CAT Paraleling

THE PARAMETERS SETTING OF CDVR&
ADEM IN
PARALLELING APPLICATION

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02-09-2010 07:24 PM
Hi, I want to know the parameters setting of CDVR & ADEM for 3500 PGS in parallleling application.
Anyone who has experienced these could give me advice. Thanks firstly.

A. Multiple gensets in isolated paralleling mode.
1. Speed drop or not? Droop percent=?
2. AVR mode or not? Droop percent=?
3. Gain: Standard PID setting according to generator data or adjusted on site
4. Other important setting points in gensets
B. Single genset parallel with utility
1. Speed drop or not? Droop percent=?
2. AVR or VAR or PF mode? Droop percent=?
3. Gain: Standard PID setting according to generator data or adjusted on site
4. Other important setting points in gensets

The maker of paralleling switchgear could give clear guidance.

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mikel
Super Contributor
Re: The Parameters setting of CDVR& ADEM in paralleling application

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02-09-2010 10:08 PM
How you set up the ECM and the CDVR depends on a lot of factors, there is no "blanket" set of
settings.

How are you planning on doing ekW sharing? Is there a load control device for each unit, like an
LSM module, or something more complex, like a Woodward DSLC or EasyGen, or a PLC based
system like CAT ISO switchgear?

What are your tolerances for load sharing and frequency control? A droop system will work if you
can tolerate frequency not precisely at 50 or 60 Hz, and if you have full time well trained
knowledgeable operators.

How about VAR sharing in island mode? Droop? Can you tolerate voltage sag as load increases?
Cross current compensation? Are all you generators similar with similar voltage regulators?
Otherwise getting a CCC system to work can be a challenge.

In the USA and most of Europe, most power systems based on small to medium size recip engines
use isochronus load sharing and active VAR sharing controls, usually Woodward type controls with
supervision, or PLC based systems with high speed power transducers.

In general, you need to look at your system from a broad standpoint, how you set dynamic controls
on the CAT (or any engine/generator manufacturers) package depends on how you want the system
to respond and what control equipment interfaces with the package controls. What is the load
system tolerance for transients, sag and swell? Do you have other factors, such as emissions
regulations that could affect how responsive you make the units? How about balance of plant
equipment, such as heat recovery units, or process using waste heat?

Paralleling to a utility also has differing concerns, how soft or stable is the utility grid? This may
determine if you choose VAR or PF control, as well as what the setpoint should be and how the
dynamic response in that mode needs to be set. And the utility will have guidelines on how the inter-
tie and generator will need to be protected, and may define VAR and real power settings and
dynamic rates into their system.

Don't rely on your switchgear vendor to tell you how to make your system operate, that may work
some times, but ultimately you need to assure all pieces of the system function as intended if you
provide an entire system.

Lots to think about if you want to do it right.

Mike L
Dear all,
I have to synchronize CAT generator 3.8MW to mains as black start genset, the controller used is
ComAp IG-NT GC.
First I connect the CAN terminals of the comap to CAN terminals of the ECM and communication is
OK.
Also I connect the AVR and test the voltage control and every thing is OK.
Regarding speed control I connect the speed GOV. Output to terminal 66&68(PWM input at the
ECM ) but the speed was not stable and I can't make synchronizing.
Yesterday I have installed 9x-9591 PWM converter and the speed seams stable( in comap
installation manual shows that I have to connect to terminals 10&12 put these terminals mentioned
as 0-20mA input speed control not PWM speed control) ,I have checked all wiring and was correct,
but I noted that the temperature of the 9x converter is rising can any one advise please.
Thanks for all your inputs guys!! I will explain in detail, may be this might give you a better idea of my
problem!!!
I am installing an EasyGen3200 to communicate with a Caterpillar 3516C. Now this engine requires
a PWM signal to operate, so CAT has placed a 0-200ma current to pwm convertor in their system.
Now as my easygen can give only 0-20ma, I instead configured my easygen to give a PWM output.
Now what I did is I went ahead and connected my pwm signal directly to the terminals where the
PWM converter outputs were connected. Now thats about how its wired up.

First, the CAT tech kept the direct fuel mode disabled which means the ECM has control although
the speed signal is from me. So I see the throttle position of 74.9% and desired engine speed of 400
or something. Now when I enable direct fuel mode and give the same PWM signal again, the throttle
position becomes 91% and the desired engine speed shows nothing. Now I am giving the same
signal what ECM requires to bring the engine to rated speed but when I enable direct fuel, the
parameters change. Now whats going wrong and why is the desired engine speed not showing
anything?

Direct fuel mode is used in the petroleum business on drilling rigs. An external governor is used in
place of the governor in the engine ECM. A 0-200 Ma signal is sent to the engine ECM, which then
directly controls the electronic fuel rack. Additional hardware is required to enable direct fuel control
mode. Desired engine RPM always displays "0" in direct fuel mode as you are directly controlling the
fuel rack. This enables operators to parallel different engine models (both electronic and
mechanically governed) without changing their control system. This will not work in your system. You
can send the PWM signal to the engine ECM. The desired engine RPM will indicate crank terminate
RPM until the engine is running above that programmed value, usually 400 RPM. The PWM signal
will then control desired engine RPM. See Cat special instruction REHS0848 for an explanation of
direct fuel mode.
PWM PROBLEM AND RUN 3512B ENGINE

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10-13-2018 07:45 AM
hello my friends
the model is caterpillar 3512B
i have the problem of the pwm signal for speed control (SPN91 FMI 8) i would like to be supported in
the connection of the PWM (175-4998) control of the ECM and DSE 7320 ?? If it does not run with
the 7320, then please introduce another model so that it can send the pwm signal to the ECM,
waiting for the full explanation. Description: pwm connections (1 and 3 = 0-200 mA) (4 and 6 = 24 V
DC) (10 = negative digital reference and 12 = pwm signal for the ECM)
Is it possible to change the type of speed control in ET software? For example, CAN input to use the
deepsea controller?
The system has three synchronization generators with an EMCP 4.4 controller that acts through the
SCR system.
One of the EMCP controller is damage.
My question is, can I coordinate the 8610 controller with two EMCP 4.4 controllers for
synchronization?
The second question
Two generators work as PWM and one of them operates at 0 to 5 volts, is this possible?
Can you teach ECM settings to use the 8610 controller?
For example, in ET software, the options for the Direct Fuel Control Mode and the desired Speed
Input configuration option should be changed ?
Please describe and train the connection of the 8610 controller with this kind of Caterpillar system
My last question is can this engine be turned on directly،No controller and no pwm
Just let me know if the engine is turned on‫؟؟؟؟‬
Thank you all my dear friends
I am waiting for your answer

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alex644
Contributor
Re: PWM problem and run 3512B engine

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12-03-2018 10:53 PM
DSE7320 for single operation and auto start. Better use DSE8610 (as u say). Take off converter 0-
200ma - pwm and direct connect DSE(gov34;35) - ADEM4, AVR(37;38) - CDVR, ECU(25;26) -
ADEM, MSC(31;32) - DSE. And change in ET (adem) speed control (i dont remember exactly may
be external input 0-5vdc). What is the second parameter in ET:( Desiered speed input config 1-pwm;
2-?)
PARALLELLING WITH A4E4 ECM, EMCP 3.2, CDVR AND
WOODWARD EASYGEN 3100 OVER CAN / J1939?

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08-06-2010 01:41 PM
I'm starting a new generator synconizing switchgear project (not a life safety system) using a new
CAT genset with the A4E4 ECM, EMCP 3.2 GCP, and Cat Digital Voltage Regulator all talking on a
CAN J1939 bus. I am planning to use the Woodward easYgen 3100 controller for load sharing,
syncronizing, and breaker automation. The easYgen has a CAN bus that is designed to interface
with J1939 engine control systems but the Woodward manuals don't make any reference to the Cat
A4E4 as a ECM that will work with the easYgen. Has anyone sucessfully used this specific
Woodward controller or any other Woodward controllers to interface with these CAT systems over
CAN? If so, I have some questions:

1. Will the CAT ECM accept a START and STOP command via J1939?
2. Will the CAT ECM accept speed trim commands via J1939?
3. Will the CAT DVR accept voltage trim commands via J1939?
4. The EMCP has two CAN ports. Do I have to connect to the same port the ECM is on (PORT 1) or
can I connect the Woodward controller to the accessory J1939 port (PORT 2)?
5. What would I program into the Woodward controller for Parameter 15102 (J1939 Device Type)?
Options are: Standard, S6 Scania, EMR2 Deutz, EMR2 Volvo, ADEC MTU, EGS Woodward, EDC7
MAN, EEM SISU, Cummins. I'm guessing "Standard" is the way to go.

By the way, I do realize that the EMCP has a MODBUS port which I could use. My thinking was that
the Woodward easYgen is designed out of the box to control a J1939 engine and it appears it would
"Plug and Play" very easily from an integration and programming perspective. MODBUS would
require a lot of manual point mapping and an upstream PLC. It would be easier to just hardwire
everything.

Thanks in advance for any advice!!!!
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mikel
Super Contributor
Re: Parallelling with A4E4 ECM, EMCP 3.2, CDVR and Woodward easYgen 3100
over CAN / J1939?

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08-10-2010 11:39 PM
My own experience with integrating a CAT unit with industry provided J1939 devices and controllers
has been poor. CAT "mostly" conforms to the J1939 standards, but feels the data link is golden and
really did a very bad job of making it compatible with industry available devices. I have done one job
with a Woodward easYgen integrated with an EMCP3.3, in the end it was easier to go the Modbus
route (but still a pain, CAT also did a lousy job laying out the Modbus tables and data).

Technically the answer is yes to most of your questions, but in some cases the "standard PGN"
doesn't work, so you'll need documentation from CAT to make sure you have the PGN and
information for it.

CAN port 1 is supposed to be for ECM to EMCP3.X comms, external accessories and devices are
supposed to use Port 2. Some controllers will work on Port 1, but problems can occur is the traffic
levels become excessive, causing the data link to fail.

For a while a custom easYgen was going to be the EMCP3.S, not sure where that program is now,
but there are probably some good reasons a CAT interface is not defined in the off the shelf
easYgen. The folks at ISO/CAT Switchgear may have some additional info if you can find someone
willing to help.
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cameron
New member
over CAN / J1939?

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08-12-2010 09:06 AM
You didn't mention if the CAT units were already purchased or not. MTU Onsite Energy uses the
Basler DGC2020 controller which has an autosync feature. This combined with the LSM2020 load
share module will eliminate the need for the Woodward system altogether. The DGC2020 and
LSM2020 can control your breakers as well much like the Woodward EasyGen. The LSM2020
handles load sharing as well as load management dropping gensets out if the demand drops and
bringing them on if the load increases. If you install motorized breakers on the gensets themselves
then all you need is the bus to which the power can be delivered. The great thing about having this
come from the manufacturer is that the DGC2020, and LSM2020 and already prewired to each other
as well as the engine controller so integration is simple.
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jbiggins
Contributor
over CAN / J1939?

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08-13-2010 12:23 PM
Thanks for the feedback. Based on this information and other research I have done, I believe I will
attempt to use the J1939 link for monitoring only and rely on hardwired connections between the
PLC / Easygen and the EMCP / CDVR for control. The EasyGen has a programming option to
enable and disable J1939 control messages. In theory, I can disable control messages, do control
via hardwired connections, and still get the J1939 data into the EasyGen. This works for me. If you
have any other comments or recommendations, then shoot them to me.

On a second note, I'm looking for someone to compare and contrast the differences between the
Woodward EasyGen 3200 and the Basler DGC 2020. Anyone used both and have some insight on
which is the best? They appear to be approximately the same cost and I'm very familiar with the
Basler protective relays so I could consider their genset controller too.
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mikel
Super Contributor
over CAN / J1939?

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08-13-2010 05:53 PM
Both are capable, each has their quirks. The easYgen is a complete unit in a single package for
most applications, the Basler needs additional module if you want to load share, or control the
governor or AVR by analog outputs. Some of the standard features of the easYgen are options on
the Basler, like Modbus comms.

In general my customers have liked the display and interface on the Woodward better than the
Basler. The electrical protective elements are a little better on the Basler (go figure), but the
Woodward's work fine for most applications.

Hope that helps,

Mike L.
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asaad_alhassan
Contributor
over CAN / J1939?

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09-22-2010 02:01 AM
HI I AM ASAAD FROM IRAQ I SEE YOUR PROBLEM THE ECM HAVE NOT ANY THINGS
ABOUT PARALLING OR SINGLE IT JUST RESPONSIBLE ABOUT ENGINE AND DELIVER A
NOTIFY FROM CONTROL PANAL THE SYNIC SIGNAL LIKE DROP OR ISOSYNC.LIKE THAT
THE IN CHARG OF ALL THIS OPRATION IT LOAD SHARE MOUDEL AND SPM. IF YOU NEED
TO CONECT ON CAN BUS YOU MUST CHOOSE HOW MANY ITEM CONECT .... SORRY TO
BAD EXPLANE AND SPELLING..
3516B 60 TO 50 HZ CONVERSION

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07-14-2009 01:28 PM
We currently have several brand new 3516B 2250 kw 60 hz tier 2 gensets and would like to convert
them to 50 Hz for overseas use. We are not concerned about achieving the same power output and
would like to do this at minimal cost and labor. What modifications are required to create a
reliable genset without changing the injectors, camshaft or any other internal engine components.
Any input would be greatly appreciated.
Everyone's Tags:
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 50hz
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 60hz
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Rajiv57
New member
Re: 3516B 60 to 50 Hz conversion

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07-17-2009 08:06 AM
Dear Sir,

We are the manufacturers of Alternators up to 100 Mega Watt capacity, 415Volts to
17000Volts, 115.3RPM to 3000RPM, 2 Poles to 52 Poles, 50Hz. To 400 Hz., 0.8 to 0.85PF, 98%
Efficiency, with over temp., over speed & ground fault protection system. Extended shaft provided on
request.

You do not need to make any changes in the Engine. Changes have to be made in the winding of
the Alternator. Our e-mail [email protected]. Ph. Mob.: 91 976 196 8622 Land Line:91 121
252 5557.
Address is Bijendra Heavy Electricals Pvt.Ltd., Opposite Ramlila Ground, Delhi Road, Meerut City-
250 002, Uttar Pradesh, India. You may contact us as and when required.

Regards

Rajiv Mohan
Manufacturers of Alternators from 1 Mega Watts to 100 Mega Watts or any higher size required,
from 2 Poles to 52 Poles, 115RPM to 3000RPM, 415Volts to 17000Volts, 50Hz. to 400Hz., 0.8 to
0.85PF, 98% efficiency with over temperature, over speed & ground protection system. Extended
shaft provided on request. They are tailor made as per specifications of the client. We also make
A.V.R.'s of all sizes, variable A.C. drives. We invite enquiries for our products.
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EPGAlbanCat_MD
Cat Dealer
Dealer

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07-17-2009 08:44 AM
Rajiv57 wrote:
Dear Sir,

We are the manufacturers of Alternators up to 100 Mega Watt capacity, 415Volts to
17000Volts, 115.3RPM to 3000RPM, 2 Poles to 52 Poles, 50Hz. To 400 Hz., 0.8 to 0.85PF, 98%
Efficiency, with over temp., over speed & ground fault protection system. Extended shaft provided on
request.

You do not need to make any changes in the Engine. Changes have to be made in the winding of
the Alternator. Our e-mail [email protected]. Ph. Mob.: 91 976 196 8622 Land Line:91 121
252 5557.
Address is Bijendra Heavy Electricals Pvt.Ltd., Opposite Ramlila Ground, Delhi Road, Meerut City-
250 002, Uttar Pradesh, India. You may contact us as and when required.

Regards

Rajiv Mohan
Thankyou for the advice. We already have appropriate alternators, I'm 99% sure the engine speed
needs to be reduced from 1800 to 1500 rpm, in order to achieve 50 Hz. My question is what else
besides a reflash of the engine management, and maybe changing the turbos. I am looking for an
example where someone has successfully completed the conversion with minimal modifications and
high reliability.
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eugyno
Cat Dealer
Dealer

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07-29-2009 09:00 AM
first and foremost is for you to send me the serial number of the genset and the type of EMCP that it
has, but know that this services is for a token
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CCOOK
Contributor

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08-05-2009 09:35 PM
We also have looked at this before. The first hurdle is that you will not be able to programme the top
engine limit (TEL) down to 1500 rpm. This will require flashing a 50Hz rating flash file into the ECM
but the factory password system (FPS) may not give passwords due to the rating / flash file
mismatch. The only way then to get around that problem is a new ECM. Then you may have
possible iron changes etc
Goldpower Diesel Services - Chris Cook - Service Manager

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EPGAlbanCat_MD
Cat Dealer
Dealer

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08-06-2009 09:34 AM
CCOOK wrote:
We also have looked at this before. The first hurdle is that you will not be able to programme the top
engine limit (TEL) down to 1500 rpm. This will require flashing a 50Hz rating flash file into the ECM
but the factory password system (FPS) may not give passwords due to the rating / flash file
mismatch. The only way then to get around that problem is a new ECM. Then you may have
possible iron changes etc

Thankyou for the information, from what I understand CAT will provide these level 3 passwords for a
charge. In the case of derating an engine such as this situation it will be significantly cheaper than
when increasing the BHP.
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CCOOK
Contributor

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08-06-2009 07:34 PM
Thats correct, you go into the FPS and go to "estimate rerate" then enter your engine serial number
and the interlock codes for the file in your engine and the file you want to flash into the ecm.It will
then give you what charge would be applied from cat. You can obtain the new flash file number from
the flash file cross reference listing then go to TMI to obtain the interlock code for the new flash file.
in saying this i have assumed from your ID you are from Alban cat dealer.
Goldpower Diesel Services - Chris Cook - Service Manager
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Gary
Visitor

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08-27-2009 01:04 AM
Apart from ECM, the tubo do need to be replaced?
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hbutt
Cat Dealer
Dealer

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10-14-2009 07:06 AM
well, i have been involved in frequency coversion dilema. Found it fairly easy, but it needs a bit of
workout. My proposal is that when you will convert that same genset to 50hz, its kW will become its
kVA. For conversion procedure, you would need the flash file. But you need to see and study which
flash file can do the conversion without changing any iron. You need to find the exact arrangement
number which is used with the 50hz flash file. To make sure if there is any iron change required for
the new genset, goto TMI and compare your current arrangement number with the new arrangement
number. That will show u all what u need to change. If u succeed in finding that number which gives
u no change except the flash file, you have almost won the game. goto TMI and put that
arrangement number, get the respective test spec number and get the flash file number. Flash your
ECM with the same flash file and send the information given by ECM (at the end of flashing) to
CATERPILLAR for factory passwords. Simple, it is really

Regards

Hussan butt
Application Engr.
K.S.A
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h374jah
Cat Dealer
Dealer

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10-15-2009 05:02 PM
We did a conversion to 50Hz,380volts last year. We took a 1500kw power module with a 1GZ serial
number. It was 1500kw at 1800rpm"60Hz,"standby rating we put a new 50Hz flashfile in it,which
changed the test spec . Next we had to put turbos on the engine. finally it took a set of injectors. The
out come was a 1120Kw standby rating at 380 volts @ 50Hz. I
had to get the DSN involved to come up with the test spec to order the correct parts.Im pretty sure
you should be able to do something simalar .Just a note, this wasnt as easy as that.
We had issues with loading the flashfile. It took a special factory password to be generated
manually. It couldnt be done through the normal password screen.
Hope this helped.

https://forums.cat.com/t5/Power-Generation-Site-Design/3516B-60-to-50-Hz-conversion/m-
p/684/highlight/true#M125
Re: 3500 Series - A4 - Stability Problem

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03-23-2011 01:35 AM
Jay,
My experience in setting the diesels with ADEM is that firstly you will need to set on an island mode
and single operation and set the ECM gains for block loading and stability with the Load control
OFF. My experience has been to set the governor using a load bank at the dealer facility without the
controllers and then not change at site. Remenber that any external load command just changes the
desired speed input to the ECM and if this is not steady the governor will not have any reference
point to revert the speed to and will go all over the place.. That is why setting the load controllers
with some delay in response will help the governor to recover to the desired speed reference point.
Once this is done you can set the load gains in the controller or ISO gear to achieve load sharing.
PLEASE DO NOT USE THE LOAD CONTROLLER TO ADJUST TO THE SPEED DROPS OR
BLOCK LOADS, leave this to the Engine governor to do.. Most of the instability comes when we try
to use the load control units to adjust to the speed swings..
Hope this will help..
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CatTechnician01
Cat Dealer
Dealer

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03-22-2011 06:59 AM
No problem, just trying to help. Please post your end results.

Regards,
Pete
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smithj
Contributor

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03-21-2011 09:45 AM
Thanks Pete,
I think I already have the data from that site. I got it from DH. It is a different flash file.

Thanks

J
Thanks,
J
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smithj
Contributor

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03-21-2011 09:40 AM
Mike,
This is Jay S. These are all deisel units. I am waiting for engine date from the other sites to see if
there is a pattern here. 3.S tuning loops are different from EasyGen. I may get your number from
Dale and give you a call if I can't find something in the flash files or settings.

Thanks
J
Thanks,
J
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CatTechnician01
Cat Dealer
Dealer

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03-19-2011 11:41 AM
Jay, I just commissioned two 3516C's at GT Crystal Systems in Salem, MA. Cat/ISO 3.S switchgear
included. I made no changes to the ADEM 3 gain and stability settings . Sync and load settings were
set/adjusted thru the ISO tuning screen. I will get a hold of the ISO field engineer to get "the
numbers" from this site which hopefully will get you closer to the ball park.

Regards,
Pete
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mikel
Super Contributor

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03-18-2011 11:05 PM
I have some easYgen settings recently done for a pair of 3520E engines from about 1year ago,
those were A3 ECM's, as I remember we had to make the sync dynamics pretty dumb. I also may
still have some settings from four C32's, can't remember what ECM's they had but I know loadshare
was not friendly in the beginning.

If you're who I think you are you can ask Dale H how to get a hold of me for further info on my
experiences with these type issues.

I have no 3.S experience and I'm not sure how much the firmware has been changed from the base
platform it's built from, so I'm not sure if the settings I have will be of any help.

Yes, the acceleration rate seems high. Looking at the actual vs desired can be a bear, you really
need CANAPE, if you can get one of the E&E folks to help, the update via ET is nearly useless in
figuring out these type problems, at least from what I've seen.

Mike L.
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smithj
Contributor

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03-17-2011 08:05 AM
Thanks for the information. I found out these are not ADEM 4 ECMs. These are Cat Switchgear
installations with PLC and EMCP 3.S controls. We have looked at the gain settings in the ECM and
nothing looked unusual except on at least one site the Acceleration Rate is set to 500 RPM/s which
seems high. Next step for us will be looking at desired vs. actual speed request.

Thanks
Thanks,
J
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mikel
Super Contributor

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03-15-2011 12:31 PM
Depending on what type of controller you're using to do syncing and load share, you may or may not
be able to address this, at least in my experience. For syncing try reducingyour sync gain and
stability settings, the likely culprit is that there is a filter on the speed setting input that is delaying
your input signal to the ECM, since it's embedded in the firmware, you have no access to it and until
someone at E&E figures it out (AGAIN!!!!) you'll have to deal with it.

If you're trying to use a Woodward DSLC, very low sync gain and stability settings help, as does
reducing the loadshare gain from the default of .75 down to about .35.

Adjusting the available dynamic settings available thru ET will likely not resolve the issue. When you
find this problem do have your dealer put in a DSN ticket so at least someone at the factory knows
this is going on.

You will also find on some units, if the engine is in a "Cold Mode" type of strategy, you may find
problems with paralleling at first start, then when tech comes on site to troubleshoot problem unit
syncs ok. If you're using an automatic sync system, try doing a cycle sync with a longer rest period
in between, something like 3 attempts of about 15 seconds with a 30 second rest in between. If you
have a life safety type system this can be a real pain and usually everyone just cranks open the
allowable close parameters and lets the unit come on hard.

I've done a fair number of these and usually find that the inital attempts to "fix" the problem result in
increasing the dynamic rate for the control, you actually need to slow it down, let the engine ECM
catch up with the request for speed or fuel change, then try again. A lot of systems nowdays don't
have a sync scope, find one and install temporary and use as a troubleshooting and adjustment tool,
you may ind it helps as well.

Hope that helps,
Mike L.
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smithj
Contributor
3500 SERIES - A4 - STABILITY PROBLEM

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03-15-2011 09:51 AM
Over the last two months I talked to several field engineers who are experiencing stability issues with
3500 series engines. They are all paralleling units with either PLC or gen/set controllers for load and
var sharing. The main problem is the synchronizing but it also affects load sharing. All of the units
have A4 controllers on the engine. They have adjusted gains in the ADEM to improve response but
it is still not as good as it has been in the past.

Is anyone else seeing this kind of problem?

Thanks
Thanks,
J
ADEM III Trouble Shooting
Course Date
Coming Soon
Course Duration
TBD
COURSE DESCRIPTION
This course covers the setup procedures for the G3500 ADEM III engine assembly and the G3500 ADEM
III conversion. We will look at the proper procedure for engine setup through the special instruction
manual and hands on troubleshooting diagnostics on the ADEM III engine.
PREREQUISITES
Students should have basic computer skills and have participated in the Gas Engines 1 and 2 courses
and experience in electrical diagnostics. Students must provide their own safety glasses, steel toed
footwear, hard hats and fire retardant coveralls with reflective stripe.
COURSE OBJECTIVES
 Basic differences between G3500 w/EIS and G3500 w/ADEM III.

 Brief overview of engine set-up (Gas Engine) procedures.
 Brief overview of Electronic Technician (ET).
 Procedures to follow regarding set-up of a G3500 ADEM III engine.
 Interpretation of ADEM III information regarding configuration parameters.
 Connecting Caterpillar Electronic Technician (ET) tooling to any Cat engine with ADEM III
Controls.
 ADEM III parameters and protection system.
 Determining parameters needed for your engine configuration.
 Entering fuel analysis information into your ADEM III engine control module.
 Proceed into troubleshooting engine and sensors
 Schematics (G3512)
 Hands on training in the lab
 Tune-up procedure on a G3500 engine.
After completion of the course the participant will be able to:
 Will successfully be able to identify components.

 Understand the operation of the ADEM III ECM and its role in engine start/stop and protection
and ignition operation.
 Demonstrate proper use of CAT ET for setup, troubleshooting, data logging.
 Properly tune the engine according to site specifics.
 Diagnose and troubleshoot problems in an ADEM III system.
http://training.finning.ca/TrainingDetails.aspx?TrainingCode=A009
Woodward Easygen 3500 and ADEM II w/CDVR

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05-30-2012 09:19 AM
Gentech
There are many after-market controls vendors, including Woodward and our company, DEIF, that
can be retrofitted and can communicate with the ADEM II. We are doing a lot right now with CAT
and large multiple-genset parallel power islands.
I respect your privacy so I won't send you a direct email unless you contact me first. Send me an
email and I will get you in touch with a local person that can talk to you.
Best regards,
Steve
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kchase
New member
Re: Woodward Easygen 3500 and ADEM II w/CDVR

[ Edited ]
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04-23-2012 01:36 PM - edited 04-23-2012 01:37 PM
Gentech,
The easYgen product has been used on countless CAT engines including ones controlled by the
CAT ADEM II controller. Engine information is limited on the CANbus of the ADEM II and protection
setup differs from application to application. Please feel free to contact Woodward support
at [email protected] for assistance
Thanks,
kchase
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Gentech
Visitor
WOODWARD EASYGEN 3500 AND ADEM II W/CDVR

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11-12-2011 12:30 PM
Hello all,

I would like to replace the current controls some equipment with the Woodward Easygen 3500
control. I have many questions but I will limit them to a few.

Can the Easygen get the engine data from the ADEM II via the engine level CAN input to the
control?

Does anyone have experience interfacing this control with a 3456 w/ ADEM II? Is anyone aware of
any known stumbling blocks?

If you were doing this retrofit would you let the protection in the CDVR be the primary or set the
Woodward as primary?

Thanks in advance for any assistance.

Gentech
G3500 SERIES ENGINE - MASTER MECHANIC COURSE - 5 1/2 DAYS
DATE TENTATIVE PROGRAM
Day 1 1 Introduction:
A. Introduction
B. CAT gas engines, gaseous fuel, Standard, Lean Burnt and Rich Burnt
2 Caterpillar Spark Ignited Lean Burn Engines Overview

A. Caterpillar Spark Ignited Engines
B. Spec Sheets - G3500
3 Application, Oil Selection and Maintenance
Lubrication and Maintenance

A. "Oil in Your Engine" Engine oil types, NGO oils, limits on ash and additives.
B. Oil coolers, affects of temperature on engine oil
C. Maintenance of lube system
1. Oil filter change periods.
2. Oil change periods
3. S.O.S. Schedule Oil Sampling
Repair and Maintenance

A. Scheduling preventative maintenance.
1. Routine maintenance and tune-ups
2. Top end and major overhauls.
3. Factors affecting engine life.
B. Tune-up and troubleshooting procedures

1. Trouble shooting low power complaints.
2. Evaluating engine condition.
C. Use of service manuals, parts book, and related information.
Application, Oil Selection and Maintenance
A. Air cleaners
1. Filtration capabilities and service life.
2. Maintenance intervals
B. Intake air piping and supply

1. Allowances of restriction
2. Temperature considerations
C. Cooling Systems
1. How cooling system maintenance will affect engine performance and emissions.
4 Fuel Supply characteristics - Natural Gas and Propane
GAS ENGINE FUELS

- HHV & LHV of Fuels
- Fuel BTU content
- PSHO and Fuel Summary Chart
A. BTU ratings per cubic foot
B. Fuel types and engine ratings
FUEL SUPPLY SYSTEMS

A. Supply pressure requirements, based on application.
Day 2 5 Regulator Systems - Fisher
Line pressure regulator

1. Pressure type regulators
2. Vacuum type regulators
6 Impco Carburetor and Linkage
Carburetor Slides
- Impco Carburators (slides) -200HP per diaphragm
Fuel gas control devices

1. Electric valves
2. Mechanical valves
Gas Engine Adjustments - Power valve

(Check engine performance and waste gate operation)
7 Turbocharger, Waste Gates & Aftercoolers

A. Turbochargers, Waste Gates & Aftercoolers
1. Turbo construction
2. Factors affecting turbo life
3. Explanation of Boost Curves
4. Waste gates
a. Purpose
b. How they affect engine operation
- After cooler operation
(Check engine performance and waste gate operation)
- Excess Power complaint

B. Aftercoolers
1. Importance of regulating intake air temperature
a. For engine performance and life.
b. For emission control in lean burn engines.
2. Separate circuit aftercoolers
a. Water temperature and flow requirements.
b. Seawater vs. freshwater type coolers.
C Engine exhaust system
8 Ignition System
A. Altronic Magneto Types

- Fixed, dual timing, variable timing
B. Affects of ignition timing on engine performance and emissions
Day 3 9 Ignition Coils, spark plugs
A. Wiring harness
1. Doing pin resistance check to qualify harness wiring.
B. Transformers
1. Construction difference between long and short spark duration coils.
2. Transformer checks.
C. Spark plugs
1. Spark plug construction and installation practices.
2. Different spark plugs used in CAT Engines.
3. Using spark plugs as a maintenance indicator.
4. Plug life consideration with lean burn engines.
D. Ignition System Harness & Timing Lab
10 Determining Engine Performance
A. How combination of factors will affect engine performance and emissions output.
B. Prestart adjustment and checks
C. Dynamic adjustments
1. Gas differential pressure
2. Timing.
3. Air / fuel ratio
11. G3512 Protection

- Engine speed Switch
- 1st level Engine Protection
12. G3512 Timing Control
- Detonation Sensitive Timing
13. G3512 Eng Control

- Emissions Control
- Environment Protection
Day 4 14. Electronic Control Module

A. Engine speed governing

B. Engine monitoring
C. Active and logged diagnostic
15. Input components

• Sensors / Switches / Pull-up voltage
16. Output components

• Solenoids / Digital displays
17. Engine electrical schematic diagram
18. Diagnostic tooling (CAT Electronic Technician)

1. Diagnostic / Events / Logged Events
2. Troubleshooting
Day 5 PRACTICAL SESSION @ PLATFORM,

1. Identification of engine major components and maintenance points
(Fuel, Cooling, Lube oil, Air intake & Exhaust and control)
2. Sensors locations
3. Use of CAT ET to read /monitor parameters, faults, record faults, history
4. Sensors faults
5. Wires and connectors maintenance
6. Engine timing, Valve lash, Ignition Timing and their importance
7. ADEM III controls
8. Detonation sensitive timing,
9. AFR adjustment
10. Emission level to engine performance
SIGN OFF PLATFORM

Day 6 Course review
Q&A
Feedback / Evaluation - Final Test

- Review Test
- Certificates hand-over
Re: Synchronizing /Load-sharing Panel Installation

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10-27-2011 12:18 AM
Hi,
There is no 52 contact needed.. The ADEM II will run is sochronous mode only.. It is similar to the
old 2301 speed control unit without load share function.
Hope this will be of help...
Regards
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emendel
New member

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10-25-2011 02:21 PM
Thanks very much for all the help! Yes, we will be running the 2301As in isochronous.

Another question re: the ADEM II. Does it require a 52A gen circuit breaker aux contact input? I can't
seem to find an input terminal on the schematics but they are not necessarily complete.

E
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Srivatsa
Regular Contributor
Employee

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10-24-2011 09:15 PM
Hi,
If the load share is being done by the EGCP then you would not need the LSM at all.. You can
directly provide PWM signal to the ADEM. The only issue could be that there will be no droop setting
in the ADEM II and the governor settings need to be matched with the other units. If you have set the
2301A on a droop mode then you will need to use the LSM for the 3456 and you can get it from your
CAT dealer. He should be able to provide the part number to you.. Alternately you can run the
2301A's in isochronous mode then you can do without the LSM..
Hope this will be of help.. If you need any further advise plese feel free to contact..
Regards
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Srivatsa
Regular Contributor
Employee

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10-24-2011 09:09 PM

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emendel
New member

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10-24-2011 03:33 PM
Srivatsa,

What is the part number for the CAT LSM?

On our site the 2301As only act as governors and do not communicate with one another. The
Woodward EGCP-3s are in charge of the Load Sharing. The EGCP-3 has a PWM specificially
designated for the CAT ADEM according to the Woodward installation manual.
When you say the system will be unstable if we use the PWM directly, what level of load swings are
you suggesting?

Thanks,
E

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Srivatsa
Regular Contributor
Employee

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10-24-2011 01:05 AM
Dear E,
Yes you will need the LSM from CAT to communicate with the existing 2301A's.. What you will need
to do is to first set the load gain voltages for all the units correct or you will have incorrect sharing
with the 3456. At their rated full load all the load gain voltages must match...
Hope this helps...
Regards
Srivatsa
emendel wrote:
Srivatsa,

We have (3) existing diesels connected with EGCP-3 (LS) controllers (and 2301A governors)
operating in Isochronous Load Sharing mode communicating over their LON network. We are
adding a CAT 3456 engine and planning to use an EGCP-3 (LS) with its speed bias PWM output
directly wired to the CAT's ADEM II. I want to confirm that this is doable or are you suggesting, in
your previous post, that a CAT LSM is still required?

Thanks,
E.

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emendel
New member

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10-18-2011 11:02 AM
Srivatsa,

We have (3) existing diesels connected with EGCP-3 (LS) controllers (and 2301A governors)
operating in Isochronous Load Sharing mode communicating over their LON network. We are
adding a CAT 3456 engine and planning to use an EGCP-3 (LS) with its speed bias PWM output
directly wired to the CAT's ADEM II. I want to confirm that this is doable or are you suggesting, in
your previous post, that a CAT LSM is still required?

Thanks,
E.
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Srivatsa
Regular Contributor
Employee

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11-16-2009 12:05 AM
Dear Coot-WGC,
The installing of a direct PWM signal with ADEM will work only if you have ADEM III and
above.. There should be a speed droop setting possibility in the ADEM controller if the extenal
load sharing is to be used for parallel operations.. We have had experience with switchgear
vendors trying with ADEM II with extrnal load controllers in parallel operations and have seen
erratic responses.. You will never be able to get it stable enough even if you alter the gain
settings.. Can confirm this from experience.. It is advised to use the CAT Load share module
when it comes to ADEM controllers without droop setting for parallel operations..
Hope this will be useful...
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Coot-WGC
Contributor

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08-20-2009 09:00 AM
Jumaj,

The CAT's are in place and the Easygens are on order. The remainder of our conversation can be
taken from the CAT blog pages, please contact me directly at [email protected] and I will
help you with the details.

In general, with regard to CAT's and the Easygens, the ADEM receives a PWM signal for speed
biasing and the Easygen does provide that signal. If the CAT's were purchased as paralleling units,
then they may have Load Share Modules (LSM's) installed. The LSM's can be removed for an
Easygen system. The Easygen can also bias the system through the LSM's, but this installation is a
bit messier and less responsive.

My commissioning experiences with CAT's and Easygens have consistently had one annoying
issue. The speed gain in the ADEM is a bit too high for the trim and load share biasing done by the
Easygen. The gain in the ADEM has been optimized for the CAT's as shipped, and the onsite
technicians are reluctant to alter the gain (when they had the software to do it) from the factory
setting. The result is a fast response, but a short ringing (or dampened oscillation) into stabile load
sharing - it works fine, but it is still hard to leave a site knowing the response could be improved.
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jumaj
Contributor

Options
08-20-2009 06:47 AM
Thank you Coot-WGC,

The bosses have already ordered EasyGen3200. I have no qualms about the quality or ability of this
controller. I am trying to learn as much as I can about the whole system before the controllers get
here, so that I may ask the right questions to get the installation and commissioning done 100%
correct. The supplier is the CAT dealer for Afghanistan and Pakistan. They could be the same
people who did the first DeepSea system that failed. I don't know that and noone seems to know that
here. It is upon me to make sure the system as a whole, once installed, works as it should without
shortcuts. I also intend to utilise as much as possible the EasyGen's monitoring and communication
capabilities. The techs will have to use the DataLinks. Do they know that? I don't know. Are they
intending to? I doubt it. I have to have the ADEM wiring diagrams to confirm that each individual
genset is sound to go before they start the EasyGen installation expected any time. Yes, at present
the gensets run well. But as mentioned earlier, it appears some modifications were done on the
control wiring. Since I don't have the diagrams I don't know what was moved where and why.
I have downloaded the EasyGen manuals, the Toolkit, and in the process of acquiring a good XP
laptop to talk to the controllers once they are set. My biggest worry is the controllers and ancilliary
switchgear for synch and load-share will be delivered, but lack of expertise to properly install and
commission the entire system will render the whole procurement null and void. I have to know that
they are doing the right control connections beforehand. I don't speak their lingo, they are no good in
English, I have to rely on diagrams to get any questions across.
Sorry about the rant. Thanks anyway for the support. So I am still in need of them diagrams. Right?
G3516 - Erratic engine RPM occurs intermittently

Options
05-06-2017 12:05 PM
The NOx sensor is for emission control but it does that job by telling the ECM that the air fuel ratio is
correct. The target NOx for a 0.5 g NOx emission is 60 ppm NOx. So when the ECM has warmed
up the NOx sensor (this takes about 7-8 minutes) and switches to the NOx feedback mode, the ECM
is looking to use the NOx signal to keep the engine air fuel ratio correct for the target NOx. If the
NOx sensor is not working correctly, the ECM cannot maintain a correct air fuel ratio because it has
no reference, so the engine operation could be unstable.
The engine has to be running over 900 rpm and have at least 25% load (about 20 psi inlet manifold
pressure) for the ECM to start the NOx sensor warmup process. Then it takes 7-8 minutes for this
warmup cycle to complete; you can watch it on the remote panel display. When it is complete, then
the ECM switches to the NOx feedback mode. You can see the ECM take over and the actual NOx
should begin to match the desired NOx on the screen. If you have no NOx value, then it is possible
that the NOx sensor is bad. I would think that you would also have a fault code but you might not;
the ECM just would not go into the NOx feedback mode. It would still be in the no feedback mode
and if the engine setup is not correct, the engine might be unstable in this mode as well.
If there is no NOx value, then you need to determine if the NOx sensor or the wiring from the NOx
sensor is bad. If it is, this must be repaired before the engine can be adjusted correctly. If you just
unplug the NOx sensor, the ECM will see that it is disconnected and give a fault code that it cannot
communicate with the sensor. The engine might run in the no feedback mode but if the adjustments
are correct, the engine might be unstable and the emissions will not be correct.
I will PM you might phone number if you want to discuss with me

Best Regards
Al Hunt
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ak_fieldtech
New member
Re: G3516 - Erratic engine RPM occurs intermittently

Options
05-06-2017 11:41 AM
Thank you for the reply, Al.

You mentioned that after the engine & NOx sensor warms up, the ECM takes over and moves into
the NOx feedback mode. Looking at the CAT panel in the fuel system section, I noticed that the
NOx sensor readings are zero, all over the map, or sometimes even asterisks.

Would a NOx sensor that is bad (or going bad) cause erratic RPM issues? I was under the
impression that NOx sensors were only for emissions control. Also, could I unplug the NOx sensor
from the wiring harness and run the unit for a day or two as a troubleshooting measure without
damaging the unit?

Thank you again for your help.

ak_fieldtech

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AlH
Trusted Contributor
Re: G3516 - Erratic engine RPM occurs intermittently

Options
05-05-2017 11:18 PM
Not knowing anything about the history of the engine, my first thought is to tell you that I would
perform engine setup again, according to the latest SM setup procedure. The latest one
KENR6892-10 SOTA has the correct procedure beginning on page 65. It is important to do this first
and correctly to get the engine setup correctly to run when starting up in the no feedback mode.
When the engine warms up a bit and the NOx sensor has warmed up and is operational, the ECM
takes over and moves into the NOx feedback mode.
After this setup procedure, you should load the engine to normal level and adjust the wastegate to
get the compressor bypass 10-15% open at rated load. Rated load can be compared using the inlet
manifold pressure and compare to the engine performance data sheet. This is the best comparison
for engine horsepower. If you are running less than 1400 rpm or less than rated load, then the
SOTA has some different values to compare for throttle plate position and compressor bypass
positions.
In addition, you might have to reduce the governor dynamic settings a bit but I wouldn't go overboard
with reducing these settings.
Doing these items in order should put you back in business for this late G3516B ULB. It should have
the later flash file to correct some of the issues early engines had.
You might have some issues due to compressor piping configuration. Many compressors impose
too much load on engines during startup and because of this the ECM operating software cannot
compensate enough to get the engine to settle down. If this engine has more than 35% load on it at
start up, then I suspect this is a large part of the problem. This might be made worse by changes in
operating pressures or compressor configuration that might have been made recently.

If you have further questions, let me know and we will work through it.
Best Regards,
Al Hunt
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ak_fieldtech
New member
G3516 - ERRATIC ENGINE RPM OCCURS INTERMITTENTLY

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05-05-2017 09:27 PM
Hello,

We have a G3516 CAT engine (serial no. N6E00122) driving a natural gas compressor,
commissioned in late 2015. Engine has 8157 hours of operation. We've been operating this unit
with relatively no issues until recently. The unit starts up fine, but the engine RPM will begin to
swing, approx. between 700 - 1200 RPM until operations personnel finally shuts down the unit (issue
does not self correct). These swings could occur anywhere from 30 minutes after startup, to a day
or two.

I know this isn't a bad magnetic pickup, as I can hear the engine surging and can see the discharge
flow rate swing as well when this is happening.

Any ideas would be very helpful and much appreciated. Please let me know if any additional info is
needed. Thanks in advance for your time.

ak_fieldtech
Engine Shuts down on "Fuel Gas Correction Factor Low Limit Reached" in
Combustion Mode

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05-27-2018 09:35 AM
Also sounds like fuel btu is to rich(guality number to high)...

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dirtydee
Contributor
Re: Engine Shuts down on "Fuel Gas Correction Factor Low Limit Reached" in
Combustion Mode

Options
05-27-2018 09:29 AM
Does this engine drive a compressor ?

Checked for leaks from packing gas could be supplied from a leak and ecm seeing that and leaning
you out beyond settings?
Just something to remember on compression
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AlH
Trusted Contributor
Combustion Mode

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04-25-2018 05:47 PM
I'm glad you have resolved your issue, although you won't really know until you run the engine again.

Best Regards,
Al Hunt
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kinder14
New member
Combustion Mode
[ Edited ]
Options
08-31-2017 04:47 PM - edited 08-31-2017 04:48 PM
I think we found the issue today, we started pulling heads with the hottest inlet port temps (using I/R
gun). Looks like we are leaking back through the intake valves putting heat and pressure back in the
intake manifold. Compression test and leakdown looked good when we tested last week...?
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AlH
Trusted Contributor
Combustion Mode

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08-31-2017 04:40 PM
I don't know. I haven't seen any message as to results.

Best Regards,
Al Hunt
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kinder14
New member
Combustion Mode

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08-31-2017 09:46 AM
Was this issue resolved? I have a simular issue with the exception being high inlet air temp. We
have done almost all of the above including new prechambers and scoping all heads.

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mugheesahmed
New member
Combustion Mode

Options
06-06-2017 01:11 AM
Hi AIH. Thanks for the detailed response. I will have to verify and execute some of your points.

In the meanwhile here are the responses for some of your points and queries:
- The fault appeared suddenly I'd say. This engine was removed from another nearby location (lets
call it Location A) 2-3 months back for In Frame Overhaul. Once it was ready and the opportunity
came, a normal operating engine (another G3612 A3) was removed at another location (lets call it
Location B) and this was installed in its place. From the removal of older engine to the installation of
this IFO'ed engine it took 3 days at Location B. At Location B older engine was operating just fine.
- Yes this is a G3612 A3.
- The pressure module has already been calibrated a number of times. I will however re-do it.
- Inspected the wastegate as well, from the inside. In fact already replaced with freshly overhauled
one.
- In all the starting attempts, once I was able to start and load this engine successfully as per
requirement. It was as if the problem had disappeared altogether suddenly. The engine ran fine with
all parameters as they normally are. Even the Fuel Correction Factor did not wander away from 100
much (minimum value 98%). It however shutdown on detonation 2 days later and started showing
same behvaiour i.e. it starts up fine but rpms and fuel correction factor gets disturbed as soon as it
achieves combustion mode (~40% load) and eventually shuts down on low fuel correction factor
limit.

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AlH
Trusted Contributor
Combustion Mode

Options
06-05-2017 10:02 PM
When a G3600 shutsdown on this code, it usually means that the fuel gas btu has changed beyond
the ECM ability to correct for the fuel change in btu. I assume that this is a G3612 A3. You don't
say if this fault started suddenly for no reason or if some site changes occurred or if any of the wells
in the system had received any nitrogen as part of servicing.

You have done a lot so I would say that it is time to start over with the basics, not necessarily in this
order but in total.
1. The pressure module must be calibrated to the site uncorrected barometric pressure. This must
be accurate so that the ECM knows the density of the site air and can correctly make calculations to
achieve the correct air/fuel ratio.
2. Turn all the needle valves out from fully closed 5 turns. This will be a starting point which will be
used for tuning later.
3. You said that all the valve lash is correct; inlet 0.020", exh. 0.050", GAV 0.025" are the correct
settings.
4. A fuel pressure of 43 psi is okay but not exactly spec. Spec is 45 +/- 2 psi. I find that I have better
results when setting the Fisher 99 to 46 psi.
5. You have checked all the linkages and they are adjusted correctly. But you need to make sure
that the butterfly for the wastegate and the choke are secure to the shaft and in place and working
inside, not just outside.
6. You need to enter the calculations from the Methane Number calculations of btu and specific
gravity. You will need to use the btu to adjust the air fuel ratio to obtain the correct NOx value when
tuning the engine in PC CAL. The correct btu is whatever value gives you the correct NOx: 50 ppm
for a 0.5 g NOx and 70 ppm for a 0.7 g NOx rating.
7. When the engine is in PC CAL with at least a 70% load, a) first adjust the btu in PC CAL to get
the NOx near the target then 2) adjust the needle valves to get the actual burn time equal to the
desired burn time. The engine average burn time should also be equal to the desired burn time or
real close, if you do this correctly. Before you take the engine out of PC CAL, note the inlet manifold
pressure. When the engine is back in combustion feedback, the inlet manifold pressure should not
change more than 1% from what it was in PC CAL.
8. If you still have an issue with starting, try starting the engine in PC CAL after doing steps above.

This is what I would do. Most of what you have tested or changed should not affect the engine to
generate this fault code. It is good that you know those items are okay. But I would start with what I
have set out above.
Let me know how things go.

Best Regards,
Al Hunt
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mugheesahmed
New member
ENGINE SHUTS DOWN ON "FUEL GAS CORRECTION

FACTOR LOW LIMIT REACHED" IN COMBUSTION MODE
[ Edited ]
Options
06-05-2017 09:21 PM - edited 06-05-2017 09:30 PM
The engine under consideration is 3612 on gas compression duty. The engine was put back online
after its In Frame Overhaul just 1.5 months back. Its fuel correction factor was noted to be 92% at
that time. Otherwise the engine ran fine and took load normally.

Recently as the engine was nearing its 1000 hours PM mark post IFO, the engine tripped on the
cause of “E885: Fuel Gas Correction Factor Low Limit Reached”

 The Engine was restarted. Engine started reliably. Stayed in initial starting mode reliably.
Went in to and stayed in “Exhaust” mode reliably. However during loading as soon as 40% load
was achieved and Engine mode changed to “Combustion” the “Fuel Gas Correction Factor
started to drop from 100%. It eventually reached 80%. After this engine failed to maintain its
speed and speed dropped. And eventually the engine tripped again on “E885: Fuel Gas
Correction Factor Low Limit Reached”. Sometime the engine would not tripped if immediately
unloaded but would not go back to combustion mode. (This has been the tripping behaviour for
all start up attempts since yesterday)
 As a remedial measure, a number of actions have been taken but the engine has been
invariably tripping in the same fashion. Dominant cause is “E885: Fuel Gas Correction Factor
Low Limit Reached”. Occasionally however “Unexpected Shutdown” is also seen.
 All Actions that have been taken are listed below. Please note that several attempts to
start the engine were taken after each action with slight variations in parameters/settings. Each of
the actions listed below has thus far failed:
 Adjustment of engine’s fuel quality by setting BTU & Specific Gravity. BTU
have been adjusted in between the range of 700 to 950. Specific Gravity has been adjusted
between the range of 0.58 to 0.62. A new setting has been tried on almost every startup and
loading attempt.
 Adjustment of pre-chamber fuel gas needle valves to make all cylinder
exhaust port temperatures uniform.
 Resetting of pre-chamber fuel gas needle valves as per user manual
instructions.
 Calibration of Air Fuel Ratio module
 Replacement of Air Fuel Ratio module with new one and new one’s calibration
(various value between range of 13.5psig 14.6)
 Verification of all electro-hydraulic actuators (Air choke / Fuel / Wastegate),
their linkages, connections, coils resistance, smooth movement.
 Replacement of waste gate and fuel electro-hydraulic actuators with new
ones. Replacement of one of the leaky hydraulic hoses on waste gate actuator.
 Replacement of Inlet Air Filters with new air filters.
 Main Fuel supply pressure was verified. Found to be 43psig.
 Gas admission and exhaust valve tappet clearance verification of 3-4 random
cylinders and was found ok.
 Using various loading strategies for example: increase speed up to 860 first
then load the engine, load the engine then increase speed, increase speed and load side by
side, very slow loading of engine etc.
 Tuning of Fuel Governor parameters conducted.
 Turbocharger inspection and gaps verification. Found ok.
 Gas admission and exhaust valve tappet clearance verification of all cylinders.
Valve lash inspection. Found ok.
 Compression test of all cylinders. Found ok.
 Spark plugs re-gapping
 Engine web deflection verification and found ok.
 Combustion sensors were replaced with new ones.
 Fuel actuator valve body was replaced with new.
 ECM/both ICSMs/RHS sensor harness/LHS sensor harness/Right side ignition
rail have all been replaced with new spares. Same behavior of Fuel Correction Factor Low
Limit.
 Verification of fuel gas quality and entry of verified fuel gas quality parameters
in to the ECM.
 Calibration of burn times carried out in "Prechamber calibration” mode.
 Checked ECM supply voltages & power connections in shutdown as well as
running condition. Found normal (varying between 22.5 to 24.5 VDC)
 Replaced RHS Ignition Rail with new one, as a major pinch point was
discovered on previous one’s flexible harness side.
 Set & verified rod end lengths for all electrohydraulic actuators (wastegate,
fuel, air choke) as per user manual.
 Replaced PCV on fuel gas supply line with a spare PCV.
 Set fuel gas supply pressure on PCV outlet to 55psig.
 Inspected upstream Fuel Gas Coalescer filters. The housing and filters were
found to be normal.
Any ideas that would be helpful at this point are most welcome...
C
WANT TO ADJUST FUEL CORRECTION FACTOR USING ET

OF G3516C

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07-23-2013 01:35 AM
Hi,
i have one g3516C i want to adjust the fuel correction factor using ET but this parameter did not
shown in configuration mode, so kindly help me asap.

Basic reason of changing this setting is to reduce the fuel consumption...

Regards,
Syed Umair Ali
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dave10010
Super Contributor
Re: want to adjust fuel correction factor using ET of g3516C

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07-23-2013 09:28 PM
Fuel correction factor applies to diesel engines, not gas engines. It's used when the calculated fuel
consumption displayed varies from actual fuel consumption. Has no effect on actual fuel
consumption of the engine.
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sumairali
New member

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08-05-2013 02:40 AM
I have adjusted BTU value of gas and also emission adjustment which changed the FCF, kindly tell
me how this FCF have a effect of BTU value of gas, thx.
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dave10010
Super Contributor

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08-05-2013 08:41 PM
My mistake. FCF for a gas engine is calculated by the engine ECM. and displayed on the status
screen in Cat ET. It's not a programmed value. Program the gas quality LHV so that the FCF is
within 5% of 100% with 50% or higher load.
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sumairali
New member

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08-06-2013 06:04 AM
I want to know how this FCF value change by changing emmision and btu value?

Everyone's Tags:
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Dfischbone
Contributor

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12-01-2015 08:47 PM
I came here looking for some more information regarding FCF. It is true that the FCF is not a
programmed parameter. It is adjusted by changing the waste gate position. If I recall correctly, the
wastegate is adjusted until the throttle postion is around 15% at load. Once the throttle position is
correctly set the FCF should be in the ball park. Also, there is a limitation of plus or minus 5-10% of
100% FCF. I have done this once but am interested in the correct procedure. As I find out I will
post in this thread.

And as for the BTU setting this is purely a function of the fuel analysis. From my experience I have
seen performance issues when going strictly by the published fuel analysis. If you truely have hot
gas you often must lower this number to prevent surging and erratic operation.
Darrel Fischer
Field Service Technician
Natural Gas Compression and Production
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Beeker
Contributor

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12-03-2015 12:24 PM

What engine do you have?

WHat is your FCF and BTU reading right now?

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Dfischbone
Contributor

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12-03-2015 03:17 PM
Correction from above post: It is not 15% Throttle Actuator Position Command.

It should be 15% Turbocharger Compressor Bypass Valve Position Command.

For example, I just commissioned a G3508ULB several weeks ago. According to the fuel analysis I
was provided the LHV was 1333 Btu/scf and the bypass was adjusted to 15% but the engine would
not operate properly with that so I lowered it to 1025 Btu/scf and the engine ran much better. With
this setting the FCF was 102%.

Two days ago I went back to the unit and found it operating with 88% FCF. I attribute this to the fact
that the fuel source is constantly changing. But even so the unit was running at nearly full speed
and full load.

Darrel Fischer
Field Service Technician
Natural Gas Compression and Production

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THE PARAMETERS SETTING OF CDVR&

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Re: 3500 Series - A4 - Stability Problem

No problem, just trying to help. Please post your end results.

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3500 SERIES - A4 - STABILITY PROBLEM

 Basic differences between G3500 w/EIS and G3500 w/ADEM III.

After completion of the course the participant will be able to:

 Will successfully be able to identify components.

Re: Woodward Easygen 3500 and ADEM II w/CDVR

04-23-2012 01:36 PM - edited 04-23-2012 01:37 PM

WOODWARD EASYGEN 3500 AND ADEM II W/CDVR

2 Caterpillar Spark Ignited Lean Burn Engines Overview

3 Application, Oil Selection and Maintenance

Lubrication and Maintenance

Repair and Maintenance

B. Tune-up and troubleshooting procedures

C. Use of service manuals, parts book, and related information.

Application, Oil Selection and Maintenance

B. Intake air piping and supply

GAS ENGINE FUELS

FUEL SUPPLY SYSTEMS

Line pressure regulator

6 Impco Carburetor and Linkage

Fuel gas control devices

Gas Engine Adjustments - Power valve

7 Turbocharger, Waste Gates & Aftercoolers

C Engine exhaust system

A. Altronic Magneto Types

Day 3 9 Ignition Coils, spark plugs

D. Ignition System Harness & Timing Lab

10 Determining Engine Performance

B. Prestart adjustment and checks

11. G3512 Protection

13. G3512 Eng Control

C. Active and logged diagnostic

15. Input components

16. Output components

17. Engine electrical schematic diagram

18. Diagnostic tooling (CAT Electronic Technician)

3. Use of CAT ET to read /monitor parameters, faults, record faults, history

5. Wires and connectors maintenance