[ENCORE] Redefining Aging: Cheryl Bridges Johns on Embracing the Menopausal Journey

Amy: Good morning. 

Jen: Good morning. Happy to see you. 

Amy: Same. 

Jen: You put all the children, the sons where they need to go or whatever it is. 

Amy: Yes. Everyone’s deposited. 

Jen: That’s the best we can do at this age. Like are you where you need to be? I’ve done my job. Now it’s on you. Good morning everybody. Welcome to the show. Amy and I are delighted to see you. Okay. We are popping in today to present one of our favorite encore episodes. This is one of our top, most beloved shows, and we know why. We’re kind of all in this together right now. This is our stage of life.This was super resonant for me and a ton of our community members. And so today we’re talking about menopause. 

Amy: Yay, yay. 

Jen: Oh, she’s a hoot. Somebody has to. Right. I mean, hell, like. I’ve been out here on socials quite a bit for the last, little bit over a year. Last spring was when I was going. What’s going on? What’s going on? 

Amy: What’s happening? 

Jen: It’s happening. I think maybe like last April or May, I put on social something that said, guys, I have 14 tabs open on my computer with various questions, but all of them are more or less asking, am I in perimenopause? So the internet told me that I was. Confirmed. We are going to talk about it here because that’s what this podcast is for. And before we bring back our incredible guest that walks us through this conversation with a ton of wisdom, we’re going to do a quick little session of Rant or Rave. Okay, I’m going to take this to you first. 

Amy: Okay. 

Jen: So in general menopause, let’s just put that right on the table. Here’s menopause. High level. Is this a rant or a rave? 

Amy: Today. 

Jen: Oh. 

Amy: Today after listening to this episode. It’s a rave. 

Jen: I like it. Tell us more because that’s not what everybody’s expecting to hear. 

Amy: I think it would be more of a rave if we understood more going in, which is why this is important. To listen to. To talk about. To have scientific studies done by women. 

Jen: So my thoughts about that. 

Amy: Had I known it, I wouldn’t have felt so discombobulated. 

Jen: Totally. What did you know? 

Amy: Not a lot. I knew that in the 80s they did a hysterectomy and didn’t do any hormone replacement. That doesn’t go well. 

Jen:  Imagine. 

Amy: I really didn’t know much, and I think I entered perimenopause pretty early. How old were you? And it was a long run. Well, maybe not early, but I think early 40. 

Jen: You know, that’s a little early. 

Amy: Yeah, I think it was tangled up in some other. 

Jen: Health Stuff. 

Amy: Health stuff. So it was hard to parse out what was what. Then when it was clearly something menopause related, I wasn’t always quick to address it because I thought, this is just the other thing or whatever.. 

Jen: For you, especially at like onset. If you look at menopause, it’s a laundry list of possibilities of what you could feel. I don’t have all of them, but I have some of them. What were your primary forward-facing symptoms of early perimenopause? 

Amy: My fatigue got worse. With chronic fatigue, like, more. It’s not great. My connective tissue got really stiff and inflexible. Especially fascia. I have fascia issues and my sleep got worse. Insomnia.

Jen: Yep. 

Amy: Not being able to fall asleep and waking up, and then I did have some weird perfect storm of some things that happened, like a medication change and, something having to do with perimenopause and something else immediately, like a viral infection. At one point, I hemorrhaged for two solid months and was having these weird electrical feelings that felt like a seizure, but painful. At one point my neurologist said, I don’t know, it could be epilepsy or menopause. 

Jen: Oh God and this is part of the problem is that so little investment in research and development in science has been aimed at menopause. Aging is just so punished in our culture in every way, including menopause. I mean, it took me by surprise. I was like, wait, I don’t remember anybody telling me about it. I don’t remember somebody saying, hey, guess what? You’re in your upper 40s. One thing you’re going to want to be paying attention to is this. Like, instead I was like, what is wrong with me? I noticed for me, one of my worst symptoms was I felt my emotional and mental capacity just shrunk and, you know, I’m high capacity.

Amy: You’re high capacity and high functioning.

Jen: I’m high capacity, high functioning and I’ve always been my way. I couldn’t remember something or the bigger thing. It’s hard to say other than I just kept thinking, I’m overwhelmed. I can’t do this. Well, okay, life was weird for me for sure. My last four years have been hard and overwhelming, but even my normal, ordinary channels that were still on the table they’d already been all of a sudden felt like too much for me. I just can’t do it. I had to dig, like excavate. Who will help me? I like that you said though this could be a rave. Nobody really talks about that a whole lot. That is why we’re doing this episode. Because we have Cheryl Bridges Johns on, and her whole perspective is empowering. It’s encouraging. I don’t know what was a quick takeaway that you had. 

Amy: It was encouraging. 

Jen: Yeah. 

Amy: She looked at a lot of the spiritual components of a rebirth. I mean, the medical stuff is so important. This is the rest of it. 

Jen Yeah. 

Amy: One thing I really resonated with, that I’m going to carry through my day for sure, is when she talks about shipwrecks and a storm, and how if you lean into the storm, it can take you to the bottom. But after the storm, there are these ships on the beach that have risen up that you didn’t even know you were there. You can get the rope on those. They’re not tying you down and you didn’t even know it to begin with and then you can walk away. 

Jen: I love that imagery and I have found this to be true. I mean, obviously I had just turned 50, and I think I’ve been and I think I’ve been in perimenopause for about a year and a half, more or less, maybe upwards of two, before I finally figured out what was going on. And a lot of this emotional stuff was resonant for me. That there’s a real gift to this second part of life, a huge gift. We’re smarter and we’re better and we’re wiser and the whole way that aging in general has just been stigmatized, particularly for women. Men sometimes get a free pass here or a freer pass. 

Amy: Yes. 

Jen: Not entirely a free pass. But men get to age a little bit more than women do. She said something really awesome. Let me look at my notes real quick. Oh, here it is. Women are allowed to age, but we are not allowed to mature. We really, like, unpack that idea together. Anyway, I think you’re going to like this episode. This is where so many of us are right now. For those of you who are new to her, let me tell you a little bit about Sheryl. We could have a 30-part series on this topic but this is a great place to start, and I’m really glad to drop this back into the community now that I have more to say about it. It’s a little bit more real and true for me as well. So Cheryl is an author. She’s an academic lecturer. She’s a leader. She’s a pastor. She’s a theologian. She’s a multi-hyphenate, for sure. She advocates for full women’s empowerment so you can understand why we love her around here. Her book is very, very compelling. It’s all about navigating the second half of life, particularly as a woman it kind of goes to the heart of all the changes that we are going through, handing women the the capacity to find their voice and speak openly about where they are on these plot points. If we put this question to Cheryl. Rant or rave, she says rave and I like this perspective. I like leaning into this. Cheryl believes that society can figure out a way to embrace this very natural and normal season of life. Not only are women going to flourish more, but society is going to flourish more and I couldn’t agree more. We’re happy to bring this one back and run it up the flagpole because we are listening to you, our listening community a lot and you are saying more on this, more on this. This is a conversation we need to have and are having a hard time finding. So without any further ado, please enjoy this incredible encore episode from the insightful, the wise, the very delightful Cheryl Bridges Johns.