Talk:Abby Rockefeller (ecologist)

She was not for Fairness and Equality!

"As most feminists, and like her comrades in Cell 16, Abby advocated fairness and equality in all areas;" This cannot be further from the truth since Cell16 advocated the SCUM Manifesto that recommends extermination of all men. Abby was the typical 1960s radical feminist supremacist. --Eizieizz (talk) 21:38, 19 September 2013 (UTC)

Neither statement seems quite right in terms of sources and the claim about typicality, if it is to be added to the article, needs a source. Nick Levinson (talk) 16:56, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

This was originally answered in detail, but rather than clutter the talk page, anyone interested can read for themselves what the primary members of Cell 16 thought and wanted, as recorded by Dana Densmore -- their view on S.C.U.M. Manifesto, their definite desire *not* to have violent altercations with men (let alone "exterminating" all of us) and what they did want: http://www.greenlion.com/NMFG/fmp.html

From "The Year of Living Dangerously" by Dana Densmore:

"We proposed women respecting themselves, valuing their lives, and insisting on being treated fairly if they are going to give of themselves, whether in the workplace or marriage or anywhere else. I still think our uncompromising approach was right. One has to be willing to face it all, to say that one's dignity and self-respect are more important than keeping a man or a job, more important perhaps even than life, if it comes to a need to take some risk."

Regarding their writings:

"The journal reflected our diversity, a dizzying mix of styles reflecting our group and the each-woman-speaks-her-mind editorial philosophy."

As the journal referenced above, opinions differed and all were respected within that continuum. Thus, any single part of the Manifesto should not be cherrypicked and taken to represent the beliefs or intents of Cell 16 as a whole, let alone feminists generally. Nor should it be taken as any literal threat against men generally or any men in particular. (Nor was the S.C.U.M. Manifesto written by Abby Rockefeller.)

That men today would be so upset by S.C.U.M Manifesto is peculiar, given the constant rape and murder threats made against women, generally and specifically, that are every day visible online. Are these going unnoticed by those who obsess over S.C.U.M.? But perhaps such fixations are more about men and our fears of change (and our strategies for avoiding it), than truly about women.

75.48.1.64 (talk) 18:41, 26 March 2015 (UTC) Updated by adding link to source page in the text because it was lost at the bottom 75.48.3.88 (talk) 04:37, 11 April 2015 (UTC)

References

Removal of passages apparently written before her birth, by her grandmother

The passages (A1) and (A2) below should be removed from this page, because (A2) is attributed by another PBS source to the current subject Abby Rockefeller's *grandmother*, Abigail Greene "Abby" Aldrich Rockefeller (October 26, 1874 – April 5, 1948).

(A1) "Not only was Abby a feminist whose subtle ways of doing things differently changed a prominent US family, but she was also a non acknowledged civil rights activist in her own home. She taught her children that color was not something we the people can change or make, and people should not be treated differently because of that fact. (A2) "It is to the everlasting disgrace of the United States that horrible lynchings and brutal race riots frequently occur in our midst. The social ostracism of the Jews is less barbaric, but... causes cruel injustice... I long to have our family stand firmly for what is best and highest in life... If you older boys will do it the younger will follow." (PBS)"American Experience: TV's Most-watched History Series." "PBS. PBS, n.d. Web. 07 May 2013."

From the PBS page at http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/features/biography/rockefellers-abby/ : "I want to make an appeal to your sense of fair play … to begin your lives by giving the other fellow a fair chance and a square deal," she wrote in a 1923 letter to John III, Nelson, and Laurance about the rise of racism, an issue most white Americans chose to deny or ignore at the time. "It is to the everlasting disgrace of the United States that horrible lynchings and brutal race riots frequently occur in our midst. The social ostracism of the Jews is less barbaric, but … causes cruel injustice … I long to have our family stand firmly for what is best and highest in life … If you older boys will do it the younger will follow."

Conversations with Cell 16, Schlesinger Library Source

"Despite her class background, Abby was subjected to many of the stinging barbs other women are subjected to. For instance, as a young girl she was told that although women did most of the cooking in the world only men could be great chefs. In her own relationships with men she often encountered the same sexist attitudes when they expressed an underlying trivialization or contempt for women’s aspirations - no matter the man’s class or race. Her feminism was not some dilettante's passing fad, but arose from an analysis of her lived experience. Some, mistakenly misreading her commitment to justice as vulnerability, tried to exploit her for her name or money."

This is not a real source. Having done extensive research on both Cell 16 and at the Schlesinger Library, I can safely say this is a made up source. There are conversations with the women in the group but they are in closed files until 2020 and it is impossible that the user could have opened them unless they were privy to the information beforehand or are the interviewer/interviewee themselves. I'm not sure if perhaps the source simply has an incorrect name, but I do not know to what else they would be referring. I do not know if this information is correct, but it is not from this source. I would recommend, instead perhaps look at the article : Baumgold, Julie. “You’ve Come A Long Way, Baby,” New York (June 9, 1969), 27-32, which can be found in the Schlesinger Library for proof of Rockefeller being exploited by others and feminist groups.

Rgmmagic (talk) 17:13, 7 June 2017 (UTC)

References

Requested move 9 August 2019

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Moved. Consensus for move. (non-admin closure) – Ammarpad (talk) 07:00, 16 August 2019 (UTC)

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• Abby Rockefeller → Abby Rockefeller (ecologist)
• Abby Rockefeller (disambiguation) → Abby Rockefeller

– There doesn't seem to be a primary topic for the name "Abby Rockefeller". Per historical significance, results that appear on third party search engines, and pageview comparisons, the possible front runner for the primary topic claim is Abby Aldrich Rockefeller, not the "de facto" primary topic currently sitting at the ambiguous title. Steel1943 (talk) 02:50, 9 August 2019 (UTC)

• Support Due to the page views not showing a clear primary topic. However, I'm open for a future move to mack Abby Aldrich Rockefeller the a primary topic.Josalm64rc (talk) 18:36, 9 August 2019 (UTC)
• Support per nom - no clear primary topic. move disambiguation page to basename. Paintspot Infez (talk) 20:03, 9 August 2019 (UTC)
• Support per nom, no clear primary topic. My personal opinion is that Abby Aldrich Rockefeller isn't the primary topic at this time either; she may receive more pageviews, but not by a significant enough margin (the other two topics together receive more than she does, as an example). CThomas³ (talk) 23:32, 12 August 2019 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Delete this page

Delete this page her brother David Jr who is a more important figure then her does not have a Wikipedia page so should not have a Wikipedia page either Clayweintraub (talk) 00:57, 5 June 2023 (UTC)