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:Why not just edit the template? <span style="border:1px solid white;background-color: yellow; color: blue">[[User:Legoktm|Lego]][[Special:Contributions/Legoktm|K<sup>ontribs</sup>]][[user talk:Legoktm|T<sup>alk</sup>]]M</span> 03:44, 19 October 2008 (UTC)
:Why not just edit the template? <span style="border:1px solid white;background-color: yellow; color: blue">[[User:Legoktm|Lego]][[Special:Contributions/Legoktm|K<sup>ontribs</sup>]][[user talk:Legoktm|T<sup>alk</sup>]]M</span> 03:44, 19 October 2008 (UTC)
::While it would be possible to just edit the template to make the "long_peri" field display as "argument of periastron", this would be confusing for editors who aren't familiar with the history behind the decision (having a field name which looks like one orbital element but actually refers to another is not a good solution), and it would also be problematic for cases where we want to have the longitude of periastron field in the infobox. Just removing the "long_peri" field from the template is similarly inadequate, since it would remove information from the articles where it is transcluded instead of fixing it. [[User:Icalanise|Icalanise]] ([[User talk:Icalanise|talk]]) 09:21, 19 October 2008 (UTC)
::While it would be possible to just edit the template to make the "long_peri" field display as "argument of periastron", this would be confusing for editors who aren't familiar with the history behind the decision (having a field name which looks like one orbital element but actually refers to another is not a good solution), and it would also be problematic for cases where we want to have the longitude of periastron field in the infobox. Just removing the "long_peri" field from the template is similarly inadequate, since it would remove information from the articles where it is transcluded instead of fixing it. [[User:Icalanise|Icalanise]] ([[User talk:Icalanise|talk]]) 09:21, 19 October 2008 (UTC)

== Article assesser ==

'''Description:''' Assess articles based on already present assessments

'''Tasks:''' Browse article talk pages and look for the |class=XXX in the project templates. If another project's template is present on the same page, then it would add |class=XXX to that template (or the lowest class rating given if there are more than one). It would never override an already present assessment, only fill the unfilled ones. It would be based on subscriptions, so Wikiprojects who do not wish to have a bot fill the |class= argument of their projects wouldn't be affected by the bot. Edit summary would be reflective of what change it made, and prompt editors to verify that the assessment makes sense, especially if there were different class ratings given on the talk page.

'''Example:'''<br>

'''Before:'''
<pre>
{{physics|class=A|importance=High}}
{{chemistry|class=B|importance=Mid}}
{{WPAstronomy|
</pre>

'''After:'''
<pre>
{{physics|class=A|importance=High}}
{{chemistry|class=B|importance=Mid}}
{{WPAstronomy|class=B}}
</pre>

[[User:Headbomb|Headbomb]] {[[User talk:Headbomb|ταλκ]] – [[WP:PHYS|WP Physics]]: [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Physics/Projects of the Week|PotW]]} 23:55, 20 October 2008 (UTC)


:We have a couple of bots that do this. Just not on a wide-scale. But if a specific WikiProject has a request they'd like to file they should do it here. <font color="green" face="Comic Sans MS">[[User:Stepshep|§hep]]</font> • <font color="green" face="Comic Sans MS">[[User talk:Stepshep|¡Talk to me!]]</font> 01:45, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

:: Alright, well sign up WikiProject Physics on one of these bots. But the wide-scale bot would be nice to have. [[User:Headbomb|Headbomb]] {[[User talk:Headbomb|ταλκ]] – [[WP:PHYS|WP Physics]]: [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Physics/Projects of the Week|PotW]]} 02:01, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

:::I can code a bot for this. I'll just be awhile as I'm busy putting finishing touches on [[User:John Bot II]]. <font color="blue">'' '''[[User:CWii|<font color="blue">CWii</font>]]'''<sub>([[User_Talk:CWii|<font color="blue">Talk</font>]]<nowiki>|</nowiki>[[Special:Contributions/CWii|<font color="blue">Contribs</font>]])</sub> ''</font> 02:04, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

:::: No rush. Take your time.[[User:Headbomb|Headbomb]] {[[User talk:Headbomb|ταλκ]] – [[WP:PHYS|WP Physics]]: [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Physics/Projects of the Week|PotW]]} 02:24, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

:::::Alright added to my todo list. <font color="blue">'' '''[[User:CWii|<font color="blue">CWii</font>]]'''<sub>([[User_Talk:CWii|<font color="blue">Talk</font>]]<nowiki>|</nowiki>[[Special:Contributions/CWii|<font color="blue">Contribs</font>]])</sub> ''</font> 02:27, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

:::::: Cool beans. Thanks a bunch.[[User:Headbomb|Headbomb]] {[[User talk:Headbomb|ταλκ]] – [[WP:PHYS|WP Physics]]: [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Physics/Projects of the Week|PotW]]} 02:31, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

: [[User:TinucherianBot|TinucherianBot]] can do something similar. see [[Wikipedia:Bots/Requests_for_approval/TinucherianBot_5|BRFA]]. But it works on the other way : Assessment should be based on the highest assessment if there are more than one. If the assessments are same, just copy the rating to our project.

'''Example:'''<br>

'''Before:'''
<pre>
{{physics|class=Stub|importance=High}}
{{chemistry|class=Start|importance=Mid}}
{{WPAstronomy|
</pre>

'''After:'''
<pre>
{{physics|class=Stub|importance=High}}
{{chemistry|class=Start|importance=Mid}}
{{WPAstronomy|class=Start}}
</pre>

Actually this sounds more logical and already done by many projects. The highest rating is more likely to more recent ( trusting the work of human assessers ) . Running on Unassessed categories of your project ensures that previous assessments are not overridden. If that is OK, my bot can certianly help you -- [[User:Tinucherian|'''<em style="font-family:Kristen ITC;color:#ff0000"> Tinu</em>''']] [[User talk:Tinucherian|'''<em style="font-family:Kristen ITC;color:#ff0000">Cherian </em>''']] - 13:04, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
:It's alright with me. I was under the impression that people were against the idea of given the highest of assements, but hey if I'm wrong about that, then let's place the highest assessment.[[User:Headbomb|Headbomb]] {[[User talk:Headbomb|ταλκ]] – [[WP:PHYS|WP Physics]]: [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Physics/Projects of the Week|PotW]]} 20:45, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
::If you want to sent TinucherianBot on the hunt for assessment of the physics articles, go right ahead. The category is [[:Category:Unassessed physics articles]].[[User:Headbomb|Headbomb]] {[[User talk:Headbomb|ταλκ]] – [[WP:PHYS|WP Physics]]: [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Physics/Projects of the Week|PotW]]} 22:07, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
::: Perfect ! {{BOTREQ|doing}} : Get to hear from TinucherianBot soon. Btw I assume there are no issues regarding this autoassessment from your other project members -- [[User:Tinucherian|'''<em style="font-family:Kristen ITC;color:#ff0000"> Tinu</em>''']] [[User talk:Tinucherian|'''<em style="font-family:Kristen ITC;color:#ff0000">Cherian </em>''']] - 11:25, 22 October 2008 (UTC)
:::: Well I haven't explicitly run the idea with other members, but from my interactions with them no one ever raised a concern about bots assigned the stub-class automatically. I really don't see a problem with this, especially since the bot wouldn't give an importance rating, and articles with assessments (start-class and upwards) but without importance ratings get reviewed very quickly (usually within a few days). [[User:Headbomb|Headbomb]] {[[User talk:Headbomb|ταλκ]] – [[WP:PHYS|WP Physics]]: [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Physics/Projects of the Week|PotW]]} 13:54, 22 October 2008 (UTC)
::::: {{BOTREQ|done}} : Approx 223 of 1583 unassessed articles checked of [[WP:PHYSICS]] were autoassessed by TinucherianBot. -- [[User:Tinucherian|'''<em style="font-family:Kristen ITC;color:#ff0000"> Tinu</em>''']] [[User talk:Tinucherian|'''<em style="font-family:Kristen ITC;color:#ff0000">Cherian </em>''']] - 09:12, 23 October 2008 (UTC)

Headbomb, btw we can't blindly autoassess for all projects on the talk pages. Like the comments in [[Wikipedia:Bots/Requests for approval/TinucherianBot 5|my bot BRFA]] , we can do it per request by the project members or consensus from the specific WikiProjects. Anyways this process saves hours of work (some projects have 9000+ unassessed articles!) for human editors, leaving them free to actually improve the articles in question.Over 10K articles were autoassessed for [[WP:COMPUTING]] :) alone . Think of human editors having to do it manually ! Most importantly it relies on actual assessment done by human editors and it is being reused by other projects. We may get a few false positives (less than 5% max I would imagine) but it's a small price to pay for the huge benefit of automation. Also, a false positive is likely to result in the article being identified and properly assessed, which might not otherwise happen.If you would like to this for any Wikiproject, feel free to make a bot request. -- [[User:Tinucherian|'''<em style="font-family:Kristen ITC;color:#ff0000"> Tinu</em>''']] [[User talk:Tinucherian|'''<em style="font-family:Kristen ITC;color:#ff0000">Cherian </em>''']] - 09:39, 23 October 2008 (UTC)


== A bot to add missing diacritics ==
== A bot to add missing diacritics ==

Revision as of 12:57, 23 October 2008

This is a page for requesting tasks to be done by bots per the bot policy. This is an appropriate place to put ideas for uncontroversial bot tasks, to get early feedback on ideas for bot tasks (controversial or not), and to seek bot operators for bot tasks. Consensus-building discussions requiring large community input (such as request for comments) should normally be held at WP:VPPROP or other relevant pages (such as a WikiProject's talk page).

You can check the "Commonly Requested Bots" box above to see if a suitable bot already exists for the task you have in mind. If you have a question about a particular bot, contact the bot operator directly via their talk page or the bot's talk page. If a bot is acting improperly, follow the guidance outlined in WP:BOTISSUE. For broader issues and general discussion about bots, see the bot noticeboard.

Before making a request, please see the list of frequently denied bots, either because they are too complicated to program, or do not have consensus from the Wikipedia community. If you are requesting that a template (such as a WikiProject banner) is added to all pages in a particular category, please be careful to check the category tree for any unwanted subcategories. It is best to give a complete list of categories that should be worked through individually, rather than one category to be analyzed recursively (see example difference).

Alternatives to bot requests

Note to bot operators: The {{BOTREQ}} template can be used to give common responses, and make it easier to keep track of the task's current status. If you complete a request, note that you did with {{BOTREQ|done}}, and archive the request after a few days (WP:1CA is useful here).


Please add your bot requests to the bottom of this page.
Make a new request
# Bot request Status 💬 👥 🙋 Last editor 🕒 (UTC) 🤖 Last botop editor 🕒 (UTC)
1 Automatic NOGALLERY keyword for categories containing non-free files (again) 27 11 Anomie 2024-08-04 14:09 Anomie 2024-08-04 14:09
2 Bot that condenses identical references Coding... 12 6 ActivelyDisinterested 2024-08-03 20:48 Headbomb 2024-06-18 00:34
3 Bot to remove template from articles it doesn't belong on? 4 4 Wikiwerner 2024-09-28 17:28 Primefac 2024-07-24 20:15
4 One-off: Adding all module doc pages to Category:Module documentation pages 7 3 Andrybak 2024-09-01 00:34 Primefac 2024-07-25 12:22
5 Draft Categories 13 6 Bearcat 2024-08-09 04:24 DannyS712 2024-07-27 07:30
6 Change hyphens to en-dashes 16 7 1ctinus 2024-08-03 15:05 Qwerfjkl 2024-07-31 09:09
7 Consensus: Aldo, Giovanni e Giacomo 17 5 Dicklyon 2024-08-14 14:43 Qwerfjkl 2024-08-02 20:23
8 Cyclones 3 2 OhHaiMark 2024-08-05 22:21 Mdann52 2024-08-05 16:07
9 Substing int message headings on filepages 8 4 Jonteemil 2024-08-07 23:13 Primefac 2024-08-07 14:02
10 Removing redundant FURs on file pages 5 3 Wikiwerner 2024-09-28 17:28 Anomie 2024-08-09 14:15
11 Need help with a super widespread typo: Washington, D.C (also U.S.A) 32 10 Jonesey95 2024-08-26 16:55 Qwerfjkl 2024-08-21 15:08
12 Dutch IPA 4 3 IvanScrooge98 2024-08-25 14:11
13 AnandTech shuts down 9 6 GreenC 2024-09-01 18:39 Primefac 2024-09-01 17:28
14 Date formatting on 9/11 biography articles 5 2 Zeke, the Mad Horrorist 2024-09-01 16:27
15 Discussion alert bot 6 4 Headbomb 2024-09-08 12:29 Headbomb 2024-09-08 12:29
16 Regularly removing coords missing if coordinates are present BRFA filed 11 2 Usernamekiran 2024-09-07 13:19 Usernamekiran 2024-09-07 13:19
17 Latex: move punctuation to go inside templates 3 2 Yodo9000 2024-09-07 18:59 Anomie 2024-09-07 03:38
18 de-AMP bot BRFA filed 13 7 Usernamekiran 2024-09-24 16:04 Usernamekiran 2024-09-24 16:04
19 Articles about years: redirects and categories BRFA filed 7 3 DreamRimmer 2024-09-16 01:18 DreamRimmer 2024-09-16 01:18
20 WikiProject ratings change BRFA filed 3 2 DreamRimmer 2024-09-15 11:43 DreamRimmer 2024-09-15 11:43
21 QIDs in Infobox person/Wikidata BRFA filed 10 3 Pigsonthewing 2024-09-17 16:56 Usernamekiran 2024-09-17 16:11
22 Remove outdated "Image requested" templates 3 2 7804j 2024-09-21 11:26 DreamRimmer 2024-09-19 18:53
23 "Was" in TV articles 2 2 Usernamekiran 2024-09-28 21:07 Usernamekiran 2024-09-28 21:07
Legend
  • In the last hour
  • In the last day
  • In the last week
  • In the last month
  • More than one month
Manual settings
When exceptions occur,
please check the setting first.


Birmingham, England

There are over 300 links to Birmingham, England, which is a redirect to Birmingham. Could someone please change them to

[[Birmingham]], [[England]]

unless they are followed by the sting "England" in, say, the next 20 characters, in which case change to

[[Birmingham]]

Thank you. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 21:01, 3 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

A better set of replacement rules might be
  • "[[Birmingham, England]]" → "[[Birmingham]], [[England]]"
  • "[[Birmingham, England|Birmingham]]" → "[[Birmingham]]"
  • "[[Birmingham, England|" → "[[Birmingham|"
That is, simply bypass the redirect if the link is piped (and simplify where appropriate), otherwise append a link to England to preserve the rendering. And of course this should be done with AWB or some other semiautomated tool, not as a fully automated bot run. —Ilmari Karonen (talk) 23:14, 3 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Doing... semi-auto LegoKontribsTalkM 04:01, 4 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
On hold until the next dump. (3 days) LegoKontribsTalkM 02:03, 13 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I have a list of what changes a bot would make, at User:Matthew_Brandon_Yeager/Birmingham,_England. I would review these changes (along with the person requesting this to be done) before this would be done(in additional to normal BAG approval). With that said, does anyone see a problem with having a bot make these changes (automated) if ALL the changes were reviewed beforehand? Thank you for your time, MatthewYeager 07:27, 18 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

disambiguator (rugby player) to become (rugby union)

Interested in having a bot move the disambiguators (rugby player) to become (rugby union), as per WP:RU. Don't really know how to formally request, or see if it is feasible.Londo06 14:41, 14 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Can you look here to see if I got the right pages? LegoKontribsTalkM 05:34, 15 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Cheers fella; those seem like the right ones.Londo06 21:36, 21 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect tagging

Many redirects are created without a template to categorize them, and manually finding the untagged redirects can be tedious. I believe that a bot to place {{R uncategorized}} on redirect pages with no template would be useful. --UberScienceNerd Talk Contributions 20:58, 17 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Categorizing redirects? Just read some discussion on that on Wikipedia_talk:Template_messages/Redirect_pages and still don't see much point in it. That would be a huge job for a bot, how many redirects are there on Wikipedia? Garion96 (talk) 22:40, 17 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Dido often vandalised by changing "Dido" to "Dildo"

I am sure that this type of vandalism is common elsewhere, where the subject's name is changed by a single character. In the Dido (singer) article, it is common for vandals to change all instances of "Dido" to "Dildo". It would be good if this vandalism was automatically reverted and the vandalism reported.Thank you, Labalius (talk) 01:45, 18 October 2008 (UTC).[reply]

SnoopBot

I would like a Bot that can leave messages and can make edits on pages. I need a Bot to use. And one to stop vandalism. Thank you! Dingo Kong (talk) 06:11, 18 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]


French commune infoboxes

We have a huge back log of French commune articles to add the infoboxes from French wikipedia Status check. All that needs doing is copying the infobox directly from the French wikipedia equivalent. Please see Vulaines. All that needs doing for each article is cutting and pasting the infobox from French wiki into every article which must be bot compatible. So for Vulaines all it requires is pasting the infobox into it from here and pasting it into the english wiki article. COuld somebody please programme a bot or use some form of coding to help complete the task in hours rather than months? Blofeld of SPECTRE (talk) 11:48, 18 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I did Vulaines for ya. We could also do the same for the "demographie" section. Actually, you cannot copy directly from the French wiki: you have to change |arrondissement=Arrondissement de Troyes

|canton=Canton d'Aix-en-Othe (in the case of Vulaines) to |arrondissement=Arrondissement ''of'' Troyes |canton=Canton ''of'' Aix-en-Othe. Cheers ~one of many editorofthewikis (talk/contribs/editor review)~ 15:17, 18 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Please take care. You added new coordinates in the infobox which were both too precise (i.e. too many decimal places) and overwrote the existing {{coord}} template's display in the top right-hand corner. I've fixed the former and removed the {{coord}}, but any bot doing similar work should do likewise. Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 09:41, 19 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Would it be sufficient to change "d'" or "de" to "of"? I'm not sure this can be done without a human review afterwards... Fritzpoll (talk) 10:34, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Compare this to this. There are five changes:

  • Changing Arrondissement de Troyes to Arrondissement of Troyes
  • Communauté de communes du Pays d'Othe aixois -needs delinking and shortening to just Pays d'Othe aixois.
  • the canton removing the "Canton de" and delinking
  • Shortening the overly long coordinates to probably four digits.
  • Removing the coordinates at the bottom of the page so they don't feature in double at the top

Thats actually sound more complicated than it needs to be but thats basically it. Even if you copied directly from French wiki without adjustments it would be a progess,

Could do a trial and error run see if it can be modified to be programmed this way. Any thoughts?Blofeld of SPECTRE (talk) 11:38, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Exoplanetary orbits: longitude of periastron to argument of periastron

Could all instances of the longitude of periastron parameter be changed to the argument of periastron in the infoboxes for extrasolar planets? Strictly speaking, this is the correct parameter to use, and no objections to this have been raised at the discussion at WT:ASTRO. The relevant field is already present in {{Planetbox orbit}}. For articles which transclude this template, the value in the long_peri field should be transferred to arg_peri, e.g. to take the example on the page 51 Pegasi b:

{{Planetbox orbit 
| semimajor =  0.0527 ± 0.0030  
| eccentricity = 0.013 ± 0.012
| period = 4.230785 ± 0.000036
| ang_dist = 3.537 
| long_peri = 58
| t_peri = 2,450,001.51 ± 0.61
| semi-amp = 55.94 ± 0.69
}}

should become

{{Planetbox orbit 
| semimajor =  0.0527 ± 0.0030  
| eccentricity = 0.013 ± 0.012
| period = 4.230785 ± 0.000036
| ang_dist = 3.537 
| arg_peri = 58
| t_peri = 2,450,001.51 ± 0.61
| semi-amp = 55.94 ± 0.69
}}

Thank you. Icalanise (talk) 14:42, 18 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Why not just edit the template? LegoKontribsTalkM 03:44, 19 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
While it would be possible to just edit the template to make the "long_peri" field display as "argument of periastron", this would be confusing for editors who aren't familiar with the history behind the decision (having a field name which looks like one orbital element but actually refers to another is not a good solution), and it would also be problematic for cases where we want to have the longitude of periastron field in the infobox. Just removing the "long_peri" field from the template is similarly inadequate, since it would remove information from the articles where it is transcluded instead of fixing it. Icalanise (talk) 09:21, 19 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

A bot to add missing diacritics

Many articles omit diacritics from place names and personal names, but they can't generally be fixed by a bot because it's not possible to distinguish automatically when diacritics should be added and when not. However, there are a lot of redirects to ensure that links go from the no-diacritic version to the correctly titled article (e.g. Dusseldorf, Amelie Mauresmo). The presence of such a link could be used by a bot to make the necessary determination about what to fix. What I propose is:

For every link whose text contains no diacritics and which leads to a redirect whose target is exactly the same except for the addition of diacritics, replace the original link text by the redirect target. And then scan the article for any occurrences of the same source string and make the same replacement.

It would need to bypass disambiguation pages, which are likely to legitimately contain several variations (Valparaiso (disambiguation), for example), and it would need to exclude pages in the purview of Wikipedia:WikiProject Ice Hockey, as they've evolved their own naming conventions for player names, but otherwise it should be able to operate everywhere. Colonies Chris (talk) 10:41, 22 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

This seems like it would have issues with WP:R#NOTBROKEN and WP:BFDB#Spell-checking bots. Mr.Z-man 19:19, 22 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
There are no issues with WP:R#NOTBROKEN because what it would fix is the source text, not the redirect. And there are no issues with WP:BFDB#Spell-checking bots because it wouldn't be working blindly from a predefined set of spelling corrections, it would be using the redirects that human editors have created as its guide to what needs to be changed. Colonies Chris (talk) 22:25, 22 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
There should almost never be a reason to replace [[redirect]] with [[target|redirect]]. Isn't that pretty much what its doing? Mr.Z-man 02:13, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
No, that's not what it would be doing. It would, for example, replace "Dusseldorf" by "Düsseldorf" in the source article. NOTBROKEN prohibits redirect/piping fixes where what's visible to the reader doesn't change, which is not the case here. What I'm suggesting here is a special type of automated spelling correction which would operate on a tightly circumscribed domain and use the presence of human-created redirects to discover what corrections should be made . Colonies Chris (talk) 10:59, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
It's still got the problem that bots can't reliably tell the difference between a direct quotation from a source (which should not be changed) and prose written by Wikipedia editors (which can be changed). --Carnildo (talk) 04:31, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]
This is always an issue with bots, but bots can be made to exclude text inside blockquotes and similar constructs. This can't cover every possibility as not all direct quotes have been tagged as such, but the number of changes made in error would be very small, I would think. Also, just because it's in a direct quote doesn't mean the use of diacritics in the original statement is accurately quoted - I suspect there are quotes in WP that were edited by people who didn't know how to enter diacritics so they just omitted them. Colonies Chris (talk) 10:59, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Is there any bot that can create the last stable template for software which is listed in this comparison with data from the articles(if the infobox is filled)? 16:25, 22 October 2008 (UTC)

Hi, simple.wiktionary is quite sparse. A very useful tool would be to list the wikt tags on the wiki that do not have a corresponding definition on the wiktionary. Please make one and if you do please leave the info on my simple wiki talk page[1] on how to use it or where to find the list. This would also be useful as an updatable list, if possible, such as "short pages" etc. but even a one time listing would clear all the current ones at least. Thanks. 89.204.246.183 (talk) 03:58, 23 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]