Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Omar Poveda

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. v/r - T P 03:15, 14 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Omar Poveda

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Minor league baseball free agent.. unlikely to ever make the majors.. no claim to notability Spanneraol (talk) 22:30, 5 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Baseball-related deletion discussions. Spanneraol (talk) 22:31, 5 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Not notable.--Yankees10 23:12, 5 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. Northamerica1000^(talk) 10:12, 6 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of United States of America-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:35, 6 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Venezuela-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:35, 6 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Delete – doesn't meet criteria of WP:BASEBALL/N. —Bloom6132 (talk) 20:07, 7 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Keep He played in the Venezuelan League, which is the top league in Venezuela. Therefore, he passes WP:BASEBALL/N per notability criterion 2: "Baseball figures are presumed notable if they...have appeared in at least one game [of] any...top-level national league." Alex (talk) 13:24, 8 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

In the past there has been much debate over if leagues in Venezuela and the Dominican really count as top level leagues.. I would say no on these. Spanneraol (talk) 13:27, 8 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

They are both the top level leagues in their respective nations, per their own Wikipedia articles. I cannot think of any leagues that are of higher rank. Per Wikipedia guidelines, he's notable. Alex (talk) 13:39, 8 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The argument could be made, and has in the past, that those countries simply don't have "top-level" leagues. As the summer leagues in those countries are developmental leagues for MLB teams and the winter leagues contain mostly fringe minor leaguers hoping to get more seasoning. Spanneraol (talk) 14:56, 8 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The basis for that claim includes assumptions and exceptions that are not included in WP:BASEBALL/N. As it is written, WP:BASEBALL/N would include the Venezuelan and Dominican winter leagues, as they are the nations' top level national leagues. The minor summer leagues are not what I would consider national leagues - rather, they are American leagues sanctioned to play and develop players from those nations. In addition, those leagues are a step above the competitive level of the developmental minor summer leagues (which consist almost solely of raw, developing teenagers and players in their early 20s), as they include - contrary to the above claim - numerous major league and high-level minor league players from around the world - from major league veterans to minor league top prospects (a glance at the Dominican league's leader board provides proof of that claim). If exceptions to WP:BASEBALL/N are desired, then one must petition a change in the wording of the rule. But as it is right now, the leagues and players in question fall entirely within the scope of WP:BASEBALL/N. Alex (talk) 15:37, 8 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

We really shouldn't be considering "winter leagues" to be the highest level of competition. That probably should be a discussion on NSPORTS's page (if that dicussion hasn't been had already). – Muboshgu (talk) 16:36, 8 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

It is open to interpretation... "top-level" doesn't necessarily mean the "highest level of competition in a particular country" but could instead refer to the top-level competition in the world.. meaning the top-level leagues would be MLB, NPB, KBO, etc... I wouldn't consider the winter leagues to be top-level anymore than I would consider the Italian League or the Brazilian League top-level. Spanneraol (talk) 16:47, 8 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

But we've kept articles on the premise that they played in the weak top leagues of various nations, like Mexico and Italy (see the AfDs for Homar Rojas and Henry Bonilla for examples). That said, I do not think the time of year the league plays should be a deciding factor in whether the league is top level or an article is worth keeping or not. The Dominican and Venezuelan summer leagues, which play a 'traditional' baseball season, are far less talent-laden and competitive leagues than their winter counterparts, which contain numerous major league, high minor and top prospect talents. In WP:BASEBALL/N, the leagues you mentioned are specifically enumerated by name in the rule, with "any other top-level national league" added at the end. That suggests that the "any other top-level national league" does refer to any and all national top leagues not mentioned. Alex (talk) 13:11, 13 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Delete As I recently wrote on the WP:Articles for deletion/Jose Lugo (2nd nomination) page: while WP:BASEBALL/N does state that a player is presumed notable if he/ she plays at a top national level, that is only a rule of thumb, not a policy: a player who has played at such a level may very well be notable, but such a presumption is subject to investigation— and if, after an investigation, the presumption is not met, then in my mind notability has not been established. This appears to be the case with this player. KDS4444^Talk 14:19, 12 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.