Some WW1 Anti Tank Guns

[World B4]

The French 20mm antichar autocannon

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www.historicalfirearms.info

The American Winchester Pugsley anti tank rifle

Winchester-Pugsley anti-tank rifle

The Winchester-Pugsley anti-tank rifle (also known as the Model 1918 .50 caliber high-powered bolt-action swivel gun) was an American developmental anti-tank rifle. The weapon was designed by Edwin Pugsley during World War I in 1918, with the patent having been awarded in early December of that...

guns.fandom.com

The British Godsal 1918 anti tank rifle

Historical Firearms - Godsal 1918 Anti-Tank Rifle While the Imperial...

Godsal 1918 Anti-Tank Rifle While the Imperial German Army’s T-Gewehr is relatively well know, it’s short-lived British counterpart is almost unknown. The Godsal Anti-Tank rifle, developed in 1918, represents an answer to a problem Britain did not yet face. The name Philip Thomas Godsal is...

www.historicalfirearms.info

The German Fischer 3.7cm anti tank gun, 15 produced, supposedly combat tested

The History of the Panzerjäger

The German Panzerjäger, or Panzerjägertruppe, was one of the most innovative fighting arms of World War II and its story has never properly been told.Many books have focused on an element of the story – the Hetzer, Jagdpanzer, Jagdpanther – but this is the first time that the whole story of the...

books.google.com

On this article about the 3.7cm Tankabwherkanone Rheinmetall shows a photo of one next to a Fischer 3.7cm gun, providing a good size comparison

3.7 cm Tankabwehrkanone Rheinmetall - Tank Encyclopedia

The 3.7 cm Tankabwehrkanone was the first ever anti-tank cannon, developed in Germany during World War I to defeat the new British tanks.

www.tanks-encyclopedia.com

The German MG 18 Tuf, 50 were made, but never sent into combat before the war ended

TuF (Tank-und-Flieger) heavy machine gun (Germany) - Modern Firearms

The TuF (Tank-und-Flieger) heavy machine gun was designed in Germany toward the end of the First World war. As its name implied, it was intended to be used mostly against newest battle inventions of the WW1 era – tanks (armored vehicles) and aircrafts, which were used to bomb and atrafe with...

modernfirearms.net

I hope this is the right thread, I chose this one as opposed to the Rockets Missiles and Guns one because these weapons are a step above small arms and can be considered light artillery. Apologies if I am mistaken.

 

[Bottleship]

Russian M1875 Ghan-Krnka rampart rifle, .80 cal, 20.3x95R - suggested use for shoot of German and Austrian armoured cars, at 1915. Bullet (caliber - 20.98 mm) - armour-pierced with iron or steel core, 128 g (1975 gr), 23.4 g (361 gr) black powder, weight of cartridge 204 g (3148 gr). Weight of gun - 20.5 kg (45.2 lbs), lenght of barrel - 914 mm (36 inch), full lenght - 1440 mm (56.7 inch). Muzzle velocity - 427 mps (1400 fps), energy - 11 670 Joules. Piercing of 7.62 mm (.3 inch) iron sheet - on 854 m 100%, on 1067 m 50%. Recoil pad - with damping, for decrease of recoil. I haven't data about use of this gun at WW1.



Civil Zhelyazko from Warsaw proposed a "hand cannon" at 1915, but, I don't know a details.
...
Rheinmetall in 1918 proposed anti-tank rocket launcher with HE charge.
...
British/American early AT cartridge (.50 Colt-Kynoch):

 

[Ravinoff]

That whole area is a very interesting lineage, and honestly you could probably write a book (or at least a many-paged essay) on the convergent evolution of portable heavy guns into the modern long-range antimateriel rifle. Every 20 years or so from 1900 to when Ronnie Barrett's design finally caught on in the '80s, it seems like someone came along with something of this nature.

Here's one from the next wave after WWI, the Polish wz. 35, notable not so much for its design (a seriously overgrown Mauser action) as the slightly insane cartridge it fired: the 7.92x107(!)mm, which is essentially again an oversized Mauser round...except nobody told the bullet. So this beast fired a 225-grain bullet at a bit over 4000fps suitable for hunting Panzer I and IIs, with muzzle energy numbers just about equivalent to a .600 Nitro Express.

 

[Tony Williams]

British/American early AT cartridge (.50 Colt-Kynoch):

The .50 North dates from about 1901, long before the first tank emerged.

 

[Bottleship]

That whole area is a very interesting lineage, and honestly you could probably write a book (or at least a many-paged essay) on the convergent evolution of portable heavy guns into the modern long-range antimateriel rifle. Every 20 years or so from 1900 to when Ronnie Barrett's design finally caught on in the '80s, it seems like someone came along with something of this nature.

Here's one from the next wave after WWI, the Polish wz. 35, notable not so much for its design (a seriously overgrown Mauser action) as the slightly insane cartridge it fired: the 7.92x107(!)mm, which is essentially again an oversized Mauser round...except nobody told the bullet. So this beast fired a 225-grain bullet at a bit over 4000fps suitable for hunting Panzer I and IIs, with muzzle energy numbers just about equivalent to a .600 Nitro Express.

Soviet analogs of 7.92x107:

(7.62x122R, muzzle velocity 1100-1200 mps or 3608-3937 fps, bullet 10.25-11.05 g or 158-171 gr, energy 6201-7956 Joules)


Other powerful cartridges:
1st - 20x150R, 113 g (1474 gr), 1322 mps (4336 fps), energy 98.7 kiloJoules.
Other - 14.5x148, 64 g (988 gr), 1200 mps (3937 fps), energy 46 kiloJoules.


Two 14.5 mm machine guns, Salishev-Galkin SG-14.5 (14.5x114), and Volkov-Yartsev VYa-14.5 (14.5x148)


VYa-14.5 is analog of FN BRG-15 from 1942.
At 1946 worked at superfast ballistic rifle KB-P-440, 14.5 mm, with two charges. Speed - 1829 mps (6000 fps), energy - 107 kiloJoules. It was a weird gun with maximum pressure 343 MPa, with pressure relief through holes.
...
Engineers Druganov and Rogovtsev in 1905 projected high-velocity rifle with conical barrel and special bullet. And, it wasn't a first Russian rifle with conical barrel, at 1890th created version of .42 Berdan rifle with 10.67/9 mm barrel, but, used standart bullets.
...
V. G. Fedorov at 1913 worked at new 6, 6,5 and 7 mm cartridges. For 6.5x57 created three types of bullets - standart lead, AP with steel core, and AP with wolfram core.
Other engineer - Chemerzin - at 1914 created new bullet for 7.62x54R, with penetration 2.5 times more than standart M1908 bullet - only on metal shits.
Also, inventor Makhonine (later, worked in France, in aviation) constructed new special bullets, but, I haven't data about his projects.

 

[World B4]

CALIBRE GROUPS

You van view the ammunition for the French prototype here

 

[Bottleship]

Potential anti-tank cannon, more poweful than Tankabwehrkanone - Russian 47 mm Hotchkiss on wheel base, 1914:







Earliest variants of this gun created in Russian-Japanese war, 1904-1905.
British also used at WW1 47 mm Hotchkiss gun on wheel base.

 

[Bottleship]

Also, other guns:
Potential AT (Russian):
- Engineer I. P. Grave at 1915-1916 worked at 3-inch rocket with smokeless powder and single-shot light-weight launcher, for firing from trenches.
- Engineer Kuznetsov projected 2-inch light mortar on light wheel base.
- In 1916-1917 worked at new light-weight trench cannon, more effective and perfect, than 37 mm Rosenberg M1915 cannon (problems of M1915 gun - lack of horizontal targeting, massive base, ineffective shell). Created two projectes - light gun in 40-42 mm caliber, and, more massive gun, based on 47 mm Hotchkiss gun - I don't know, it's based on barrel of revolving cannon or based on long single-barrel cannon. Later, worked in 45 mm caliber, but, in 1917 project was stopped, and continued at 1920th in USSR - was created a 45 mm M1929 light hovitzer.
- In 1915 suggested a spring loaded light grenade launcher
Speciand AT:
- Robert Goddard in 1918 projected light single-barrel launcher for smokeless powder rocket.
- Rheinmetall in 1918 projected rocket launcher with explosive shell.

 

[Tony Williams]

British also used at WW1 47 mm Hotchkiss gun on wheel base.

The British used both Hotchkiss and Nordenfelt 3 pdr (47 mm) guns, firing the same ammunition. They were originally acquired as naval weapons, but were also used for coast defence, in both cases on pedestal mountings. A few were mounted on "Travelling Carriages", to provide landward defence for the coast artillery forts.

The British navy later acquired a Vickers 3 pdr, but that fired bigger ammunition with a much higher performance. Details of the British 47 mm guns and ammunition are here: http://quarryhs.co.uk/47mmUK.pdf

 

[World B4]

I came across this in relation to the .50 Colt-Kynoch/.50 North, hopefully it can offer some insight?

.50 Colt-Kynoch

In defense of the “North” designation, a cartridge with a similar profile is shown in the drawings of several patents for a drum-fed machine gun/automatic cannon applied by T. K. North between 1902 and 1909.

forum.cartridgecollectors.org

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Photo Storage

Store your photos and videos online with secure storage from Photobucket. Available on iOS, Android and desktop. Securely backup your memories and sign up today!

s381.photobucket.com

 

[Tony Williams]

I came across this in relation to the .50 Colt-Kynoch/.50 North, hopefully it can offer some insight?

.50 Colt-Kynoch

In defense of the “North” designation, a cartridge with a similar profile is shown in the drawings of several patents for a drum-fed machine gun/automatic cannon applied by T. K. North between 1902 and 1909.

forum.cartridgecollectors.org

There are times when more information merely confuses the issue...

 

[World B4]

The Tankgewehr had 2 upgrades over the course of it's production, a longer and thinner barrel and purpose-built bipod. But the developers actually experimented with a 5 round box magazine and spring-softened buttplate, neither of which would be mass produced. A good illustration is at 27:45

 

[Bottleship]

Also, T-gewehr (5-rd)

...
Photo of Ryabushinskiy 70 mm recoiless gun (Tsarist's Panzerschrek ):

Scheme:

Naval variant of "Rocket-bomb", "constructed in army":

Full weight 3 pood (49.14 kg or 108.33 lbs), TNT - 1.5 pood (24.57 kg or 54.17 lbs). Rate of fire in naval launcher - 3 rpm or more. I think, it's enough for destroy of Kolossal-wagen or other tanks
...
Projects of engineer Grave, rocket (smokeless powder) and launcher, 1916 (diameter of powder cilinder 70 mm):

 

[Bottleship]

Novitskiy-Fedorov heavy demolition grenade, full weight 2.25 kg (4.96 lbs), filling weight 1.65 kg (3.638 lbs):

You can see, sizes:

About naval anti-submarine "hand bombs" (depth charge), with filling weight 20 lbs (I don't know, it's a Russian merchant or artillery pounds, it's maybe a 8.19 kg or 9.84 kg):

Yes, I think about use of this monsters for destroy of tank. But, why not? At Winter war, Finns, used a heavy anti-tank grenades, to 4 kg.

 

[Bottleship]

Engineer M. M. Pomortsev:
Early rockets (to 1903):



Early launchers:

1903 rocket (based on 3-inch signal rocket, range 2-3 versta - 2.134-3.2 km)

1903 launcher (weight - ~16 kg):

 

[World B4]

The latest Tank Encyclopedia has a really interesting description of several french antitank weapons during WW1, I highly recommend it.

Canon de 25mm Semi-Automatique Modèle 1934 (25mm SA 34) - Tank Encyclopedia

The Canon de 25mm Semi-Automatique Modèle 1934, also known as the 25mm SA 34, was a French anti-tank gun designed in 1934 and used in WW2.

tanks-encyclopedia.com

 

[Tony Williams]

The latest Tank Encyclopedia has a really interesting description of several french antitank weapons during WW1, I highly recommend it.

Canon de 25mm Semi-Automatique Modèle 1934 (25mm SA 34) - Tank Encyclopedia

The Canon de 25mm Semi-Automatique Modèle 1934, also known as the 25mm SA 34, was a French anti-tank gun designed in 1934 and used in WW2.

tanks-encyclopedia.com

Does it feature the automatic version of the anti-tank gun, with the long, rimless ammo? Data would be interesting...

 

[cluttonfred]

How is a 1934 model a WWI item?

 

[Bottleship]

Special 200 mm shell for 47 mm Hotchkiss cannon, engineer Gobyato (Rus. Гобято):

load - 35 lbs (14.33 kg) TNT, range 278-370 m
...
Suggestions of one of Russian admirals, for AA artillery, 1915 - "machine gun, in caliber, bigger than .30, with explosive bullets", "1-inch automatic cannon", "increase of muzzle velocity of 3-inch AA gun to 700-800 mps" - it's a start of a .50 cal DShK HMG, 25 mm 72-K AA gun and 3-inch 3-K AA gun (815 mps)? Later, in early USSR, .5 and 1.0 inch caliber, was a universal, AA and AT. And, German 13 mm MG.18 TuF also was a universal gun.
...
D. I. Andriyevskiy detonator, 1865:

1 - iron filings, 2 - powder. Electric initiation. First Russian "HEAT" shell?
Also, von Foerster (German), Monroe (American). German and British 1910-1911 patents - shells, like a HEAT, for use in artillery, torpedoes, mines.

 

[World B4]

How is a 1934 model a WWI item?

Read it and see