Talk:Tacoma Narrows Bridge (1940)

Creation of this article

This article was created as a split from the Tacoma Narrows Bridge article as the result of a discussion on that talk page. Anyone considering a move or a merge of information in the Galloping Gertie article may want to review that previous split/keep discusion (July August 2008). - PennySpender1983 (talk) 05:07, 16 August 2008 (UTC)

Bridge Length

The article states that the 1940 Tacoma Narrows Bridge length is 5,000 ft. At the end of the article it reads that the (now) Tacoma Westbound Bridge "is 5,979 feet (1822 m) long — 40 feet (12 m) longer than Galloping Gertie." There is a discrepancy between the compared lengths of the bridges. Can this be resolved to insure the integrity of the article?

--Trpote (talk) 06:18, 22 August 2008 (UTC)

It's probably talking about two different structures Tedickey (talk) 10:19, 22 August 2008 (UTC)

You're right, it's definitely comparing the two different structures. However, if the 1950 Tacoma Westbound Bridge "is 5,979 feet (1822 m) long — 40 feet (12 m) longer than Galloping Gertie." that would imply Galloping Gertie is about 5,939 feet (1810 m) in length. The article gives the length of Galloping Gertie as 5,000 feet (1524 m) leaving 939 feet (286 m) unaccounted for. 72.192.209.134 (talk) 15:48, 22 August 2008 (UTC)

Reliable source for Atom Man

Actually, the given link only mentions the film referred to here obliquely, does not support the given statement. Unless there's a reliable source mentioning which bridge is shown, it's not sourced. Tedickey (talk) 11:16, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

you are right, we need a more reliable reference. However, I doubt we can find one Diego Torquemada (talk) 13:06, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

I would rename article to Tacoma Narrows Bridge (original) (1940)

Everyone who has ever seen a film of the bridge collapse knows it as the Tacoma Narrows Bridge disaster, and in order to distinguish from the current bridge, I propose changing the name to Tacoma Narrows Bridge (original). DandyDan2007 (talk) 11:29, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

See the discussion at Talk:Tacoma Narrows Bridge regarding the naming of this page when it was split off of that page. I think it's more likely that someone will search for Galloping Gertie than Tacoma Narrows Bridge (original). We could, however, redirect Tacoma Narrows Bridge (original), Old Tacoma Narrows Bridge, First Tacoma Narrows Bridge, 1940 Tacoma Narrows Bridge, Galloping gertie, and Tacoma Narrows Bridge (1940) to point to Galloping Gertie. travisl (talk) 17:46, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

The original discussion went into more about if it should be broken out, the question of what to name it really wasn't discussed in any detail. Even if it had been discussed, consensus can change, and there's no harm in discussing the merits and applicable naming policies and guidelines on this talk page.

The relevant policy is WP:TITLE, which spells out that "article naming should prefer what the greatest number of English speakers would most easily recognize". So the question is what would be more recognized by english speaking persons world-wide. Would it be more likely to be known as Galloping Gertie or Tacoma Narrows Bridge. My understanding of policy and guidelines is that even though the proposed name would be Tacoma Narrows Bridge (original), the "(original)" in the proposed name isn't relevant to this part of the discussion, as it's a Wikipedia disambiguation tool, and not actually part of the name.

I have no strong preference on this in either direction. But from the cited sources sources in the article, it does appear that Tacoma Narrows Bridge is the more commonly used name, while Galloping Gertie is a local nickname and not as widely used outside of the area - which would suggest that Galloping Gertie should be the redirect. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 18:32, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

I also don't have a strong preference, so if someone else does, I'm OK with it. Another policy to consider, however, is the disambiguation naming policy, which gives this example:

“

For disambiguating specific topic pages by using an unambiguous article title, several options are available:

1. When there is another term (such as Pocket billiards instead of Pool) or more complete name (such as Delta rocket instead of Delta) that is equally clear and unambiguous, that should be used.
2. A disambiguating word or phrase can be added in parentheses. The word or phrase in parentheses should be:
   • the generic class that includes the topic, as in Mercury (element), Seal (mammal); or
   • the subject or context to which the topic applies, as in Union (set theory), Inflation (economics).
3. Rarely, an adjective describing the topic can be used, but it is usually better to rephrase such a title to avoid parentheses.

”

The way I read this, naming it "Galloping Gertie" instead of "Tacoma Narrows Bridge (1940)" is best, if they're equally clear and unambiguous. If not, then "Tacoma Narrows Bridge (1940)" should be used, as "(original)" is an adjective describing the topic. Do you interpret this the same way I do? travisl (talk) 18:54, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for finding that - I had glanced at WP:DAB but had missed that section. I agree, if Tacoma Narrows Bridge is selected over Galloping Gertie, then the full article name should be Tacoma Narrows Bridge (1940), and not use the clarifier of (original). --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 19:06, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

Actually, I think that Tacoma Narrows Bridge (1940) would be better than Tacoma Narrows Bridge (original). I wish I would have thought of that when I wrote that. DandyDan2007 (talk) 11:24, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

I like Tacoma Narrows Bridge (1940), as well. Are there any objections? —Tonyle (talk • contribs) 08:49, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

No feeling either way, so no objection here, so long as proper redirects are created as a part of the renaming. Rephrasing what I mentioned above, redirect Tacoma Narrows Bridge (original), Old Tacoma Narrows Bridge, First Tacoma Narrows Bridge, 1940 Tacoma Narrows Bridge, Galloping gertie, and Galloping Gertie to point to Tacoma Narrows Bridge (1940). Also, modify the {{about|a|b}} line in Tacoma Narrows Bridge to point to the new page. travisl (talk) 18:26, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

I'd suggest keeping Galloping Gertie. It's a topic I've heard raised by that name several times over the years in Australia where I live, but I had to think hard to connect it to the Tacoma Narrows. So it's perhaps the more common name. Andrewa (talk) 19:21, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

• Strong Support for a rename. This is how the bridge is listed on the Historic Register. In fact a case could probably be made that this is the primary use for Tacoma Narrows Bridge. So it should either be renamed to Tacoma Narrows Bridge or one of the other dab forms. There is absolutely no reason to have this historic article at a nickname! Vegaswikian (talk) 20:55, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

This argument is contrary to Wikipedia:naming conventions, see also Wikipedia:official names. If this nickname is also the common name, then that's what we use... Far from there being absolutely no reason, this is Official Wikipedia Policy, and we should follow it unless there are special reasons for making an exception, or strong enough reasons to change the policy. But agree that, internationally, this article would be the primary usage of Tacoma Narrows Bridge. Andrewa (talk) 23:03, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

• Support; as far as I am concerned, Tacoma Narrows Bridge disaster is the common name. I've seen the film, and I've never even heard of "Galloping Gertie". Merging with the bridge itself seems obvious. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 17:32, 27 January 2009 (UTC)
• Oppose I've seen this several times as "Galloping Gertie", and would say that it would be the name that is more likely to be remembered, since it's not a generic name. 76.66.198.171 (talk) 13:08, 28 January 2009 (UTC)