MINNEAPOLIS - MAY 1986: Natalie Merchant of Ten Thousand Maniacs performs at First Avenue nightclub in Minneapolis, Minnesota in May 1986. (Photo by Jim Steinfeldt/Michael Ochs Archives/Getty Images)
Getty ImagesIn the first part of this interview series with 10,000 Maniacs co-founder and keyboardist Dennis Drew, we discussed the group's Peter Asher-produced hit LP "In My Tribe," and the band's early years with singer/songwriter Natalie Merchant. Here, in Part 2, we move on to the departure of Merchant in 1993, the Rock And Roll Hall Of Fame, the song “What’s The Matter Here?” and more. Following are edited excerpts from a longer phone conversation.
Jim Clash: Was Natalie Merchant's departure from the group in 1993 unexpected?
Dennis Drew: We expected her to leave every f’in day from the very beginning [laughs]. We couldn't believe our good fortune that she stayed with us as long as she did. We are very different people. We were drinking and smoking and being rock-and-roll guys in our late 20s. That's not particularly her style, certainly not the drinking. Maybe she had a glass of wine, but I don't even remember that. She might even have smoked a little pot when she was younger. But we were sloppy drunks, careening around the world chasing girls after the shows. She's a little more Emily Dickinson.
Clash: So no surprise, then?
Drew: You could see where it was going, and everybody working with us could, too. There was pressure on her from the very beginning when we signed with Elektra [Records] to change the name of the band to Natalie Merchant And 10,000 Maniacs, which she refused to do to her credit.
But Natalie had a plan. When she turned 30, that was it. She told us that before the last record and tour. She turned 30 in 1993, and, sure enough, went off on her own. We were comfortable with that. There had been tension. She had gotten more control, and wanted even more of it. Who could blame her? I would have done the same thing. But her leaving was pretty amiable. No one was surprised or super angry.
Clash: Do you two talk much anymore?
Drew: We do business, various publishing things and stuff. She's been very generous. But I haven't talked to her on a personal level in a very long time.
AUGUST 25, 2016: Mary Ramsey, Jeffrey Erickson, Jerome Augustyniak, John Lombardo, Dennis Drew and Steven Gustafson of 10,000 Maniacs perform 10,000 Manics & The Smithereens In Concert at Union County Performing Arts Center in Rahway, New Jersey. (Photo by Bobby Bank/WireImage)
WireImageClash: After she left, it must have been challenging for you all at first.
Drew: Sure, it was challenging. In 1992, our drummer, Jerry Augustyniak, broke his shoulder in a bike accident, and we had two weeks of gigs already booked for college campuses. So Max Weinberg from the [Bruce Springsteen] E-Street Band came to play with us. He had a lot to learn, so we hung out first in Jamestown [New York].
We told him that this was our last tour, that Natalie was leaving. He goes, "You guys are going to be alright. You're not like us - you wrote those songs. You obviously know how to write music." And we said, "Wow, really?" And he said, "Yeah." Obviously, we haven't reached the same heights as we had before, but we've been fine and have written a lot of great music since. We've been together 32 years now without Natalie.
Clash: You've been eligible for induction into the Rock And Roll Hall Of Fame since 2006. Do you care if it happens?
Drew: Well, I don't give a sh't if we don't get in [laughs]. I mean, it would be an honor, sure. But I'm not campaigning for it, and certainly don't expect it. I do think they are going to take our archives, though. I've talked with them about that.
We have so much stuff, almost a warehouse-full. We've been going through it, and it’s helped out with the radio documentary my daughter Emily and her husband recently produced, "Can't Ignore The Train." As for the RRHOF, I never thought of music as a competition, but I guess it is.
Clash: Sometimes songs get sanitized in recording studio mixes, come out less like the original way that the band had played them. Is there a particular 10,000 Maniacs song you felt that came out true to its roots?
Natalie Merchant with 10,000 Maniacs perform during Laguna Seca Daze at Laguna Seca Racetrack on May 30, 1993 in Monterey, California. (Photo by Tim Mosenfelder/Getty Images)
Getty ImagesDrew: Wow, this is forest-through-the-trees stuff. We were so deep into it at the time. "What's The Matter Here?" came out exactly the same as the first day we ever tried it, when Rob [Buck] brought in the chords. It was easy to play in the studio and, even with all of [producer] Peter Asher's experimentation [on "In My Tribe"], it sounds exactly the way the band sounds.
