been the first to use flanged wheels or a steam locomotive (on his My Lord, which was the earlier loco than Blucher). However flanged wheels themselves were in use before this. The first references I've seen to them were in the useful (but expensive) Lewis, M. J. T. (1974). Early Wooden Railways. ISBN 0710078188..

Also George Stephenson didn't invent 4'8½" gauge. His gauge was 4'8", it was Robert who widened it by half an inch for the Liverpool & Manchester. Andy Dingley (talk) 17:44, 23 November 2017 (UTC)

Venue of third marriage ceremony (section Personal life)

I have raised a citation need against the statement Stephenson's third marriage ceremony took place in "St John's Church in Shrewsbury, Shropshire". I have not heard that he married in the town (near my home) and there has never been a church dedicated to St John in the town, although there was from the later 19th century until it closed in 2005 the "St John's Hill Methodist Church", which it took its name from the street it was in (Methodists didn't do church dedications). I suspect the church's name or the town's name might be an error.Cloptonson (talk) 10:58, 17 September 2023 (UTC)

Hello there,

I have found out that it was actually St Chad's Church in Shrewsbury, not St Johns. I have found two references for this:

The first comes from the Leicester Journal of 21st of August 1848, p. 2. Via British Newspaper Archive. -

"MARRIAGES. On Tuesday the 11th inst. at St. Chad's, Shrewsbury, by the Vicar, the Rev. J. Yardley, M.A. George Stephenson, Esq, Tapton House, Chesterfield, to Ellen, daughter of the late Richard Gregory. Esq. of Meadow Place, near Bakewell."

England Marriages via familysearch also gives the place of his third marriage as St Chad, Shrewsbury. -

George Stephenson, "England Marriages, 1538–1973" (familysearch.org)

I have put these two references into the article.

Thank you. Reddog78 (talk) 17:50, 17 September 2024 (UTC)