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Two new articles rejected erroneously

Please see Draft:Oleg Rogynskyy - there are several solid independent sources with deep coverage: Forbes, Bloomberg, Financial Times. Yet the complaint is that they are not sufficient and that the subject of the article writes about himself. Yet, I wrote the text myself based on references. Why would anyone make these empty accusations? Also, I don't have a Conflict of Interest here. Same problem with the Draft:People.ai page, which I created.

Igor Markov 06:22, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

@Igor Markov: While I have not yet looked at any of the sources, it looks like User:Rogynskyy, who shares their username with the person being written about, made contributions to each page very quickly after their creation - this suggests to others that you may be working with the subject of the article in at least some fashion. Is this correct? Tollens (talk) 06:29, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

I wasn't aware of his changes, but he did email me after the pages were created and pointed out a spelling mistake I made in his last name. Most likely, he was notified of page creation by automatic monitoring software. I don't see this being anywhere close to the conflict of interest. Igor Markov 06:35, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

@Tollens- thank you for the quick response. Igor Markov 06:38, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

If Rogynskyy's edits are a problem, then they can be reverted. They have nothing to do with the excellent sources in the articles and the text that I wrote. Igor Markov 06:40, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Igor Markov, the mere fact that he emailed you suggests a conflict of interest. What have reliable sources (independent of Oleg Rogynskyy) said about him? (Incidentally, an article about him would refer to "Rogynskyy", not to "Oleg".) What have reliable sources (independent of People.ai) said about People.ai? (Incidentally, what does "account and opportunity management solutions" mean?) -- Hoary (talk) 06:40, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Let's unroll this. I created the pages for "Roginskyy" and "People.ai" with no coordination with anyone. Rogynskyy was somehow notified and sent me a short message via the Wikipedia (as the author of the article) pointing out the spelling problem. I moved the page to fix spelling. What now? - unpublish the article and complain about the independent sources that I found? The answer to your question about independent sources is in the article - all material I wrote is from independent sources and I cite them. I did not use any personal knowledge. Changing the first name to last name is trivial (and I consider calling people by their last name less polite).

Most important, how do we fix the baseless comments about the sources and the subject's notability? Igor Markov 06:48, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

@Hoary - thank you for chiming in quickly. I'd appreciate it if you looked at the article and let me know if there is a problem to fix. Igor Markov 06:52, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Pinging Edit.pdf, the editor who draftified the articles. Tollens (talk) 06:52, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

@Tollens thanks! It's quite clear to me that Igor Markov has likely been paid by Rogynksy that I don't know what to add more. However, I've checked the sources and found them to be unreliable and lacking depth. The author's persistent attempts to republish these pages further convinces me that they could be a paid contributor. At this point, I see no other recourse but to follow the Articles for Creation (AfC) process and remain patient. Again, I checked the sources on both pages and they are not sufficient per WP NCOPR or ANybio (on my point of view). Edit.pdf (talk) 07:02, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Please stop this slander. I have not been paid by anyone for any wikis. Igor Markov 07:08, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

@Edit.pdf I think we need to get another opinion here. Each of the two articles has several sources that satisfy the four requirements. This is easy to see. Igor Markov 07:10, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

@Edit.pdfWhat do you mean by "persistent attempts to republish"? I have not submitted the articles for republishing - not a single attempt yet. Igor Markov 07:12, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

@Hoary, I apologize if I'm causing any inconvenience. I wanted to let you know that I believe the discussion could now be concluded. Thank you for your attention. Edit.pdf (talk) 07:16, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

@Tollens - I tried to reason with @Edit.pdf, but to no avail. What other options do we have here? And how do we stop this slander by @Edit.pdf? Igor Markov 07:36, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

I quote: Oleg moved to Canada, where the job market was more favorable. He led the sales effort at a Canadian startup, Nstein Technologies. In 2009, he returned to the U.S. as the head of growth at a Boston-based company, Lexalytics, where he worked for two years. He then founded Semantria that developed software to analyse text data on social media. In 2014, Oleg sold the company to Lexalytics for $10 million. Unreferenced. Oleg's work was recognized in the Time Magazine article "2022 Person of the Year: The Spirit of Ukraine". President Volodymyr Zelensky honored Oleg with the Order of Merit (Ukraine) 3rd degree. Both of these are good. But what did Time say? (Recognized in the article as/for what?) Awarded the Order of Merit for what? This additional information is not necessary: if he verifiably got such-and-such an award but no reliable source says why, the award may be mentioned. But adding material would help demonstrate his significance. Your last point assumes that the comments about the sources and the subject's notability were baseless. NB "notability" in this context means "notability" as defined by and for English-language Wikipedia. (This may differ from notability as you understand it and it differs greatly from notability as I understand it.) Sources for a claim of notability must be "reliable" as "reliability" is defined ditto. Quote: Later, as the invasion unfolded, he realized the value of modern information technologies at the battlefield and started helping his friends at the front lines, while marshalling resources of the Technology Community in the West. “This is the first war with Wi-Fi in every trench,” he noted to Wired. “World War I–style trench warfare with 3,500 Starlink internet satellites in the air. Every soldier is a content creator, and the amount of content being created is just tremendous.” There's nothing much wrong with this, but it doesn't help a claim of notability. What would be good would be a reliable source (of course independent of OR) saying much the same thing and also that OR had made a significant contribution towards achieving this goal. -- Hoary (talk) 07:17, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

@Hoary- thank you for taking time to read the text. Frankly, I am not entirely following what you consider sufficient and what not. Rogynskyy is the founder and CEO of a sizable company, and this is covered in depth by several reliable independent sources (Forbes, Financial Times, Bloomberg). That makes him notable. Some sources do not cover him in depth, and that's OK. For example, his Order of Merit (Ukraine) only mentions his job title and has no citation. Same for other recipients. But this does not invalidate the solid sources. Igor Markov 07:27, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

@Hoary- in other words, imagine that the text you quoted didn't exist. There should be enough notability in the remaining parts of the article. Needless to say, some information, such as why the Times Magazine mentioned him, is not available to me. I can't ask Rogynskyy. And I can't ask President Zelensky why he gave Rogynskyy an Order of Merit. But this isn't necessary to establish notability. Agree? Igor Markov 07:31, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Igor Markov, let's get back to your initial assertion: "there are several solid independent sources with deep coverage: Forbes, Bloomberg, Financial Times". Forbes: agreed. Bloomberg: The title of the piece suggests otherwise, but I can't judge (or, if you prefer, I am too stingy to judge) because it's behind a paywall. Financial Times: The draft currently cites two FT pieces. The title of one suggests that it's based on an interview, which would be problematic; the title of the other suggests that it's less about the man than about the company; but NB my use of the word "suggests" and anyway I again have the paywall impediment. Perhaps other experienced editors who frequent this page will have access to one or both websites. I recommend being patient for a few hours and seeing if anyone will helpfully chime in. -- Hoary (talk) 08:25, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

@Hoary - thank you. That's reasonable, and I am not in any rush. In the meantime, I reread the Ukrainian-language reference for the Order of Merit, and it does have a citation (same for many recipients including Anderson Cooper, Christianne Amanpour, etc). I added a translated version for completeness. Igor Markov 08:31, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Also added a Wall Street Journal reference, although its level of detail is debatable. Igor Markov 08:45, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

@Hoary - what do you think of The Tribune reference? It's an Indian source, independent, and covers the subject in depth. In any case, you liked the Forbes source, perhaps you are OK with the Order of Merit (Ukraine) as an indication of notability (the list of other recipients there is very impressive). How many sources do we need? Thank you. Igor Markov 22:05, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Igor Markov, the Ukrainian award went to a great number of people; of course being one of those so honoured has some significance, but I wouldn't make too much of it. ¶ This The Tribune that you cite seems to be a website devoted to the western and southern fringes of what used to be the Soviet Union. (Or more likely, seems to have been; although a publisher's demise isn't a criticism of what it produced while it existed.) There's no obvious relationship to the Indian Tribune. The particular cited page from The Tribune is detailed, and isn't obviously promotional; but it's unsigned and I'm not sure that it isn't a mere advertorial. ¶ Usually, just three good sources -- that is, just three that both are reliable and go into some depth. ¶ If one or two (or of course more) among [... pause while I look for a few names who've recently been active as shown below ...] Cullen328, David notMD, Mike Turnbull, Nick Moyes, 331dot, and Tigraan (or of course others here) would comment on the depth of coverage provided by the more-or-less-promising-sounding sources (Bloomberg, FT, WSJ) from which I'm separated by a paywall, this would be helpful. -- Hoary (talk) 23:18, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

@Hoary, just to clarify the significance of a major state award given by the President - doesn't it support that the person made major contributions in some field? For example, for scientists and engineers, being an IEEE Fellow is recognized as sufficient for Wikipedia notability (incidentally, I've been an IEEE Fellow for a while :). The fact that many people get IEEE Fellow elevation every year and are listed in one document isn't an impediment. The same about the Order of Merit (Ukraine) - it's awarded once per year to many recipients. In comparison, articles that feature some people are published by many magazines every day (not as prestigious). Just thinking aloud. - Igor Markov 00:13, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Igor Markov, I can't comment offhand about the IEEE matter/analogy; but I agree with the rest. Yes, the award supports notability, as you and I understand the latter. However, Wikipedia has a very different (and arguably perverse) notion of notability. What we want are three sources that are independent of each other and reliable (as defined here) and go into depth. Alternatives (such as two sources plus a truly remarkable award) would be considered. -- Hoary (talk) 01:01, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Paywalls also prevent me from evaluating several of the sources. I will comment on two of the sources. The Forbes source was written by a so-called "Forbes contributor" and the consensus of the community is that this type of content is unreliable due to lack of adequate editorial oversight. See WP:FORBESCONTRIBUTOR for details. As for the Time magazine source, it is mostly a couple of quotes from Rogynskyy, and I do not consider it either significant or independent coverage. Its function seems to be to imply that Rogynskyy must be notable if Time mentioned him in passing. If so, that is incorrect. As for the Order of Merit, evaluating its significance requires a deeper understanding of its prestige and exclusivity. Countries tend to give out lots of medals and awards during wartime. For example, I have seen editors argue that the Distinguished Flying Cross confers notability in the United States, but the fact is that over 20,000 were awarded during World War II, and many thousands subsequently. So, my recommendation to Igor Markov is to remove the weaker references and to remove the poorly referenced content, and then resubmit. Quality is more important than quantity. Cullen328 (talk) 00:42, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Cullen328, yes, I remember now about WP:FORBESCONTRIBUTOR. Good point. Actually the Time source wasn't among those I asked about (not that you said that it was). -- Hoary (talk) 01:01, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

@Cullen328 - thank you for looking into this carefully and explaining your thought process. Clearly, the stated guidelines have a lot of folklore in how they are interpreted and enforced, but that's a topic for another day :)

In writing the text, I tried to cover the subject based on public info, rather than try to substantiate every paragraph with high-quality sources (I thought this explicitly was not required), but can trim the text to emphasize stronger sources. I do pay for subscriptions to several top US sources and am surprised that this causes problems (maybe the Wikipedia can address this at the institutional level). Igor Markov 02:46, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

@Igor Markov The Wikimedia Foundation does try to assist by giving established editors access to The Wikipedia Library, through which many paywalled sources can be accessed. I put Rogynskyy's name into the search box for the library and it gave plenty of hits but unfortunately they were exclusively press releases from People.ai or brief mentions or items based on interviews. I could not find any that met the key criteria. (The FT article was not among the hits as it isn't available through the library.) Mike Turnbull (talk) 10:41, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Hoary & Cullen328 I found a loophole to read most newspapers/magazines which limit how many articles you can read within a certain period, or have paywalls...

By archiving them on the Wayback Machine and Archive.today first.

Then I'll read the archived versions, which usually don't contain the restrictions, no matter how old or new the archived articles are.

I first noticed it (around 5 years ago) when my main daily local newspaper (along with its 4 sister titles, and most likely the 100s more newspapers/magazines owned by the parent company) decided to become a paid subscription model, and restricted how many articles you could read for free every month.

I remember it being 10 free articles a month which was ridiculous imo, as I only read the stories about local filming, and after a quick search, their 2019 T&C's confirm what I remember.

Recently I seem to be able to read more stories (unless I just think I've clicked on more than 10 stories a month, when I haven't), so they might have increased the number of articles you can read in a month without mentioning it anywhere, although it does say in the 2019 T&C's that breaking news, and court documents don't count towards the 10 articles limit, so that could be why.

There's also at least 5-10 random mirror sites websites on the internet which copy articles from various news sources word for word, so all you would need to do is search for an articles title word for word to find one of those random mirror sites, and read it for free. Danstarr69 (talk) 13:11, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Hoary, @Cullen328 - I removed several weak refs and poorly supported text on Rogynskyy's early career, added an open ref from Tech Crunch, and replaced the paywalled Bloomberg ref by an open Reuters ref. The in-depth Financial Times ref can be found in the open by Web-searching for the title :) That's not rare, in my experience. PTAL, and I can remove a few more weak refs if that's useful. Igor Markov 05:30, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Renaming Bangalore

Is it ok to move Bangalore to Bengaluru? — Akshadev™ 🔱 07:26, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Please see Talk:Bangalore and read, digest, and think about what's written there. If, having done this, you wish to propose moving to "Bengaluru", follow the regular procedure for such a proposal. -- Hoary (talk) 07:41, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

WP:MOVE for that procedure, see especially WP:BEFOREMOVING! SpookyTwenty (talk) 18:04, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Waiting for Wikipedia page/draft review

I wrote a draft of a Wikipedia page on March 8th, and it is still awaiting review. When I uploaded it, the expected waiting time was three months, but as of today, it has been four months. Do you think this is normal, or did I do something wrong? Here is the link to the draft. Thank you!" Franca47 (talk) 07:44, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Franca47, unfortunately it is normal. Actually it's worse than you seem to think. I quote: "This may take 4 months or more" (my emphasis). -- Hoary (talk) 08:29, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

@Franca47 You created the Italian version of this article in February and the English draft is clearly a translation of that. For copyright purposes, you need to follow the guidance at WP:TRANSLATE and HELP:HOWTRANS which include advice about which templates to use to show you have copied from within Wikipedia. Part of the reason the draft is slow to be reviewed is that there are a limited number of reviewers fluent in Italian who can verify the content against the sources. Mike Turnbull (talk) 11:15, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Thank you @Michael D. Turnbull

Could you please indicate as an example an English Wikipedia page that is a translation of an already existing Wikipedia page in another language? Thank you. Franca47 (talk) 13:53, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

@Franca47: You can find plenty of those at pages needing translation , in different stages of translation, quality and/or copyediting. Lectonar (talk) 14:12, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

@Franca47 One I have edited is Hessische Staatskanzlei. See its Talk Page and history for some places where it is mentioned it is a (partial) translation. Mike Turnbull (talk) 14:38, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Thank you very much for your advices! I added the translation template on the talk page as you all reccommended me to do. Franca47 (talk) 08:34, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Apologies if I've missed something, Michael D. Turnbull, but if Franca47 wrote the Italian Wikipedia article and is now contributing an English translation here, I don't think attribution is required (see WP:NOATT). Isn't it only if other editors have written the text that's being translated that attribution is needed? Cordless Larry (talk) 15:08, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

@Cordless Larry That's an interesting point I wasn't aware of. While Franca47 was the original author who first created it:Carmimari in February, by March (when work on the draft translation began) it had several contributing editors in its Italian edit history. Clearly we need a lawyer to sort this out (joke)! Mike Turnbull (talk) 15:22, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Thanks, Michael D. Turnbull. I think that Franca47 should be fine not to attribute if what's been translated is just their original Italian text, but if the contributions of any of those other editors have been included in what's been translated, then attribution is required (and perhaps it's best to provide it anyway, just to be on the safe side!). Cordless Larry (talk) 15:51, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

I will still add the attribution to the Italian page that I had already created. Thank you all. Franca47 (talk) 08:00, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

How can I see my article?

I have entered a page but if I search from google I cannot find it, have I skipped any steps? Cherielechat1.0 (talk) 12:03, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi Cherielechat1.0 and welcome to the Teahouse. User pages are not indexed by Google. Also see Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not, as Wikipedia is not a web host for self-promotion. Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 12:06, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Cherielechat1.0, please also note that your Userpage is not a place to store articles. Qcne (talk) 13:21, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

You will want to visit Articles for Creation to create and submit a draft. 331dot (talk) 13:24, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Cherielechat1.0 To be clear: Use WP:AFC to create a draft about Mori. All content in the draft must be supported by references. What you think and what you know is useless. Unless there are valid refs, don't bother. If you do decide to create a draft, do so by cutting all the content you have placed on your User page and pasting that into the draft.

IF (big if) you succeed in having your draft rviewed and accepted by a reviewer (a process that can take months), more time will pass before it is seen via a Google search. David notMD (talk) 15:23, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Sorry, the user page has been speedily deleted: A non-contributor's misuse of Wikipedia as a web host. If you need to reclaim the content to start a draft, follow the instructions given in the recent talk page message. Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 16:57, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

And Draft:Cherielechat1.0 has now been deleted as an unambiguous copyright infringement. Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 07:49, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

the emoji movie: the game

do article edits with emojis (outside of maybe usernames in tweets) get filtered on the spot? cogsan • (give me attention) • (see my deeds) 12:17, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi Cog-san. I'm not aware of such a filter on page content. Some characters are blacklisted in page names but a page can still be created by an administrator and edited by others. Are you trying to do something which doesn't work? PrimeHunter (talk) 13:51, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

i just noticed it was the one type of vandalism that never popped up in the edit histories, and found one edit with them filtered on an ip's log

and thanks

i should probably clarify that i really don't want to do that myself, not because it's almost always vandalism, but because i hate emojis cogsan • (give me attention) • (see my deeds) 14:13, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

@Cog-san Better not read Emoji, then. That article appears to confirm there isn't an edit filter. Mike Turnbull (talk) 10:19, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

frick!

but on a related note, it seems that actually exists as filter 680, and the emoji article is specifically whitelisted from it cogsan • (give me attention) • (see my deeds) 11:15, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

I'm lost on wikipedia

I do know how to use wikipedia but I want to learn more and useful things as a ip account. 2607:FEA8:551C:6200:AB8C:2E45:4401:1625 (talk) 22:39, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Hello and welcome to the Teahouse!

Could you tell us specifically what you would like to learn? (For example, Fighting vandalism) 🛧Layah50♪🛪 ( 話す? 一緒に飛ぼう！) 23:48, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

I am also curious as to why you are specifically interested in adding content to Wikipedia as an IP user, not that there's anything wrong with this, but it does have certain ramifications, such as not having a user page. Would you mostly be interested in adding content to Wikipedia? If so, what is the nature of the content that you would anticipate adding? Fabrickator (talk) 00:20, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi. Maybe see Wikipedia:IP users. Cwater1 (talk) 03:52, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Help

How to I switch to the old Wikipedia? Why is my screen so small? Not a Normal Username (talk) 04:26, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Hello @Not a Normal Username.

To switch to the old Wikipedia, go to the Preferences, located at the top of the page. Then, go to Appearance. You can change to the old version there.

Hope this helps! 🛧Layah50♪🛪 ( 話す? 一緒に飛ぼう！) 04:34, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

(Re-adding accidentally archived response) @Not a Normal Username: Welcome to the Teahouse. To go into further detail as to what Layah50 is talking about, go to Preferences → Appearance → Skin and select Vector legacy (2010). Your screen may be small if you have not unchecked Preferences → Appearance → Skin preferences → Enable limited width mode, which forces whitespace around article text. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 06:13, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

@Not a Normal Username: Specifically, the older skin that Wikipedia used until recently is Vector legacy (2010). JML1148 ^{(talk | contribs)} 07:35, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

@Not a Normal Username: If the screen is the only issue, there is a toggle in the extreme lower right corner to expand the screen size. 331dot (talk) 10:00, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Ok Not a Normal Username (talk) 21:14, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Wait i didnt do anything and my screen is already fixed Not a Normal Username (talk) 21:15, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Question about non-free image

Greetings, I am new to editing and uploading to wikipedia. Recently, I have been editing Toro Inoue. I uploaded an image taken from Sony, however it was removed due to it not being free content. I still wanted to use the image in order to display the character onto the page, I would like suggestion on what to do, thank you. Ohwelpwelp (talk) 05:15, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

The simple suggestion, Ohwelpwelp, is "Forget it", because the page already has an image that displays the character. But if you are sure that the image would be more informative and helpful than the one currently shown, please read and study Wikipedia:Non-free content criteria. -- Hoary (talk) 06:23, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Acknowledgement for any content changes in Wikipedia

I want you to know that on May, 2023, i have not made any kinds of content removal to Atlas Honda page. This is a false claim. Please make sure who did this. Thank you. https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:202.61.52.46&oldid=1154857719&diff=cur 202.61.52.46 (talk) 05:31, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Your IP did [1]. If you don't like seeing messages about edits made by previous users of the same IP then you should create a user account. And the diff you provided is for a warning for an edit made today by your IP, not the May edit. Meters (talk) 05:41, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

See WP:REGISTER Meters (talk) 05:44, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Instead for your views on the above point, the page for the Atlas Honda regarding the "Plant Shutdown is one hundred percent wrong. The Plant was not shut down. You should get notify about this information and make yourself up to date about the companies. 202.61.52.46 (talk) 11:47, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

IP editor. The citation for the plant shutdown at Atlas Honda is from Reuters, namely this report. If you have a reliable source which says otherwise, please raise the issue at Talk:Atlas Honda to reach a consensus as to what should appear in the article. Incidentally, that Reuters report said the plant would shut down not thet it did shut down, so you may well be correct but another source would be ideal. Mike Turnbull (talk) 12:01, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

When is a family tree a family tree?

Hello. I included the following diagram in article Bird, Savage & Bird to help readers understand a complex business and family relationship. It was during the embryonic years of America when merchants Bird Savage & Bird were banking agents for the American Government (before Barings took over). It was a relationship that even I was confused about before I drew out the chart. A fellow editor has removed it on justification that: " Wikipedia is not a genealogy reference - family trees should be included only when relevant to understanding a notable topic, and there's no indication why that would be the case here." I do not think this chart should be classed as a "Family Tree" and for the benefit of readers should remain in the article. Any thoughts folks?

Bird, Savage & Bird - Family connections

Thomas Bird (1694–1746) m Elizabeth Martyn (1695–1758) John Manning (1703–1738/9) m Sarah Coventry (1711–?) Robert Bird (1723–1788) m Mary Merttins (1722–1804) Mary Bird (1724–1780) m Abel Smith II (1717–1788) William Coventry Manning m Elizabeth Ryan Rebecca (Manning) Hamm John Savage Elizabeth Smith (1758–1789) William Manning (1763–1835) Elizabeth Manning (1756–1817) Martha Manning m John Laurens (1754–1782) Sarah Manning m Benjamin Vaughan (1751–1835) Benjamin Savage m Elizabeth Dunn Robert Bird (1760–1842) m (cousin) Lucy Wilberforce Bird (1768–1847) Henry Merttins Bird (1755–1818) Dotted line = married

Sidpickle (talk) 07:54, 20 June 2023 (UTC) Sidpickle (talk) 07:54, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

References

It doesn't look necessary to me, but the place to discuss would be Talk:Bird, Savage & Bird. Theroadislong (talk) 09:10, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

It doesn't look at all necessary to me either, and I agree with Theroadislong's suggestion; but my own tip is that to make it look more important (and perhaps even necessary), you might find some way of inserting simplified information about who among them had a position in the company Bird Savage & Bird, and when. This could be as simple as emboldening these particular people's names and adding the years within [    ]. -- Hoary (talk) 09:27, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

THANKS. I should have included the paragraph that accompanied this chart:

The Bird brothers were fortunate in their family connections: one of their uncles was Abel Smith (1717–1788), a prominent figure in the development of the Smith, Payne & Smiths bank. William Coventry Manning's son William married Abel Smith's daughter Elizabeth in 1786. Two of Manning's daughters also married into influential families: Sarah Manning married Benjamin Vaughan (1751–1835), and Martha Weatherell Manning married John Laurens, who was the son of wealthy South Carolina plantation owner and trader Henry Laurens.

However, I will let it go. I tried not to make it too complex. Picture is worth a thousand words, etc. John Laurens (killed in American War of Independence) was a close friend of Alexander Hamilton and his father Henry Laurens was one of the Founding Fathers of the United States plus a signatory of the Treaty of Paris. Benjamin Vaughan acted as a go between for the British during these negotiations. Bird Savage & Bird corresponded with George Washington and Alexander Hamilton during their years of business and the paragraph and chart should have shown the close ties they had with the influencers in America. Hey-Ho, move on. The Bird brothers were also cousins of William Wilberforce his mother (Elizabeth Bird) being their aunt. I have not found any reference to slavery in connection to Bird Savage & Bird but the people such as growers they dealt with in South Carolina most certainly were. Sidpickle (talk) 14:50, 20 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Sidpickle When most or all of them are famous as far as I know.

Wikipedia doesn't like it when non-famous relatives of famous people are added to the articles of those famous people, whether they're immediate family or not, as I've found out in the past when adding mothers, fathers, siblings, children etc.

There's lots of famous families I know of (however only a few I can think of off the top of my head), however the biggest is probably one I stumbled across a few months ago when updating IMDB, and realised that a family of 20 or 30+ people are all involved in filmmaking (it seems to be at least 1 of them in each department), and have made some massive record-breaking films for their country, yet for some reason, only 2 of them have Wikipedia articles.

Now that family definitely needs a family tree, something I've not tried before, but I might get around to it one day. Danstarr69 (talk) 18:23, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Thanks and good luck. Sidpickle (talk) 20:25, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

References

I just needed help retrieving my source

it was deleted but there are sufficient amount of resources and notability proving refferences of this person Article:Varun Pradip Dave 2402:8100:27C1:A127:7040:12B6:CCA4:DB7C (talk) 09:18, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

are you VPD7102001? lettherebedarklight晚安 09:25, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Multiple deletions of Varun Pradip Dave and Draft:Varun Pradip Dave. Do you mean these articles? Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 09:27, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

No i am not vpd70

No i am not vpd7102001, Yes those article i can can request or provide you the article i made from various liable sources. 2402:8100:27C1:A127:7040:12B6:CCA4:DB7C (talk) 09:46, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Hello, and welcome to the Teahouose. The first article was deleted on 2022-03-23 as "unambiguous advertising and promotion". Advertising is not permitted on Wikipedia.

The second was deleted on 2022-04-12 for multiple reasons: unambiguous advertising and promotion; copyright infringement; and creation by a blocked or banned user. The copyright infringement means that it will not be restored.

If you want to create an article on him, you will need to start again, following WP:YFA and making sure you pay attention to WP:notability and WP:BACKWARD ColinFine (talk) 10:25, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Thank you... So can I get the access to edit that page because it shows locked at this moment. 2402:8100:27C1:A127:7040:12B6:CCA4:DB7C (talk) 11:10, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Thank you... So can I get the access to edit that page because it shows locked at this moment. 2402:8100:27C1:A127:7040:12B6:CCA4:DB7C (talk) 11:55, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Both the article and the draft are locked against creation because of the long history of promotional time-wasting by a series of sockpuppets. If you are truly not part of that promotional cabal, I suggest that you present, here, at least three reliably published sources, each of which is completely independent of VPD - not written or published by him or his associates, and not based on interviews or press releases - and each of which contains significant coverage of him.

If you can do that, then that will indicate that he meets Wikipedia's criteria for notability, and an article is possible - provide those and you may be able to persuade an admin to allow you to create a draft. If you cannot find three such sources, then don't waste any more time on it. ColinFine (talk) 12:10, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Varun Pradip Dave (Born 7 October 2001) is a powerlifter, actor and ted talks (tedx) speaker from India.

Refferences

[2]https://www.ted.com/talks/dave_varun_never_let_your_dreams_die

[3]https://www.hindustantimes.com/how-i-did-it-my-journey-from-spindly-teen-to-strongman

[4]https://www.brut.media/in/sport/meet-gujarat-s-youngest-strong-man

[5]https://www.imdb.com/name/

[6]https://www.openpowerlifting.org/

[7]https://www.amazon.com/prime-video/actor/Varun-Pradip-Dave 2402:8100:27C1:A127:7040:12B6:CCA4:DB7C (talk) 12:46, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Every one of those links gives me error 404, because you have included part of the citation code not just the URL. But judging from their titles and origins, the only one that even might meet the tripartite condition I mentioned above (see WP:42) is the Brut media one. Until you provide some sources whose origin and title suggest that they actually might be independent and reliable, I'm not going to waste my time trying to read them. ColinFine (talk) 13:11, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Correction - looking at the URL and the title, I expect that the Brut media one is based on an interview, and not independent.

Please understand that Wikipedia is not interested in what the subject of an article says or wants to say about themselves, or what their associates say about them. Wikipedia is only interested in what people who have no connection with the subject, and who have not been prompted or fed information on behalf of the subject, have chosen to publish about the subject in reliable sources. ColinFine (talk) 13:12, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

[8]https://m.imdb.com/name/nm13620544/bio/

[9]https://www.amazon.com/prime-video/actor/Varun-Pradip-Dave/amzn1.dv.gti.315ebb4c-c4cc-452f-b9db-1d51401a05f5/

[10]https://ahmedabadmirror.com/varun-picks-two-golds/64704056.html

[11]https://www.brut.media/in/sport/meet-gujarat-s-youngest-strong-man-facaba69-4642-4a33-941a-49b29ffa68c8 2402:8100:27C1:A127:7040:12B6:CCA4:DB7C (talk) 13:19, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

I'm not going to waste any more of my time with you. Study WP:42 and WP:notability. ColinFine (talk) 13:30, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

IP/64 blocked for lta socking – dudhhr ^talk _contribs (he/they) 18:30, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

To repeat a point made by ColinFine, you will need to ask an Administrator permission to start a draft about VPD. I suggest you go to the Talk page of one of the Admins who had deleted the article or draft, make your case showing 3-4 best references, and declare that you are not one of the previously blocked editors. Honestly, given the long, bad history, it is unlikely you will get permission to proceed. David notMD (talk) 15:33, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Help with references

Im finding it difficalt to locate refrances for this building as it has been derelict for many years, and the only ones are in books. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Heatherlie_House_Hotel#References Q-conner (talk) 09:43, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

 Courtesy link: Draft:Heatherlie House Hotel Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 09:51, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi, Q-conner and welcome to the Teahouse. One thing you should do to start with is find references, then write the article to reflect what those refs actually say. Also read Help:Referencing for beginners. Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 09:49, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

You can use books as reference sources (unless they're self-published; etc). Sources don't have to be online. Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 10:00, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Write them from the news paper articals from 1900's ? Q-conner (talk) 09:56, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

@Q-conner: Yes, it's very common for articles to be written based off of historical sources. Also, you may need to rewrite your draft as a lot of it seems to be WP:OR. JML1148 ^{(talk | contribs)} 09:59, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

@Q-conner Your draft is full of WP:PEACOCK wording, especially in the WP:LEAD. Wikipedia strives to take a neutral tone Mike Turnbull (talk) 10:00, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

The draft is nowhere near ready for yet another resubmission for review. The edited lead still reads way too much like an advert: Heatherlie House Hotel situated in Selkirk, Scottish Borders, is a notable establishment with a rich historical background. The hotel is recognized for its captivating natural surroundings. The architectural design of the hotel harmoniously combines traditional charm with modern sophistication, resulting in an aesthetically pleasing and captivating structure. The interior of Heatherlie House Hotel is meticulously crafted, featuring opulent decor, Scottish textures, and tasteful furnishings that create an ambiance of both grandeur and comfort. Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 10:35, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

@Q-conner Not only that, but :"The interior spaces would be adorned with rich materials, such as dark wood paneling, intricate plasterwork, and decorative moldings." What's with the future tense? Did it not happen? Nick Moyes (talk) 11:17, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Also "likely features", "may include", "might incorporate". Seems like an attempt to circumvent / tone down the explicit use of puffery / POV. Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 11:28, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

I haven't viewed the draft, and here merely respond to Nick Moyes' question "What's with the future tense?" First, English lacks a future tense, as is carefully explained in The Cambridge Grammar of the English Language (CGEL). This of course doesn't mean that it lacks ways of talking about the future. Here, would is the preterite of will. It has various uses; but here, "Would is [...] used to express futurity in the past, futurity relative to the time referred to by the preterite". As for whether it happened, "the actualisation is virtually required to have already taken place" (CGEL, p.198). It's a common device in standard English. -- Hoary (talk) 12:29, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

@Hoary No tea for you for a whole month! Nick Moyes (talk) 14:11, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Q-conner, you need to start by deciding whether you want an article about the existing hotel, or about the building (which I assume was originally a laird's mansion, though your draft nowhere mentions this). Then:

1. Delete the entire current pile of unreferenced promotional guff.
2. Find several reliable independent published sources with extensive discussion of your chosen subject. Books will do fine.
3. If you can't find at least three such sources, give up. Your chosen subject does not warrant a Wikipedia article.
4. If you can find such sources, write a draft that is based entirely on what they say, citing them as you go. Maproom (talk) 14:24, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Does it comply with Wikipedia's content policies, particularly neutral point of view?

Hello. Can someone help me confirm whether this article am trying to edit complies with Wikipedia's content policies, particularly neutral point of view? I have edited some parts that seems to be biased. Dorian Rhea Debussy MaxPG88 (talk) 12:38, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

It seems okay to me. Is there a specific concern that you have that you haven't already addressed? 331dot (talk) 14:02, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Yes I have addressed everthing. So, is it okay to remove the Maintenance templates on that page? MaxPG88 (talk) 14:45, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

If you feel that you have addressed the concern raised by the maintenance template(and you aren't the one with the COI), you may remove it. 331dot (talk) 14:51, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

"this is my template. there are many like it but this one is mine"

is there any real problem with using custom templates for things like welcomes (for example, one more geared for music-centered accounts, or one that clarifies whether or not wikipedia is censored), userbox handling, or bludgeoning people with marine fauna?

this obviously means only things that go on user and talk pages, and i wouldn't risk using custom warnings cogsan • (give me attention) • (see my deeds) 14:24, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

@Cog-san: That is no problem at all!

For instance, I created {{subst:link current revision}} to easily get the permalink to a given page. I find it super-useful: compared to going through the page history, clicking the revision, copy-pasting the URL, I can just preview the source. As far as I can tell, there is no other template or user script doing a similar job, and nobody else ever uses mine (but maybe this shameless plug will fix that?). So that’s pretty strong evidence that my taste is uncommon.

The only things to watch would be performance-hogging templates. As long as you don’t use any of the magic words / parser functions marked "[expensive]" and colored in orange in the MW doc you should be fine. (If you don’t know what magic words are, you’re probably not using them.) Tigraan^{Click here for my talk page ("private" contact)} 15:15, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

nice

i guess that template would help with a decent warning one if i were to try it, even though it'd involve warning before reverting an edit

and fortunately, the templates i had planned out _{(in word so it doesn't show up in my sandbox history)} aren't really more complex than text, unfunny pictures whose copyright i'm looking into, and a small handful of links

and uh

are templates made in mediawiki or in a link my intellectually deprived nutrient disposal orifice somehow missed in here? cogsan • (give me attention) • (see my deeds) 17:37, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

I have read that last sentence three times, and I still don't know what you're trying to say.

But there is nothing to stop you creating user subpages as templates (provided they do not contravene WP:UPNO, of course) and transcluding them in your user page or elsewhere. Any page can be transcluded by using the double curly brackets: if there is no namespace given, it assumes "Template:", but you could just as well transclude User:Cog-san/mytemplates/1 or whatever, by {{User:Cog-san/mytemplates/1}} ColinFine (talk) 09:10, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

_{it means "dumb ass"}

so that's where it was

thanks

fortunately, nothing i want to make would break those rules, and the possibly maybe copyrighted image wasn't copyrighted at all cogsan • (give me attention) • (see my deeds) 11:37, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Found my first article with advertising content

Engro Corporation - an older revision had the worst of it, marketing buzzwords etc.

I've done my best to start with but it's still not especially WP:NPOV. Other than placing the {ad} tag, what else can I do to make sure it gets better?

Thanks! ElectronicsForDogs (talk) 15:54, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Compare my work with the previous state of things here... https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Engro_Corporation&diff=1161094512&oldid=1145655780 ElectronicsForDogs (talk) 16:02, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Get rid of a few of the citation neededs and put in a {{Verification}} banner at the top per WP:TAGBOMB. I will remove a lot of (not that much apparently) the unnecessary bold in the article as it is only needed for the first instance of a subject. ✶Mitch199811✶ 17:53, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Thank you. I appreciate your help ElectronicsForDogs (talk) 12:11, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

How was Wikipedia first created

Ok, I just want to know how and why you created Wikipedia? 103.116.167.239 (talk) 16:14, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi and welcome to the Teahouse. Some answers may be found here: History of Wikipedia. Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 16:20, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

For a more concise version if you only want an overview, you might try Wikipedia#History. Tollens (talk) 16:20, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Notoriety Issue

Hi there - I was told that the person I'm writing an article on doesn't seem to have enough notoriety. I'm not really understanding the descriptions provided for that. We've provided lots of reliable, secondary sources (like Essence, PBS, etc.) - and she even has a presidential appointment from US President Biden. So...I'm not really certain how much more notoriety they're looking for or why the many sources I've provided still don't seem to measure up? Many of her peers in the same field who have less publicity than she does have made it onto Wikipedia, so I'm not really understanding what the difference is. AndreaTheoJohn (talk) 17:14, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

 Courtesy link: Draft:Monica Rhodes - 199.208.172.35 (talk) 17:15, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Hello, AndreaTheoJohn, and welcome to the Teahouse! I haven't looked at the article in any depth yet, but I notice you use 'we' In your question. I see your username previously represented that of a company - if you are editing on someone's behalf or being paid to edit in any way, please see the conflict of interest guideline, the policy on paid editing if applicable, and please disclose that relationship if one exists. Tollens (talk) 17:24, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Sorry, I don't have time to go through all the references, but I did find three early on in the article that don't appear to give significant coverage of the subject (and that's one of the criteria to establish notability). See Golden Rule. Correct me if I'm wrong; otherwise recheck the coverage in the references you're providing:

• "She attended A.J. Moore Academy." She's not mentioned in the source about the reunion.
• "Rhodes’ career in historic preservation began with her 2008 involvement in a project". She's not mentioned in the source.
• "She played a critical role in identifying and engaging eight historic Black churches". She's not mentioned in the source.

You can still use such references to back-up facts in the article, but these won't add to her notability. It's also a matter of significant facts being verifiable by what is actually written or spoken in the sources, not just notability.

Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 17:41, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

I just went through the first half - that seems to be the case with a large majority of the sources. 'Significant coverage' is defined in WP:GNG by the following: "Significant coverage" addresses the topic directly and in detail, so that no original research is needed to extract the content. Significant coverage is more than a trivial mention, but it does not need to be the main topic of the source material. Almost all of the references provided discuss the HOPE program Rhodes is the director of, not Rhodes - while these do establish the notability of that program, there is only a passing mention of Rhodes, or no mention at all. Tollens (talk) 17:50, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

The impression I get is that the editor has got hold of a detailed resumé and has looked for references to back that up, rather than finding sources and then writing to reflect what the sources actually say. Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 18:14, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Hello, AndreaTheoJohn, and welcome to the Teahouse. In addition to the points that others have made, I'm afraid that your draft is hopelessly promotional in its language: it's full of phrases which are chosen to enhance the subject (eg "high-profile awards", "prestigious Loeb fellowship", "well-established publication", "recognized as a leading expert in"), as well as vapid marketing speak such as "continues to gain recognition through initiatives to leverage both public and private sector tools, emerging technologies, and unprecedented levels of community engagement to modernize the preservation space"). That is not what a Wikipedia article does: it summarizes, neutrally, what indepedent commentators have said about the subject. Wikipedia is not interested in what the subject of an article says or wants to say about themselves, or what their associates say about them. Wikipedia is only interested in what people who have no connection with the subject, and who have not been prompted or fed information on behalf of the subject, have chosen to publish about the subject in reliable sources.

If, as I suspect, you are associated with Rhodes, then you are likely to find it hard to write sufficiently neutrally about her - that is why we discourage editing with a conflict of interest. What you will need to do, having found those independent sources which contain significant coverage of her, is to forget everything you know or think about her, and write an encyclopaedia article based solely on what those sources say. (And if some of the reliable sources say things about her that you really don't like, you should put those things in, too).

Many people have completely wrong idea that "having a page" on Wikipedia is a good thing, something to aspire to, something to help their internet presence. That is not what Wikipedia is for, and promotion of any kind is forbidden. And there is no question of "deserving" or not deserving an article, because nobody in the universe, not even Jimmy Wales "has" an article.

An article about Rhodes, if one is accepted, will not belong to her, will not be controlled by her, will not necessarily say what she wants it to say, and will not be for her benefit, except incidentally.

As for the question of notability (not "notoriety"!): the criterion is about ensuring that there is enough independent reliably published material about the subject to base an article on. It may be that the other articles you are referring to do have adequate independent reliably published sourcing; or it may be that they don't, and should be improved or deleted. We have thousands and thouseands of articles, mostly old ones, that wouldn't be accepted if they were submitted now. See other stuff exists ColinFine (talk) 18:12, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Hamish Harding article - Circular sources

The Hamish Harding article is about a person presently missing on the mini-sub at the Titanic site. Most of the sources are very poor (e.g. mid-east websites and new sheets of little/no provenance). However, the mainstream media is now using the Wikipedia article verbatim. I think it's not good form to link at a discussion page to an outside source so I'll put an example website here in full (https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/jun/19/hamish-harding-the-british-explorer-missing-at-sea-near-the-titanic). The words and phrases are literally lifted from the wikipedia article (I edited a couple last night which no longer appear and they are quoted verbatim in the Guardian article). My question is this: Does the fact that the poorly sourced info has now been used by the mainstream media mean that those latter articles now amount to non-deprecated sources? One thing which has struck me here is now little is known about the subject (i.e. nothing in any MSM sources - for a billionaire, that seems v odd. Nothing in Forbes, Sunday Times Rich List. Nothing anywhere. No link to a big earning business. Nothing at all about business deals, etc, notably nothing in business publications. For the main part, no non-mid east sources to details about degrees, qualifications, etc. I don't doubt the guy is real (!) but the quality of the sources and info seems way too low to be used in a Wikipedia article. I can't see what part of WP:RS applies to cases of non-deprecated sources simply recycling deprecated ones. Any thoughts, anyone? All the best, Emmentalist (talk) 18:12, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Emmentalist, and welcome to the Teahouse. You're right: this is a recurring problem. See WP:CIRCULAR for the relevant policy. ColinFine (talk) 18:14, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Thanks very much for this, @ColinFine I'll look at that right away! All the best, Emmentalist (talk) 19:03, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

@Emmentalist: Earwig's copyvio detector is a Wikimedia Toolforge tool which is usually used to determine if a Wikipedia editor copied material verbatim from an outside source. But it is agnostic about who's-copying-whom, so it will also evaluate possible copying in the other direction. In this case, Earwig tags the likelihood of The Guardian copying from the Wikipedia article as "Unlikely (27%)". Note that a certain amount of common expressions being the same is not necessarily unusual; any article on him will list his various roles or professions, and so on. As the length of common strings gets longer, and the number of them goes up, it gets more suspicious. You can check Earwig's analysis yourself, and see what you think. Oh, and by the way, it's perfectly okay to add these links or have this conversation at the article Talk page, which at a minimum, should probably post a link to this discussion. Hope this helps, Mathglot (talk) 19:50, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Help with paraphrasing

I have been sanctioned and would like to avoid any further sanctions (see User_talk:Abecedare#Topic ban), so I feel it is good to ask here before I do anything. For the Rape_in_Afghanistan article, under the section Afghan Taliban, I want to add, "According to Amnesty International, since the Taliban seized control of Afghanistan in August 2021, they have violated the rights of females and destroyed the system of protection and support for those fleeing violence." Will it be acceptable?-1Firang (talk) 19:12, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

(Non-administrator comment) @1Firang: since your proposed addition and the linked article never mention Pakistan (the object of your T-ban) once, you are probably safe adding it. But that's just my opinion, and if I'm wrong you could be affected, and to quote the admin, "Skating at the edges of the topic-ban is treacherous." Why not pick out something completely different? Then you wouldn't have to pose the question. Mathglot (talk) 20:03, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

I have been editing Afghanistan related articles and nobody has objected, probably because it is not covered by my Topic ban. Now please let me know if that sentence needs to be paraphrased any more (especially the last bit, "the system of protection and support for those fleeing violence").-1Firang (talk) 02:03, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

References

Editing Page

Hi,

I work for the Punta Gorda Airport and I wanted to edit our wikipedia page. I wanted to add a section that includes nearby cities and large neighborhoods. Can I go ahead and edit the page myself? If I am listing specific cities or neighborhoods, can I add a hyperlink to that city or neighborhood's wikipedia page?

Thank you,

Casey CThamesPGD (talk) 19:43, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi @CThamesPGD, welcome to the Teahouse. Please review and comply with WP:PAID; then you can make suggestions on the article's talk page, Talk:Punta Gorda Airport (Florida). Information about nearby cities and neighborhoods doesn't seem all that relevant to me, but if independent secondary sources have mentioned important connections, you may have an argument. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 19:51, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Thank you! CThamesPGD (talk) 19:54, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

putting double brackets [[ ]] around a word or name, as in a city name, turns the word/name blue if there is an existing Wikipedia article. David notMD (talk) 02:35, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Thanks so much! CThamesPGD (talk) 12:02, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Once I make a suggestion on the talk page, how does it get approved? CThamesPGD (talk) 12:20, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Put edit request inside double curly brackets {{ }} at the beginning of your Talk entry. Doing that 'flags' your edit request to attract attention to a bevy of volunteer editors who help with this task. May take weeks before acted on. Be specific in your request. David notMD (talk) 13:52, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Thank you! CThamesPGD (talk) 14:36, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Help with CSS

Hello, fellow editors!

I am trying to revamp my userpage, and I added some CSS to make the text white (color: #fff), but headings are still black (at least in the Vector 2022 skin).

If anybody here could help me, it would be much appreciated. Here's where the problem is.

Edit: How can I also change link colors? QuickQuokka ^{[⁠talk • contribs]} 19:53, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Pinging @Levi_OP cus he knows this stuff. --QuickQuokka ^{[⁠talk • contribs]} 19:54, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

It isn't inheriting the style from the div because all headings are explicitly set to black (for some reason), so that's overriding the inherited style (you also can't just throw in a !important, since as an inherited style it will still be overridden). You could just use an h2 element instead of the wikitext header, and override its style as "color:inherit;" so that you only have to edit it in one place (<h2 style="color:inherit">About me</h2> instead of ==About me==). Tollens (talk) 20:06, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

If the text is going to be white, are you going to try to make the background a different color like black? ― Levi_OP^Talk 20:13, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Sorry, I somehow missed the link to the page in the first message. As far as I know, you cannot change the css of the headers and other non-html elements of the source. The only thing you could do is create another header that looks the same and put it over the other one. ― Levi_OP^Talk 20:15, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

You can change the CSS of headers - just use the actual HTML header elements rather than the usual wikitext ones - the wikitext gets converted anyway. Tollens (talk) 20:16, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Ahh, you're right. I either didn't know that or had forgotten as I don't use Wikipedia much anymore 😅. Thanks for the info! ― Levi_OP^Talk 20:21, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Missed your edit - do you mean the ones in the top header part, or a wikilink somewhere in the lorem ipsum text? Tollens (talk) 20:19, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

I suppose it doesn't really matter which actually - you can use {{colored link}} for that. Tollens (talk) 20:26, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

I need help making an article.

I just want to know how I make an article, I do not want that article wizard with no magical abilities whatsoever, I want to know to how make an article, not how to edit an article, how to make one, make one like how you would actually make it, not how to edit it. Idontneedmoneytohavefuntonight (talk) 23:36, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

@Idontneedmoneytohavefuntonight: Check out the information at WP:YFA, it should help you. The use of the wizard is optional, if you don't want to use it. RudolfRed (talk) 23:45, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

See WP:BACKWARD. In brief, if you have a topic in mind, find references, then write only what is verified by the references. David notMD (talk) 02:37, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Idontneedmoneytohavefuntonight, start your draft by gathering up several reliable sources that are entirely independent of your topic, that also devote significant, in-depth coverage to that topic. Format those into references, following the advice at Referencing for beginners. Now, read those references again as if you knew nothing about the topic. Neutrally summarize what those references say about the topic, placing each reference in the draft following the content it verifies.

To summarize, high quality references are equivalent to gold and diamonds on Wikipedia. Everything else is pro forma and utterly dependent on the references. Any halfway competent Wikipedia editor can quickly write an acceptable article if presented with four or five golden references, even knowing nothing in advance about the topic. But nobody can write an acceptable article when presented 100 mediocre references. Quality is vastly more important than quantity. Cullen328 (talk) 08:29, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Hello Idontneedmoneytohavefuntonight. Once you find at least 3 good references remember to rewrite the information in your own words. If you copy and paste what someone else wrote you will be violating copyright laws. Writing a good encyclopedia article is hard work, but take your time, and follow the guidelines linked in earlier comments. Best wishes on your Wikipedia projects. Karenthewriter (talk) 22:18, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Help needed

I know I was warned against canvassing at some point, but until someone refers to me of another convenient and ideal way of doing this, I'm just going to have to leave this here, in case for some reason, simply leaving the note on the talk page isn't effective. TrevortniDesserpedx (talk) 23:53, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

@TrevortniDesserpedx: You just posted that a few minutes ago and it is a heavily watched page. You need to be patient and give time for replies. RudolfRed (talk) 00:21, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

fixing ping @Trevortnidesserped: RudolfRed (talk) 00:22, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Despite a theory that humans evolved from frugivores, humans are not frugivores now. You edited to claim that at Human and Human nutrition and have correctly been reverted at both. At the Talk page for Human, your position has been refuted at length. David notMD (talk) 02:47, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

sandbox done - how to publish

I used he sandbox to practice creating a wikipedia page. The top of the page has my user name, not the name of the page that I want to create. When I click "publish" nothing happens Now that I know how to use the Visual Editor and have created a page in sandbox, how to I export this to my final page? The top of my final page needs to show the intended title, not the temporary title created in the sandbox. Carmullen (talk) 02:12, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Carmullen, and welcome to the Teahouse! To submit an article for review and publication, add {{subst:submit}} to the top of the page.
Before you do - I can tell you right away that it will be rejected if submitted in its current form due to a lack of references. Every Wikipedia article must show that the subject of the article is notable (which isn't the same as your and my typical definition) by demonstrating that there has been significant coverage of the subject in multiple reliable sources independent of the subject. I notice that your username also seems to match the name of the subject - it's strongly recommended that you do not write an article about yourself - for more information see the conflict of interest guideline, and read very carefully through the autobiography guideline; it's very possible you may not actually want an article about yourself even if you do reach the notability requirements. If you have any further questions or questions about any of the linked guidelines please don't hesitate to ask. Tollens (talk) 02:41, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

 Courtesy link: User:Carmullen/sandbox Tollens (talk) 02:45, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

(edit conflict) @Carmullen: Hi there! I have added the submission template to the draft for you. Please read it carefully and click on the links for further information. GoingBatty (talk) 02:46, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Created sections. DO NOT SUBMIT until references have been added to confirm all factual statements. Suggest developing refs in your Sandbox, and only after properly formated, cut/paste into draft. See HELP:Referencing for beginners. David notMD (talk) 13:47, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

How do you interact with editors?

How do you interact with the people who can edit the article? How do I know I am speaking with those individuals? Is there a requirement for them to review and respond to comments/requests about an article? Cmsmith93 (talk) 02:44, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

@Cmsmith93: Hi there! Anyone can edit the article. The best place to interact with the editors who choose to work on the article is on the article's talk page, such as the Talk:Robert F. Kennedy Jr. page you have posted on several times. This is a volunteer project - there is no "requirement" for anyone to review and/or respond to comments/requests about an article. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 02:49, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

To clarify - everyone can edit almost every article, but there are some that are protected. Almost everyone that participates in discussions on the talk page of a protected article does have the required permissions to edit most protected articles, however. Tollens (talk) 02:52, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

@Tollens: You are correct, and thank you for clarifying. For example, the Robert F. Kennedy Jr. has extended confirmed protection, so only editors with 30 days' tenure and at least 500 edits can edit it. GoingBatty (talk) 02:57, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

There may be no requirement, but if you're making controversial edits, not communicating has the potential to lead to a block. You should at least be aware of how to communicate, incase you need to. Here's an explanatory essay on the topic I like. Skarmory (talk • contribs) 04:49, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

@Cmsmith93: There are four major areas where you can talk to editors:

• 1: On people's talk pages, if you want to talk to one person specifically.
• 2: On the talk page of the article you're working on, which would have your edits appear in the watch list of other editors who are watching the article for changes and updates.
• 3: On the talk page of Wikiprojects. Every article is part of one or several Wikiprojects, where people who are interested in those subject(s) are most active. This is best for more general feedback or help with an article.
• 4: Here in the Teahouse! If you need help with or have questions about Wikipedia in general.

ReneeWrites (talk) 11:58, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

How to create a new page for article?

I want to create a new page with new username for someone's biography but i'm not able to get through. Vishwa Salot (talk) 06:23, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

@vishwa salot: see help:your first article for our guidance on this. lettherebedarklight晚安 06:30, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Vishwa Salot, please understand that there is absolutely no connection between a someone's Username and the title of any articles they wish to create. You have your username, which is unique to your Wikipedia account as an individual, and nobody else should ever be allowed to use your account. Using your account named Vishwa Salot, You can attempt to create an article (it's difficult, so good luck) about anything you choose: many users here have created dozens of different articles. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 46.65.228.117 (talk) 08:03, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Does a vulgar stage name comply with content policies?

I recently was surprised a popular singer and songwriter with a complete genius article, more than a million monthly listeners on Spotify, and radio presence has no article associated to them. They go by a rather vulgar stage name, and I am not sure how to proceed in creating an article without violating content policies with the use of their stage name, as well as created songs with rather vulgar naming too. I am also a new account, so I do not want to preemptively ban myself. Any guidance would be greatly appreciated. Iheartdjagger (talk) 07:11, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

@iheartdjagger: we don't have content policies; wikipedia is not censored. our content disclaimer says as such. lettherebedarklight晚安 07:22, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

While it's true that Wikipedia is WP:NOTCENSORED, it does have lots of "content policies" (at least how I think the term is defined). As for whether the stage name should be used, the relevant guideline most likely is going to be WP:COMMONNAME. -- Marchjuly (talk) 07:32, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Iheartdjagger, your statement about a complete genius article, more than a million monthly listeners on Spotify, and radio presence is completely irrelevant in a discussion about whether or not a performer is eligible for a Wikipedia biography. The inclusion of a mild term like "Erotica" in her stage name is also utterly irrelevant. We have article with far more explicit titles than that. Pay close attention: The only thing that matters is whether or not this entertainer has been the subject of significant, in-depth coverage in reliable sources that are entirely independent of this entertainer. That is it in a nutshell, and everything else is a distraction. Cullen328 (talk) 07:51, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Iheartdjagger, not knowing what "a complete genius article" might be, I clicked on the link you provided, and arrived at a page that has only a small amount of text, which seems to be contributed by interested members of the public. If I'm right, please see "user-generated content". -- Hoary (talk) 09:47, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Iheartdjagger, just to expand on what the other editors have said.

Check out the Wikipedia:Notability (music) policy, which details if the singer qualifies for the article based on the specific notability requirements. Note that the Genius page doesn't count as it is Wikipedia:User-generated content, and Spotify listener figures don't count as that's a Wikipedia:Primary sources.

Instead, you need to find multiple sources which are reliable and show significant coverage. Then, simply summarise these sources using neutral language.

If you manage this, then there will be no issues with the vulgarity of the artist or song names, as Wikipedia is not censored.

Hope that helps, Qcne (talk) 10:30, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

FYI, an article on her was deleted by discussion at articles for deletion six months ago. Make sure the concerns from that discussion (namely, that she did not meet the general notability guideline) are addressed if you decide to create a new article on her. Skarmory (talk • contribs) 10:57, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Thank you! I think the best thing I can do for now is link notable informational pages about her to her page request, as most notable sources are from tabloids and community involvement. Iheartdjagger (talk) 18:21, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

@Iheartdjagger Wikipedia does in practice do a bit of censorship of over the top things like removing the gallery section on the article Butt plug or removing the pictures from Dick pic (men would constantly post their own on the page), but her name is not vulgar at all. We have tons of articles like Erotic literature Erotica and Autoeroticism that all have this in their titles. We have articles with way more vulgar names which I won't mention. You should focus on notability not her name. Give independent news sources commenting on her Immanuelle ❤️💚💙 (talk to the cutest Wikipedian) 19:13, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

@Iheartdjagger There are odd exceptions to "Wikipedia is not censored", such as attack pages (eg "Mr XYZ is dumb"), though that's not relevant here. Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 19:39, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

i have done a artical about niyabudheen ka it is not working in public

i have done a artical about a philanthropist named niyabudheen ka who work as founder of winborne public trust. Winborne (talk) 12:20, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Winborne. Courtesy link. You don't ask a question. Unfortunately your sandbox article is not appropriate for Wikipedia:

- it is entirely unsourced. Every article on Wikipedia must have sources.

- it is full of promotional language. Every article on Wikipedia must be written from a neutral point of view.

- it reads as a resumé or curriculum vitae, not an encyclopaedic article. Wikipedia is not to be used for self-promotion.

- there is no reference to if Niyabudeen is notable in the Wikipedia context. All biographical articles must pass the notability threshhold.

- your sandbox is not a place to create new articles that meet the Wikipedia policies, but a place to experiment with the process of editing Wikipedia. If you wish to create a new article please see Wikipedia:Articles for creation.

If you have any personal or professional relationship with Niyabudeen you must disclose your conflict of interest immediately.

I hope that helps, Qcne (talk) 12:34, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Please also note, @Winborne, that your Wikipedia username goes against the Wikipedia:ORGNAME policy as it seems to be representing the name of the organisation Winborne Public Trust. You should request a Wikipedia:Changing username immediately. Qcne (talk) 12:40, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Qcne, it is not correct that your sandbox is not a place to create new articles that meet the Wikipedia policies. It was the principal place to do so before the Draft: namespace was introduced, and many people still use their sandbox to draft articles. Help:My sandbox says My sandbox is a feature which gives you a place to practice editing, either to build a draft for later publication in the main encyclopedia, or just to practice formatting with wiki markup syntax (emphasis added).

I think Draft space is the preferred place now, but user sandboxes are perfectly acceptable places to create new drafts. ColinFine (talk) 17:34, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

we need help to publish our agency profile on wikipedia

perpetual agency is well known agency in Saudi and Bahrain, we have tried to create our agency profile on wikipedia but every time our content and profile is rejected and banned. kindly help us create new profile Ahmedalmassari (talk) 14:27, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Ahmedalmassari. I am afraid you do not understand the purpose of Wikipedia. Wikipedia is not a place for any type of self-promotion or advertisement. It is not a business directory or a marketing platform.

If your agency meets the Wikipedia:Notability (organizations and companies) policy, then an editor may create an article. However, you would not own this article. And as you have a clear Wikipedia:Conflict of interest you would not be permitted to edit that article either.

Speaking of conflict of interest, as you presumably work for the company, you must immediately declare this on your User Page.

I hope that helps, Qcne (talk) 14:34, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Ahmedalmassari: there are no 'profiles' on Wikipedia; we are not a business directory or a social media platform like LinkedIn, etc., we are an encyclopaedia which contains articles on topics that have been deemed notable. If your agency isn't notable per WP:GNG, it isn't possible to include an article on it in Wikipedia. Even if it is notable, such an article must not be written in a promotional manner, and it shouldn't ideally be written by you. (It can be written by you, although you aren't allowed to publish it yourself directly, but must put it through an AfC review. In any case, you and anyone else with a relationship to the agency must first make a conflict-of-interest disclosure, see WP:COI.) Best, -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 14:34, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi, and welcome to Wikipedia! In general, you can't create your agency's profile on Wikipedia because of the conflict of interest. If your agency is notable, it will be written by someone else. The person who loves reading (talk) 23:37, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Help needed at Indian cinema task force

We have an editor at Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Film/Indian_cinema_task_force#Pinkvilla_is_unreliable_for_box_office_figures who has removed another editor's talk page comments. I am involved, so I am hesitant to take action myself to undo the removal and warn the editor lest it heighten the drama. I am not sure we are at the point of needing to go to ANI. Could we get an experienced uninvolved editor to review the situation and take any action that might be deemed appropriate?  — Archer1234 (t·c) 14:44, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Suggest edits

can you check my sandbox article and suggest edits to me Fahim Mostafa324 (talk) 14:54, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

 Courtesy link: Draft:Urban photography and/or Draft:Microscopic Photography (?) Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 14:59, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Fahim Mostafa324. Courtesy link. Wikipedia is only interested in summarising what independent third party reliable sources say about a topic. Your article instead reads like an essay and is almost completely unreferenced: every article on Wikipedia must have sources.

Besides, we already have an article for urban photography at Street photography. If you'd like to make edits to that article, please ensure that every edit you make is constructive and backed up by a reliable source as above.

Hope that helps, Qcne (talk) 15:05, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

What you have written, for example "Microscopic photography is a captivating art form that enables us to explore the hidden beauty present in our surroundings." is your personal thinking. That has no place in a Wikipedia article. All content must be information verified by references. David notMD (talk) 15:09, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

thank you

will try to modify these Fahim Mostafa324 (talk) 15:12, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

street photography is not the same as urban photography

that's why i decided to create a new aricle Fahim Mostafa324 (talk) 15:11, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

@Fahim Mostafa324 Your draft has many of the hallmarks of the sort of nonsense produced by a chatbot. Is that how you created it? Mike Turnbull (talk) 15:11, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

no

does that seem like it? Fahim Mostafa324 (talk) 15:12, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

It does not read like a proper Wikipedia article as it seems to be full of Wikipedia:Original research. Wikipedia articles should only summarise what independent third party sources say about the subject. Qcne (talk) 15:14, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

it seems to me the whole article needs to be re written again.

thanks for the overview.

will take time to bring up new ideas. Fahim Mostafa324 (talk) 15:23, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

@Fahim Mostafa324 The draft says that further reading can be found at The Art of Urban Photography: Capturing the Essence of City Life." Photography Journal, vol. 15, no. 2, 2019, pp. 45-60. By John Smith No such journal exists in Google Scholar, nor anywhere else I can find. Please provide a URL link or a digital object identifier Mike Turnbull (talk) 15:17, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

I can't find "Urban Photography: How to Capture the Heart of a City" by Neil Ta or "Urban Photography: A Beginner's Guide to Capturing the Soul of the City" by Markus Hartel or "Introduction to Electron Microscopy" by M. Abdullah Khalid either. These books don't seem to exist. @Fahim Mostafa324, you created these two articles with a chatbot like ChatGPT didn't you? Qcne (talk) 15:23, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

i wrote the article myself

i asked for reference there

i didn't know it gave fake reference

I apologize for that Fahim Mostafa324 (talk) 15:25, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

You have given four fake references. That is not a coincidence. I think either you did generate the articles with AI or you are purposely creating misinformation? Please closely read Wikipedia:Five pillars. Qcne (talk) 15:27, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

I'm sorry i gave ref without verifying

But i assure you these articles are of my own writing

https://roysviewfinder.com/urban-photography/

I have a website where i blog and i have blogged on this

it's of my own knowledge

i'm working on finding proper ref books this time Fahim Mostafa324 (talk) 15:31, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

So why did you make up four fake convincing-sounding references? I cannot think of a single reason why you would do that? Qcne (talk) 15:33, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

i didn't read any books on this

i read blogs and articles

i gave those as ref

i didn't know the chatbot gave fake ref

it's my mistake that i didn't verify them

i'm sorry for that

i thought they were real

it did sound convincing Fahim Mostafa324 (talk) 15:35, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Ah, so you did write the articles using a chatbot? Do not do that in the future, it is contrary to the purpose of Wikipedia: Wikipedia:Purpose. Qcne (talk) 15:38, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Not the article

the book names only

i told it give me ref on books on urban photography

it gave me names

i copied them

but the whole article is written by me Fahim Mostafa324 (talk) 15:40, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Well, please never do that again! Read Hallucination (artificial intelligence) to understand why. Qcne (talk) 15:41, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

@Fahim Mostafa324, you should find valid sources first, then write the article based on those sources. Please read WP:BACKWARD. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 15:29, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

worth mentioning this is not original content

i have learned over this topic through reading third party articles Fahim Mostafa324 (talk) 15:33, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Your own knowledge is precisely Wikipedia:Original research. Wikipedia articles should only summarise what reliable independent third party sources say about the subject. Qcne (talk) 15:34, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

@Fahim Mostafa324, writing a Wikipedia article is very, very different from writing a blog. If you haven't reviewed Help:Your first article, I'd recommend doing so now. It's long, but please read it carefully - it will probably save you problems in the future. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 16:10, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

@Fahim Mostafa324: Your page at Draft:Microscopic Photography seems to cover the same topic as the existing article Micrograph. If you have any referenced information that's not covered in our article, you may want to add it there rather than trying to create a new article on the same topic. Deor (talk) 23:46, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Link to Police Interceptors Episodes

Hello, can you please tell me what has happened to the link for "Police Interceptors episodes". None of the episode links work on "Police Interceptors" main page. Thank you for your help. Davidsmith2015 (talk) 15:57, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Davidsmith2015, welcome to the Teahouse. List of Police Interceptors episodes was turned into a redirect to Police Interceptors yesterday by Mattdaviesfsic. You can navigate directly to the redirect via this link and check the page history. I'd recommend starting a discussion with Mattdaviesfsic at Talk:Police Interceptors if you wish to contest the edit. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 16:03, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Adding references

Hi. Can I know what's the actual template to add references into articles? I added one or two somewhere, and copied the references already there but I'm still a bit confused as it's different everywhere Tresspasser10 (talk) 16:17, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Tresspasser10. There are many citation templates available. You can find them at Wikipedia:Citation templates. Cullen328 (talk) 17:14, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

So there is no specific rule on as to which one to use? If I'm creating an article, I can choose any one template? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tresspasser10 (talk • contribs) 17:58, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

@Tresspasser10 The only article your account has edited is Miftah Ismail. Each individual reference you place into it should use the most appropriate template available. If the citation is to a book (typically with an ISBN) then use {{cite book}}. If from a newspaper, then {{cite news}}; if from a website, then {{cite web}} etc. It would be unusual for any article or draft to only contain one type of citation. Mike Turnbull (talk) 11:07, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Hello ! Je suis interesee au Pre Saint Gervais

Hello! Je suis interesse a l'histoire du 'Pre Saint Gervais' existe -t-il un livre sur l'histoire du nom des rues le concernant? Plus particulierement la'Villa des Lions' son origine et ses habitants? (Ma Maman y a grandie!) Toutes iniformations seront les bien venues👀🌞🤔👍❤️🕊🙏🏻 Hirgorom252 (talk) 17:07, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Hirgorom252, welcome to the Teahouse on English Wikipedia. If you prefer to converse in French, I'd recommend asking your question at the equivalent page over on French Wikipedia - here. If you're fine with English, then I'd recommend heading over to one of the appropriate WP:Reference desks here on English Wikipedia, where you might find folks willing to dig up information for you. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 17:15, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Translation of the original post (via bot), for the curious: "Hello! I am interested in the story of 'Pre Saint Gervais' is there a book on the history of street names about him? More particularly the 'Villa des Lions' its origin and its inhabitants? (My Mom grew up there!) All iniformations will be welcome". 199.208.172.35 (talk) 17:18, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

The OP is probably not a French native speaker either. The post contains multiple language mistakes; in particular, the complete absence of any accent (interessé, Pré, particulièrement, etc.) are a typical sign of a non-native speaker.

The wp-fr article fr:Le Pré-Saint-Gervais is fairly long (arguably, too long) and it devotes the whole of one sentence to the Villa des Lions. Tigraan^{Click here for my talk page ("private" contact)} 11:32, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Valerie Carter page - need help!

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

---

I need one on one assistance with wikipedia's Valerie Carter page. There is some misinformation on it I would like to correct. OohChild (talk) 17:32, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Hello, OohChild, and welcome to the Teahouse! You should be able to edit that page yourself, but I'm happy to help - what do you need? Tollens (talk) 17:36, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Thank you Tollens. I have not done this before and need assistance.

Here are the changes and additions needed:

1. Under BIOGRAPHY

Remove Midnight Over Honey River in last sentence. (This is a bootleg album that the estate went to court over and just received the final judgement in their favor and would like to get it removed.)

2. Under OTHER WORK:

Replace last paragraph with:

In 2018 her friend, Kathy Kurasch, and her sister, Jan Carter, formed Cowboy Angel Records to release the first posthumous stand-alone album of previously unreleased material by Carter. It includes unreleased tracks recorded during her career, including "I Got Over It", co-written by Prince.

In 2022 they released The Lost Tapes Vol 2. (reference: https://www.discogs.com/master/2613353-Valerie-Carter-The-Lost-Tapes-Vol2)

3. Under DISCOGRAPHY STUDIO ALBUMS:

Remove Midnight Over Honey River

Add The Lost Tapes Vol 2 (2022) OohChild (talk) 17:42, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

@OohChild, are you somehow affiliated with the estate/family? If so, you should familiarize yourself with Wikipedia's guideline on editing with a conflict of interest. Here is a link to the guideline: WP:COI. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 17:48, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Thank you OohChild (talk) 17:58, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

1. Would you be able to provide any citation for Midnight Over Honey River being a bootleg album? Even if so, the more appropriate edit would likely be to say instead that the album was not officially released rather than simply deleting the line, as it is an album that was released, regardless of who released it.
2. Are you only looking to add the second part you have there? Why are the changes you made to the first line an improvement?
3. Again, I'd much rather mark the album with a footnote than remove the line, and also need a source for that as I can't seem to find one online. I'd be happy to add the missing album.

Please also review the conflict of interest guideline as mentioned by the IP editor above if you are in any way affiliated with the subject of the article, and please disclose whether or not such a relationship exists. Tollens (talk) 17:57, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Yes, I have documentation to support this and I have now gone through the COI guidelines and made a request. Thank you so much. OohChild (talk) 17:59, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Hello, OohChild. The place to discuss this is Talk:Valerie Carter. ColinFine (talk) 17:41, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Reliable sources for Colleen Ballinger.

I’ve noticed that YouTuber Colleen Ballinger has been in the news for inappropriate relationships with fans. Anytime I try to add a source, I’m told it’s unreliable. I’m wondering if Rolling Stone and Newsweek and MSN are reliable sources. Ive posted on the Colleen Ballinger talk page about this, but honestly some editors seem upset with me and one editor said I was wasting everyone’s time. Are these reliable sources? https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-features/colleen-ballinger-miranda-sings-youtube-fans-allegations-1234774947/

https://www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/lifestyle-buzz/it-felt-incredibly-sexually-violating-former-fan-of-colleen-ballinger-shares-nasty-experience-amid-allegations-against-the-miranda-sings-comedian/ar-AA1cBv4c?li=BBnbcA0

https://www.newsweek.com/miranda-sings-youtube-tiktok-colleen-ballinger-children-1806615

Thank you if anyone can answer if the sources I listed above are considered reliable. Paige Matheson (talk) 18:34, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

@Paige Matheson: Welcome to the Teahouse! I took a quick look at the Colleen Ballinger article and talk page. Instead of asking whether some web pages are reliable source, we should first ask whether the content is important enough to add to the article. We can have multiple reliable sources detailing what Bradley Cooper ate for lunch or what Kim Kardashian wore to get coffee and be confident that the information is 100% accurate. However, that doesn't mean it's worth adding to the article. It might be worthwhile to wait a few weeks to see whether Ballinger's issues are forgotten or whether this has significant impact. If it's the latter, you might want to suggest the text to be added to the article in addition to your sources. Hope this helps! GoingBatty (talk) 20:30, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Thank you.

Paige Matheson (talk) 15:59, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

HELP - Big messes on Wikipedia and Wikimedia commons concerning Wilhelm (Giovanni) von Plüschow (18 August 1852 – 3 January 1930) and Wilhelm von Gloeden (September 16, 1856 – February 16, 1931),

Extended content

Giovanni Dall'Orto in Milan, Italy is a PhD historian that has contributed tons of stuff to Wikipedia and Wikimedia prior to 2003. His Italian website: (La gaya scienza - Site about homosexuality and culture (giovannidallorto.com) in not a secure website and was last updated in 2012, so most likely he's dead now. He has no talk page on Wikimedia! I've been downloading his file in Italian auto-translated by Microsoft translate in Edge Chromium on my new Windows 11 HP desktop computer. My point is that everything I have been researching for the past year is already on Wikipedia AND Wikimedia under his former IP address in Italy and has been selectively used by editors at Wikipedia AND Wikimedia without citations... Yet not taken down because??? I don't get it!!! This subject of Giovanni Dall'Orto in Milan, Italy is a PhD historian that has contributed tons of stuff to Wikipedia and Wikimedia prior to 2003. His Italian website: (La gaya scienza - Site about homosexuality and culture (giovannidallorto.com) in not a secure website and was last updated in 2012, so most likely he's dead now. He had no talk page! I've been downloading his file in Italian auto-translated by Microsoft translate in Edge Chromium on my new Windows 11 HP desktop computer. My point is that everything I have been researching for the past year is already on Wikipedia AND Wikimedia under his former IP address in Italy and has been selectively used by editors at Wikipedia AND Wikimedia without citations... Yet not taken down because??? I don't get it!!! This subject of Gloeden and Plüschow is really f***ed-up, and at every turn of every page and category. Very little was actually uploaded by Giovanni Dall'Orto when he was actually logged-in, and most was just tagging his old IP address. What will it take to get the community to fix all of this mess? I've tried and because I'm a green-horn administrators are reverting my edits and threating me texts citing the policies for being banned. is really f***ed-up, and at every turn of every page and category. Very little was actually uploaded by Giovanni Dall'Orto when he was actually logged-in, and most was just tagging his old IP address. What will it take to get the community to fix all of this mess? I've tried and because I'm a green-horn administrators are reverting my edits and threating me texts citing the policies for being banned. What does it take to get the community to straighten this out??? What I have been attempting to do in edits is based on already existing uploaded material. StevenJoelSpeirs (talk) 20:09, 21 June 2023 (UTC) Links at Wikipedia: Guglielmo Plüschow, Wilhelm von Gloeden. Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 20:27, 21 June 2023 (UTC) You should familiarize yourself with WP:COPYOTHERS. Ruslik_Zero 20:25, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

StevenJoelSpeirs, what you write is long, repetitive, and confusing. You ask "What will it take to get the community to fix all of this mess? [...] What does it take to get the community to straighten this out???" But unfortunately by this point I've lost the plot (if there is one). Just what is the problem, or what are the problems, related to text in en:Wikipedia? You seem to be additionally concerned with some problem(s) "at Wikimedia". For a problem or problems at Wikimedia Commons, ask at Wikimedia Commons. Concision is a virtue. -- Hoary (talk) 22:30, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Please excuse the copying, just attempting to parse this for others' benefit:

Giovanni Dall'Orto in Milan, Italy is a PhD historian that has contributed tons of stuff to Wikipedia and Wikimedia prior to 2003. His Italian website: (La gaya scienza - Site about homosexuality and culture (giovannidallorto.com) in not a secure website and was last updated in 2012, so most likely he's dead now. He has no talk page on Wikimedia! I've been downloading his file in Italian auto-translated by Microsoft translate in Edge Chromium on my new Windows 11 HP desktop computer. My point is that everything I have been researching for the past year is already on Wikipedia AND Wikimedia under his former IP address in Italy and has been selectively used by editors at Wikipedia AND Wikimedia without citations... Yet not taken down because??? I don't get it!!!...This subject of Gloeden and Plüschow is really f***ed-up, and at every turn of every page and category. Very little was actually uploaded by Giovanni Dall'Orto when he was actually logged-in, and most was just tagging his old IP address. What will it take to get the community to fix all of this mess? I've tried and because I'm a green-horn administrators are reverting my edits and threating me texts citing the policies for being banned...What I have been attempting to do in edits is based on already existing uploaded material.

Rotideypoc41352 (talk · contribs) 01:36, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Thank you for cutting the repetition, Rotideypoc41352, but what's left is still incomprehensible. "[Contributing] tons of stuff to Wikipedia and Wikimedia prior to 2003" would make him an early contributor. It:Wikipedia reports L'utenza "Giovanni Dall'Orto" non è registrata. But "everything I have been researching for the past year is already on Wikipedia AND Wikimedia under his former IP address in Italy". So maybe it's all as an IP. Well, which IP? It "has been selectively used by editors at Wikipedia AND Wikimedia without citations": whether or not an editor is logged in, their contributions can normally be located via article histories. Or have the revisions been deleted? Et cetera. Perhaps StevenJoelSpeirs would care to rephrase. -- Hoary (talk) 02:09, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Edit summary on StevenJoelSpeirs's (SJS) 20:48, 19 June 2023 (UTC) edit for the Guglielmo Plüschow article reads: Lengthened the biography from Italian encyclopedia translated into English by Google translator and copy pasted here. So, text may have been translated from the it:Guglielmo Plüschow. That and several other edits on the enwp article have been suppressed, presumably because they were found to be copyvio or close paraphrase of giovannidallorto.com. I infer that SJS is arguing that this is a false positive by asserting that one of the contributors to the it-wiki article, G.dallorto, is the author of the copyrighted content and has released it under a compatible license by copying it to Wikipedia. Rotideypoc41352 (talk · contribs) 05:55, 22 June 2023 (UTC) and 05:56, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Rotideypoc41352, you are refreshingly lucid. Thank you. ¶ In his user talk page, G.dallorto signs himself as "Giovanni Dall'Orto". (If we're going to be legalistic about this, he doesn't explicitly declare that he is Giovanni Dall'Orto, but it's clear that he's happy to leave this impression.) But for "G.dallorto" (who has contributed as recently as one week ago) to say, or to give the impression, that he's Dall'Orto isn't enough. Instead, Dall'Orto must say -- in Italian, French, Spanish or of course English -- that he's "G.dallorto". For this purpose, SJS can invite him to contact VRT. ¶ The history of "Talk:Pancrazio Buciunì" shows that very recently a very large addition was twice made by SJS, twice reverted by AzaToth, and hidden. The addition was of a draft article. Putting aside for a moment the (more important) matter of authorship and copyright, posting a long draft is not what a talk page is for. -- Hoary (talk) 09:09, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Abbreviations or full

If I come across words like "It is" or "It's", should I change one to the other? What is correct by our standards here on WP? Iljhgtn (talk) 22:14, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

If it(i)s in a direct quotation, Iljhgtn, you shouldn't change it. Otherwise, convention here says to avoid "it's", "isn't", "won't", "they'll" and the like; and instead to use the more formal alternatives. -- Hoary (talk) 22:21, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

ok, so inside a quotation, leave it, otherwise, it is okay to change to the full form. what sort of edit summary would you leave for that kind of change? Is that a "copy edit"? Iljhgtn (talk) 22:22, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi Iljhgtn. MOS:CONTRACTION for more details, but contracted forms generally shouldn't be used in article prose. -- Marchjuly (talk) 22:25, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

ok cool Iljhgtn (talk) 22:26, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

@Iljhgtn: Welcome to the Teahouse! I would leave an edit summary of "expanded contraction". Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 22:28, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

ok Iljhgtn (talk) 22:29, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

I would suggest somehow also adding the link MOS:CONTRACTION to your edit summary. Finally, if you're going to go around looking for contractions to expand, just make sure you don't accidentally get caught up in any edit warring when you do. Some people might either not know about or might not care about MOS:CONTRACTION. So, if you come across such a person who keeps reverting back to the contracted form, bring up to matter on the article's talk page and explain why the change needs to be made. -- Marchjuly (talk) 01:04, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

that is good advice. i do not (almost said don't there) plan on "going to go around looking for contractions to expand", but that is still good to know Iljhgtn (talk) 15:57, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Little box that says "OBJ" i think

sometimes i am copyediting or looking for out of place punctuation or something, and I see this little box that seems to say "OBJ" in it between a final word and a period or a source. Anyone know what this is about? I use visual editor. Iljhgtn (talk) 22:42, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

 is a unicode placeholder character. Not sure why it would appear in the visual editor, though. Edward-Woodrow :) _[talk] 23:09, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Possibly a remnant of some old copy-paste. If someone copied text from Word or similar which included an image or other embedded object it might show up as  in Wikitext. MKFI (talk) 12:36, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

what does the OBJ even stand for? what is unicode placeholder character? i do not undersstand what any of that means. Iljhgtn (talk) 15:58, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

@Iljhgtn: The OBJ is an abbreviation of "object" and  is the "object replacement character" in Unicode. It's a replacement character, and those are also sometimes called a placeholder character. Specifically, the OBJ character is used to tell the computer that, where the OBJ character is, something other than text (an "object" of some kind) should appear, such as an embedded image in a PDF. Usually the reason it shows up is because someone copied text from one system/program/etc to another, but only kept the text while copying without the bringing along object associated with that text, so the OBJ has nothing to replace and is now visible. Hopefully this helps at least a little!

rtrb (talk) 17:16, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

ok cool, that makes it a bit clearer Iljhgtn (talk) 17:20, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Moving table columns

Hi, I would like to move (rearrange) table columns using a visual editor, I can see how to add and delete columns using Wikipedia, do I need to export the table to a 3rd party tool to achieve this? I see a tool called https://tableconvert.com/, but I don't know if it will work with Wikipedia. Kind regards. 12think (talk) 23:19, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

@12think: Welcome to the Teahouse! To move table columns, click a cell in the column that you want to move. There is an arrow on the top of the table, and you'll see options to move a column. You can also use the arrow on the left to move rows. Also the TableConvert tool does not work for Wikipedia, as it doesn't support wikitext tables. Hope that helps! 2NumForIce (^speak|_edits) 00:21, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Thanks, I hadn't seen that option, in hindsight very obvious, cheers! 12think (talk) 14:50, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Redirecting incorrectly

My draft page Stephen Small is apparently redirecting to another of a similar name Steve Small. What can I change to prevent that? Thank you! Tipeneiti (talk) 00:55, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi Tipeneiti. This sounds like a disambiguation issue and there's no need to worry about it now. It should be taken care of by the WP:AFC review of your draft. If the draft passes the review, the reviewer who approved it should sort out the title of the article. -- Marchjuly (talk) 01:09, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Hey - can i have a heart symbol in my signature?

Might be too late - but I put a cool heart symbol in my signature. Is that allowed? Thanks! ♡Draco Centauros♡ (talk) 02:06, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

@Draco Centauros: Welcome to the Teahouse! Yes, it's allowed per the guideline at Wikipedia:Signatures. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 02:32, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Thanks! You people are so nice at the Teahouse :) ♡Draco Centauros♡ (talk) 02:34, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

@Draco Centauros I love your signature Immanuelle ❤️💚💙 (talk to the cutest Wikipedian) 03:38, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

why do my citations keep saying i have more than one of |work= and |website= specified?

here is a link to the specific version of the page i'm trying to edit where this error appears https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Shin_Meikai_kokugo_jiten&oldid=1161340567 if someone could give me a heads up on what i'm doing wrong it'd be helpful. i'm using the source editor and sometimes when i copy references from the japanese wikipedia they just don't show up right on the english one. i don't understand why Indochina2 (talk) 03:08, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi there. I finally saw the problem and fixed it. Use this in the future: {{Reflist}}. See this this Cwater1 (talk) 04:00, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

@Cwater1: I don't think you fixed it. The references got moved, sure, but the error the user was talking about is still there. – 2804:F14:80B3:CB01:5582:454D:39ED:C775 (talk) 04:24, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Which, by the looks of it, the error is that there is both a |website= and a |work=. That is, the error will stop appearing if either of those 2 parameters are removed from the citations experiencing the error. – 2804:F14:80B3:CB01:5582:454D:39ED:C775 (talk) 04:29, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Those parameters are synonyms. As a side-note, neither of those parameters are synonyms of |publisher=. Rotideypoc41352 (talk · contribs) 05:59, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Thank you for the help guys, I'll keep what everyone said in mind for future edits. I find it odd that different language Wikipedias have different subtleties in formatting code among other things, but I'll try to pay closer attention to it. Indochina2 (talk) 06:20, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

> "I find it odd that different language Wikipedias have different subtleties in formatting code among other things"

Each Wikipedia edits its own templates etc. Even if they had all started out with the same code base, by now so many years of editing should be expected to have resulted in many differences. Well, the Tower of Babel metaphor might well apply here. – .Raven  .talk 06:47, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

@Indochina2 Oh, sorry about that. I only did the template: {{Reflist}}. I forgot about the parameters error. Apologizes. Cwater1 (talk) 14:09, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Links to foreign language media

Hej!

My last article about Trask was rejected, so I tried it again. Is it problem to use Czech articles about Czech company on English Wikipedia? All the references are from serious and the biggest Czech media (incl. Forbes), but I think that it does not mean smaller revelance for the world (especially it is not just local company)... Methodeus (talk) 11:54, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

@Methodeus: Welcome to the Teahouse! Yes, you may use non-English sources in English Wikipedia articles. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 12:02, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

@Methodeus Please see WP:REFNAME for the method we use to reuse a reference more than once (currently #3 and #4 in your draft). You may also like to read WP:Solutions for an explanation of why certain marketing-speak is not a good idea. Mike Turnbull (talk) 13:41, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Nuance, but your draft was declined, which is not as severe as rejected. The latter means the reviewer saw no potential to succeed. David notMD (talk) 14:28, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

What does Trask actually do? The draft says it's a "digital solutions integrator". Those are all good buzzwords, but they don't convey much information. (I've come to suspect that people write such things when they don't know what the business does. "Solution" is particularly useful in that context.) Maproom (talk) 15:03, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Change the jarring white background?

Hello. I am new to wikipedia editing and would like to invest more time with the community as I really respect and appreciate the care and devotion that other community members are putting into this site. I am having trouble spending time on the site as the background is all white and very bright and I do a lot of this sort of stuff at night. Is there a dark mode or any kind of color selector for the site? Ideally, I wouldn't have to choose between complete blackness and complete brightness, maybe a beige color or a light gray is a more true neutral (for my eyes anyways). If this is an option please let me know how I can access the feature, and if it has yet to be created please direct me where I can suggest this to someone who is capable of adding the feature. Thank you StopSayingMyth (talk) 14:58, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

@StopSayingMyth Welcome to the Teahouse. Please see WP:DARK for information on this. (As an aside, you can find help on most things in Wikipedia by using the standard search box, with the prefix "WP:" before any search term. Mike Turnbull (talk) 15:01, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

In addition to the preset dark mode, you may also find it useful to change the background color to a different color using CSS. You can write your own CSS and it will be present across the site whenever you are logged in. See WP:CSS for more info. WPscatter ^t/_c 15:08, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi StopSayingMyth! I didn't like the straight white-on-black of the default dark theme either so I made a white-on-gray theme myself - however, it only works for the Vector 2010 skin as of now (the old default style). If you'd like to give it a look, there's a picture and installation instructions on my user page. Tollens (talk) 17:56, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Wow. Thank you everyone for your help and concern it is very appreciated. I'm not sure what any of those links you have sent me mean but I will be sure to read them and find out! Thanks again StopSayingMyth (talk) 18:38, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

If any of you are bored and looking for something to help out with, I am currently arguing on the Hindu mythology page talk section. I don't believe anyone should be belittled and the page name should be edited to say "Hindu Stories". Just if you are bored, thanks! StopSayingMyth (talk) 18:50, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

@StopSayingMyth, while you're reviewing those other links, you might also want to add WP:CANVASSING. Please don't go to unrelated discussion forums and try to recruit people to take your side in a content dispute. Of course you're new and aren't expected to know that, so you're not going to get in trouble, but keep that in mind. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 19:02, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Ah. Okay good to know the rules. Thanks for the link and the heads up StopSayingMyth (talk) 19:04, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Profile On Wikipedia

How can I creat my Profile Page on Wikipedia. Farhannmeo (talk) 15:14, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Farhannmeo, welcome to the Teahouse. Wikipedia does not have profiles - it has encyclopedia articles on subjects which are deemed notable by our standards. What coverage of you has been published in independent, reliable, secondary sources? This means things like journalists writing articles about you in reputable newspapers or academics citing your works.

Writing an autobiography on Wikipedia is very difficult and strongly discouraged. I recommend reading WP:AUTOBIO before you proceed any further. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 15:25, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

@Farhannmeo, you've already set up a User Page, the closest thing Wikipedia has to "Profiles" (which, as has been explained to you, Wikipedia does NOT have). But your User Page reads like a summary CV, which is not what User Pages here are for. Also, you should IMMEDIATELY remove all that contact information from that page. And don't try to insert yourself into Wikipedia categories--especially ones that don't exist. Uporządnicki (talk) 15:35, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

shouldn't those revisions be hidden too? cogsan • (give me attention) • (see my deeds) 17:41, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

How can I delete a draft article?

How do I go about deleting an article that is a draft? Vienne.J (talk) 15:17, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Vienne.J, welcome to the Teahouse. Drafts are automatically deleted after 6 months of inactivity. You can request that a draft you wrote, which no one else has contributed significantly to, be deleted, but there are no such creations under your account - you commented at Draft:Laval St. Germain (adventurer), but that was created by an IP, and undeleted at another IP's request a few days ago (request).

Drafts which are extremely inappropriate for other reasons can be speedily deleted under various criteria (see here) or taken to WP:MfD. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 15:32, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi, thank you so much for your response! I was also wondering what happens if someone else wants to submit a new draft for the same topic? Can the first draft page then be disregarded? Vienne.J (talk) 17:43, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

As long as it hasn't been published to mainspace, yes, but if someone is actively working on a draft they will likely not be pleased if someone else makes a new one rather than working with them. Tollens (talk) 17:50, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Disambiguation

Feeling a bit sheepish, but can someone help me fix a disambiguation link? PapaNeedsChips (talk) 16:37, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi @PapaNeedsChips, welcome to the Teahouse. I'd argue that a wikilink isn't really necessary in this case, but as far as fixing it goes, you should visit the disambiguation page - German - and choose which of the items best fits what you were going for, then change your link to match. In this case, it looks like you want Germans. You could pipe it like so: [[Germans|German]], so it comes out as German. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 16:46, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

Username usurpation

I want to change my username, but the one I want is taken. However, it has 0 edits on en.wikipedia. About how many edits would I need to be allowed to usurp it? The Wasp ^{[my nest]} 17:35, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

​Hello, and welcome to the Teahouse! You can read the full guidelines at Wikipedia:Changing username/Usurpations and Wikipedia:Changing username/Guidelines#Additional guidelines for usurpation requests - in addition to having very few or no edits on enwiki, they would also need to have very few or no edits to any project. You can see global contributions at https://guc.toolforge.org/. Usurpation requests are typically not granted to new accounts - per the guideline above, To ensure that good use is made of popular usernames, usurpation is reserved for established users. It is expected that an account requesting usurpation will have existed for several months and made non-trivial contributions to the encyclopedia. There's no hard edit count - all they really want is to make sure you will actually use the account, so once you've been active for a while they're more confident you'll make good use of the new username. Tollens (talk) 17:47, 22 June 2023 (UTC)

How does the automatic reference search work??

Today I tried using it to get the extremely famous "Attention is all you need" but got "All you need is LSD" (doi: 10.5040/9781350101272.00000005). This basically always happens if I give it a title.

Is there a bugtracker for the automatic reference search? pony in a strange land (talk) 18:23, 22 June 2023 (UTC)