Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Medicine/Archive 171

Archive 165

←

Archive 169

Archive 170

Archive 171

Archive 172

Gustatory hyperhidrosis

After expanding Gustatory hyperhidrosis I'm starting to notice that most of the classification systems seem to list it as a synonym for Frey's syndrome. Before i make a redirect can anyone else find a clear distinction between the two.

Orpha entry, NORD entry, ICD11 classification, OMIM entry, MESH ID, Disease database entry. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 04:53, 28 March 2024 (UTC)

redirect--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 01:29, 7 April 2024 (UTC)

Promotional edits relating to Cord blood.

I've recently got done with reverting a large amount of promotional editing relating to private cord blood banks across several articles, from a couple of single-purpose IP editors. These edits included non-WP:MEDRS sourcing, namedropping of particular companies, and cherry-picking quotes from various bodies to misrepresent their support for cord blood treatments. Here's a list of articles I found problems with:

• Amniotic stem cells
• Cell potency
• Cord blood bank
• Cord blood
• Cordlife
• Cryo-Save
• Developmental verbal dyspraxia
• Hematopoietic stem cell transplantation
• Hematopoietic stem cell
• Ideational apraxia
• Matthew Schissler
• Motor neuron diseases
• Neurological disorder
• Prenatal care in the United States
• Regenerative medicine
• Stem cell
• Stem-cell therapy
• Tay–Sachs disease
• Umbilical cord

I think it is very likely that this is undisclosed paid editing. Please consider putting the affected articles on your watchlist to keep an eye out for more promo. - MrOllie (talk) 16:27, 22 March 2024 (UTC)

probably [1]--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:17, 7 April 2024 (UTC)

Sources for brain health and pollution / Vascular dementia

In case anyone is interested:

• [2]

A long list of sources for pollution and neurological conditions. --Dustfreeworld (talk) 21:23, 8 April 2024 (UTC);03:39, 9 April 2024 (UTC)

I think we need some help. One of the sources being preferred in Vascular dementia is apparently a 24-year-old newsletter "article" from a local medical club. Just having someone tag or remove the outdated material (twenty-four years old!) would be helpful. There are only five current editors watching this page. WhatamIdoing (talk) 02:58, 9 April 2024 (UTC)

The Cass Review

The Cass Review is an important and much anticipated "independent review of gender identity services for children and young people" led by Hilary Cass, which was commissioned by NHS England in 2020 and is due to report tomorrow (10th April 2024). It is likely to generate a lot of news coverage, but hopefully also some professional responses too. The Wikipedia article was only created yesterday by User:Void if removed so likely isn't on many watchlists. It would be good if editors here could help over the coming days. Thanks. -- Colin°^Talk 13:27, 9 April 2024 (UTC)

Chronic functional abdominal pain

I'm currently updating the page Chronic functional abdominal pain and I have questions about the article title.

The ICD11 lists it as functional abdominal pain syndrome.[3] However several article discuss renaming it to Centrally mediated abdominal pain syndrome.[4]

I'm just wondering what name would be more appropriate here. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 23:11, 9 April 2024 (UTC)

Since CMAP is mentioned in the first sentence of the lede it's probably not an issue worth worrying about, but WP:MEDTITLE guidance is always worth a read. CV9933 (talk) 11:29, 10 April 2024 (UTC)

Yeah the main problem I have with the current title is that it doesn't distinguish it as a syndrome or disease and that may lead to confusion. According to WP:MEDTITLE "The article title should be the scientific or recognised medical name that is most commonly used in recent, high-quality, English-language medical sources, rather than a lay term (unscientific or slang name) or an historical eponym that has been superseded." and the ICD-11 is recommended for disease names. The only thing is that the ICD-11 uses the term "functional abdominal pain syndrome" but newer literature including the Rome criteria uses the term " Centrally mediated abdominal pain syndrome" CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 19:13, 10 April 2024 (UTC)

These types of discussions often lead to those who would propose that when searched, title A produced X hits and title B returned XXX hits therefore title B should be used. But MEDTITLE also tells us that some terminology is in flux and recently proposed names may not yet be widespread in adoption, from which one might infer that there is no rush and doing nothing for now is probably the best course of action. CV9933 (talk) 19:42, 10 April 2024 (UTC)

My only problem with the current title is that it isn't commonly used in literature and isn't classified under any of the disease databases (for lack of better terms) that we use. WP:MEDTITTLE also specifies that "The article title should be the scientific or recognised medical name" which isn't true for Chronic functional abdominal pain. I think it would make more sense to rename it to "functional abdominal pain syndrome" as that seems to be the more recognized term and is what's used by the ICD-11 and because as you mentioned proposed names might not be widespread. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 20:31, 10 April 2024 (UTC)

You could be bold and just change it with your rationale in the edit summary, or propose a move on the article talk page. If the latter, then use it as an opportunity to gain consensus to update the title to CAMPS. CV9933 (talk) 08:49, 11 April 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for your help! I’ll change it tonight when I have the time to make sure all the names match. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 18:28, 11 April 2024 (UTC)

Navel fetishism

Hi - this article seems to have attracted a number of dubious claims / sources. I tried to delete a number of unreliable sources, but I think this article needs some serious editing to make sure statements are backed up by WP:MEDRS-worthy sources, which definitely isn't the case now. Thank you! GnocchiFan (talk) 21:13, 7 April 2024 (UTC)

per the talk page you might want to post at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Sexology and sexuality--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:42, 12 April 2024 (UTC)

MEDRS-related RfC

Note there is a RfC at

• Talk:Havana syndrome#Request for comment: Scope and sourcing

Which may be of interest to members of this noticeboard as it contains question about the application of MEDRS and invokes an 'Opposing view' for certain syndromes. Bon courage (talk) 02:50, 6 April 2024 (UTC)

• give opinion(gave mine)--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:44, 12 April 2024 (UTC)

Cass Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

---

Hi all

A major review into trans healthcare, the Cass Review, has been published in the UK, I'd really appreciate if people with an understanding of medical research could read it, its currently a very edited article with quite high traffic. To put it mildly the report is being used by politicians and press to push for restrictions to healthcare provisions. The report has been criticised by academics and trans groups in the UK for issues with both its research methodology and its recommendations, but I don't have experience in writing about this kind of thing on Wikipedia.

Thanks

John Cummings (talk) 11:00, 13 April 2024 (UTC)

hi, I could be wrong but if you look two/three spots up its the same post, --Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:10, 13 April 2024 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Thank you

Hi! I hope this is the right venue for this feedback. I have chronic medical problems that were slowly destroying my life, and none of my doctors could figure out what was going on or what to do about it. I have now identified some of my conditions and found treatments that help a great deal, and my doctors and I are working to understand my illness more clearly and improve my symptoms further. I finally get to start living a real life again, and I couldn't have done it without the tireless efforts of WikiProject Medicine contributors. I will be grateful forever, please keep up the great work. 174.21.188.119 (talk) 23:16, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

Question re medical terminology

There seems to be a debate over medical wording over at Talk:Death from laughter#"atonia" - link is broken, and word meaning?. Thought members of this WikiProject might be interested in this discussion, as I don't know how to rephrase the sentence to be clearer to the reader. – GnocchiFan (talk) 09:55, 14 April 2024 (UTC)

thank you for post--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:21, 17 April 2024 (UTC)

How do we welcome new medical editors? [2]

Reverts, inline tags, etc.

I believe this:

• https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Medicine&diff=prev&oldid=1212897332

and the subsequent comments,e.g.,

• https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Medicine&diff=prev&oldid=1213611691

warrant more discussion. I don't have time to come back to it yet, but perhaps others will do. Aside, I don't think the issue "How do we welcome new medical editors?" has been completely resolved. Thanks. --Dustfreeworld (talk) 05:03, 13 April 2024 (UTC); 13:34, 23 April 2024 (UTC)

Copied and continued from the closed thread above:

How do we welcome new editors? There's an essay (much of which I wrote): WP:Encourage the newcomers. It includes all the empirical evidence I could find on the question (if you find more, please add it). On account of said evidence, I think adding T209797 to Huggle might also be pretty effective. HLHJ (talk) 02:37, 10 March 2024 (UTC)

Thanks HLHJ. That’s a great essay. I’m especially amazed by the graphs, for example:

First message to new users (including vandals), by tool used. Reverts of new good-faith editors increased (from ~7% to ~20%) in 2007, and new editor retention dropped sharply.

I agree with you that adding the { { citation needed } } feature to Huggle may help. It will need other features like { { medref inline } } as welll. --Dustfreeworld (talk) 17:54, 11 March 2024 (UTC)

I think other tags are a good idea, too; I commented on T209797 to suggest a general tool for adding inline point & span tags. Anyone can add a comment or token; adding specific ideas about use cases might be quite useful.

I didn't actually make the graphs myself! It might be possible to remake that >decade-old graph live via Wikidata now. HLHJ (talk) 18:40, 11 March 2024 (UTC)

Yep the graph needs update. The trend seemed to indicate that “Other bots” were becoming the major problem (not Huggle) in 2011? --Dustfreeworld (talk) 18:49, 11 March 2024 (UTC)

I don't think Huggle is the problem; semi-automated editing countered an existential threat. Cluebot is, I think, also part of the solution; the third of those 2011 new users who were reverted by Cluebot were probably almost all vandals. Because the evidence says "inline-tagged new editors stay, reverted new editors leave", I think the problem is that it's now hard to inline-tag noob edits. This is not an intrinsic problem. It's hard to imagine a scenario where newcomers don't need semiautomated scrutiny. It's easy to imagine an interface where adding "cn" to a new edit is a single click.

The longstanding lack of semiautomated tagging capabilities is influencing our culture. Pre-2007, citation-needed tagging was very common. It was policy to tag only stuff you thought was unverifiable, and delete it only after giving others a chance to verify it (BLP excepted, it's still policy). Readers knew to distrust anything with a [[citation needed]] tag; it was part of pop culture.

Now, an increasing number of editors think they are expected to revert all probably-true but unsourced content (even on medieval Japanese furniture). It's rare to tag it first or talk to the contributing editor afterwards. I've been working on an explanatory template, contribs welcome.

The current interface marks new editors as pass/fail, and never as "imperfect, but means well and should improve". Whether a new editor will stay depends mostly on the fate of their first three or four edits. It's more a learning cliff than a learning curve. HLHJ (talk) 02:15, 14 March 2024 (UTC)

References

Should I omit products that are no longer in clinical trials under a company even with conflicting info on Wikipedia?

I am creating a page for a biopharmaceutical company (no relation), and am currently looking for products that they have been doing clinical trials on so I can list them as products that are currently in their product pipeline.

However, there is one article I have found right now for which the responsibility for clinical trials on a drug has been transferred to another company (although there are probably more that I will have to find).

When I list the drugs currently in the product pipeline for that company, should I omit those being run through clinical trials under another company (where the clinical trials was originally being run under said company), even with conflicting info on Wikipedia?

CrSb0001 (talk) 13:25, 26 April 2024 (UTC)

@CrSb0001, is this the situation you're describing?

• Company A researched Wonderpam for a while.
• Company A transferred Wonderpam to Company B.
• The Wikipedia article on Wonderpam says Company A is researching it.

If so, I suggest that you correct the Wikipedia article on Wonderpam (to say something like "Company A did some research from 2018 to 2020, and transferred it to Company B in 2021", or whatever the accurate and up-to-date facts are) and that you mention Wonderpam in articles for both companies. Company A's should say "worked on from 2018 to 2020" (maybe in a ==History== or ==Timeline== section?) and Company B's should list it as a current pipeline item.

Also, if you're thinking of a list for pipeline items, I suggest that a list with more information than just the names would be helpful. Even something as short as "Wonderpam, new class of antibiotics" or "Wonderpam, entered phase II trials in 2022" would be more informative than the name alone. WhatamIdoing (talk) 16:10, 26 April 2024 (UTC)

Yes, that is the situation I'm describing. Thank you.

CrSb0001 (talk) 16:13, 26 April 2024 (UTC)

I kind of wonder how many drugs the average pharma company is researching at any given moment. Might be difficult to keep such a list up-to-date, and how long would the list become? Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 07:47, 27 April 2024 (UTC)

Student editing

FYI, heads up about student editing of medical articles (Medicine and Pharmacy is the subject). Wikipedia:Wiki Ed/University of Manitoba/PHMD 2040 Service - Learning Spring 2024 (2nd term) --Whywhenwhohow (talk) 02:31, 29 April 2024 (UTC)

Activity feed here --Whywhenwhohow (talk) 02:35, 29 April 2024 (UTC)

Why is there a wrist pain page?

This is such a general page. And much of the information is negatively framed in an unhealthy ways. Ischyros7 (talk) 15:45, 30 April 2024 (UTC)

Wrist pain looks like it would be a useful page for people who want general information or can't remember the name of a particular condition. Sometimes you just need to look down a list of possible names until you recognize the one that you're looking for. I'm not sure what you mean by "negatively framed". Mostly, I think it has so little information that there's no room for framing it.

@Zefr blanked a bunch of content a few months ago. (This is what I call treating Wikipedia like the children's game of Mother may I?: He blanked non-controversial content that he knew was accurate and appropriate, on the grounds that the cited source wasn't ideal. Most of us would have found a better source or tagged it with {{medrs}} instead.) It would probably be good to expand it again. We're missing articles on gymnast's wrist (which is really multiple conditions), so that's one place to start, if anyone's interested. WhatamIdoing (talk) 16:18, 30 April 2024 (UTC)

That content had been added just a few hours before by someone who was clearly just doing so so they could spam links to a small practice's website. MrOllie (talk) 16:21, 30 April 2024 (UTC)

I agree that the cited source is not ideal. WhatamIdoing (talk) 19:14, 30 April 2024 (UTC)

Use of Verywell Health for the Myolysis article

There is a request to add the Verywell Health page "Myolysis: Everything You Need to Know" (https://www.verywellhealth.com/myolysis-5189197) to the spam whitelist so that it can be cited in the Myolysis article. Verywell Health (RSP entry) was previously added to the spam blacklist in 2018 because links to Verywell sites had been spammed on Wikipedia. If this whitelisting request is successful, it would be possible for editors to link to this specific page on Wikipedia again.

The whitelisting request proposes citing "Myolysis: Everything You Need to Know" as a tertiary source to augment citations of two other sources that Verywell Health cites and summarizes, "Uterine Fibroids" (New York State Department of Health) and "Uterine Fibroids" (Brigham and Women's Hospital). I'd like to confirm whether this is an appropriate use of Verywell Health per WP:MEDPOP ("One possibility is to cite a higher-quality source along with a more-accessible popular source.") before adding the article to the spam whitelist.

Please join the discussion at WT:SWL § "Myolysis: Everything You Need to Know" to share your input. Thank you. — Newslinger talk 05:04, 25 April 2024 (UTC)

commented--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 18:04, 1 May 2024 (UTC)

Calomel - should it be separated into medicine vs rock/mineral?

I made some edits to the page for the historical medicine calomel (that caused mercury poisoning) but the Wikipedia page for it is a strange mix of a page describing the mineral and a page about the medical uses. Perhaps someone with more knowledge about how to work with this kind of page could help here - should there be two separate pages? Lijil (talk) 10:40, 1 May 2024 (UTC)

The Medicine section is too small to really warrant a separate page, and the calomel page overall isn't TOOBIG. I'd suggest framing the page around MOS:CHEM for compounds, which has a Uses section, so its medical use could be seen within that context. Klbrain (talk) 09:58, 2 May 2024 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:2022–2023 mpox outbreak#Requested move 22 April 2024

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:2022–2023 mpox outbreak#Requested move 22 April 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. RodRabelo7 (talk) 05:31, 28 April 2024 (UTC)

it has been closed with 'no consensus', thank you--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:26, 6 May 2024 (UTC)

Trodusquemine

I recently reverted some major changes to trodusquemine that a new editor made to this article because I thought that they were one-sided. Another editor has now restored those changes. I notice that there seems to be a history of conflict of interest problems and sockpuppetry associated with the article and that the most recent editor's username matches the last name of the lead author of newly added references. So maybe some more experienced editors can have a look? Thank you. Reba16 (talk) 01:10, 16 April 2024 (UTC)

Rolled back, and COI Welcome template added to ZASLOFF's talk page, given that Zasloff is an author of the cited article(s). The revision was also much worse than the original. Klbrain (talk) 09:35, 16 April 2024 (UTC)

The reverts and rollbacks were not effective. Discussions are on the article and editor talk pages. The editor appears to have used multiple accounts and been blocked previously. Adding admin @DMacks: who has also reverted the page.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Trodusquemine#The%20works%20of%20ZASLOFF

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:ZASLOFF

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Whywhenwhohow#Trodusquemine

--Whywhenwhohow (talk) 06:30, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

Fatigue

Asto77 (talk · contribs) is looking for feedback on the Fatigue article. He posted a request on my talk page. I'm posting the request here for a wider audience. --Whywhenwhohow (talk) 03:53, 4 May 2024 (UTC)

it seems the article sections need to be reorganized and there are sections that have many primary sources that need to be replaced with better sources(did some edits) IMO--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:33, 10 May 2024 (UTC)

About Visual impairments in Alzheimer's disease

I'd appreciate any help from members of this WikiProject in determining the best course of action with this article. It was created by a WikiEd student editor, Eg2619, and is a contested draftification. The article currently needs some cleanup with regards to layout, and contains some essay-like language that's not appropriate for an encyclopedic article. I'm also unsure if this subject merits a standalone article, or whether a merge to another article may be appropriate. Thanks in advance, and let me know if you have any questions! —TechnoSquirrel69 (sigh) 05:25, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

TechnoSquirrel69 thanks for raising the issue here. I moved the article back to userspace. I have my doubts whether this can be salvaged at all, but it doesn't belong in mainspace in this state.

Since the class is over, I'm hoping this will be the end of it. But if there's anything in the student's work that could improve the main Alzheimer's article, the sandbox is here User:Eg2619/Alzheimer's disease. Ian (Wiki Ed) (talk) 15:46, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Edit flagged as predatory journal - need help finding out which citation

Hi all, I recently committed a large paragraph edit with numerous citations using the visual editor, and when committing the edit, I got a notice that one of the citations was automatically flagged as potentially from a predatory journal. However, the popup notice didn't fit in the publish edit popup box, so I was unable to read the whole notice or see which of the citations was flagged. Can someone point me to a tool that I can use to scan the article for potentially predatory journals, so I can see and fix this citation problem? How can I avoid stumbling into this problem again, and why did the formatting of the publish edit box prevent me from seeing the whole notice? The citations in question were the best available for a scientific project based in India that is necessary for discussion on the page I am editing. Thanks!

Willmskinner (talk) 21:44, 10 May 2024 (UTC)

User:Headbomb/unreliable.js D6194c-1cc (talk) 22:03, 10 May 2024 (UTC)

Great, thanks, I used that tool to find the citation in question, and it is a publication in a journal that is owned by the predatory OMICs conglomerate, but the paper in question seems to be the only report available about the Indian clinical trial in question, so I am inclined to leave it included. Link here: [5] Will this cause any flagging or downrating of the article I am editing?

Thanks,

Willmskinner (talk) 22:28, 10 May 2024 (UTC)

Purge it with prejudice. Nothing from OMICS comes remotely close to WP:MEDRS/WP:DUE Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 00:08, 11 May 2024 (UTC)

But this leads to a question: if I need to discuss the results of the clinical trial in question, the only other articles possible to use are news articles that are clearly referencing the data from this paper. That would look better to the citewatch script but certainly wouldn't actually be more reliable as a source... I can reference the existence of the trial through clinical trial registry webpages, but those don't include the results from it. Willmskinner (talk) 18:27, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

Is this for Male contraceptive? Which trial is it? WhatamIdoing (talk) 20:45, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

Why do you need to reference a trial that can't even bother to go through peer review? Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 23:54, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

WhatamIdoing yes! I've copied the paragraph in question here below. For context, this project was the first method of vas-occlusive contraception to be investigated, and gets a very large amount of (often overblown) publicity in the general news media. It has performed multiple clinical trials in India in the last 40 years (some of which have had to be repeated to reach international standards, I believe) and most importantly, has now been approved by the Indian Drug Controller's office (equivalent of the US FDA) for use in India, though it has not reached the market yet (supposedly due to manufacturing scale-up issues). The results of the most recent clinical trial were published in a predatory and possibly poorly peer-reviewed journal, yes, but I don't know whether the authors were aware of that. I'm struggling to figure out how to discuss this project with fairness, given the seemingly earnest efforts of the treatments creators and the difficult structural conditions for research in India, and the fact that it may soon available for use by over a billion people, while being honest about the project's shortcomings. I would appreciate any thoughts!

"RISUG is an injectable male contraceptive implant that has been in development in India since the 1970s, and completed Phase-III clinical trials in India in 2017, completely blocking sperm release in 97.3% of users and achieving a 99.02% effectiveness at preventing pregnancy "without any serious side effect". As of 2022, RISUG was awaiting approval from the Drug Controller General of India for mass production. RISUG is proposed to be reversed through a second injection that dissolves the polymer, though reversibility has not yet been demonstrated in humans."

Willmskinner (talk) 16:35, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

It'd be silly to have Male contraceptive completely omit information about Reversible inhibition of sperm under guidance (RISUG), especially now that it has marketing approval to the largest market on the planet, but it's difficult to find really good sources.

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1111/andr.13525 has a paragraph on RISUG that gives lower numbers ("A subsequent limited phase III study of 139 men showed that the Reversible Inhibition of Sperm Under Guidance procedure produced persistent azoospermia in 82.7% of men"). https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8169637/ mentions that it's "effective", but without any specific numbers.

I wonder whether it's actually important to include specific numbers in this article. Perhaps it's enough to say that it appears to be effective. WhatamIdoing (talk) 04:11, 16 May 2024 (UTC)

Thanks, yeah, that review paper is great! The trial they are referring to in there with lower numbers was for an earlier "restricted" phase III trial with fewer participants. I suppose I could just report the results from that one and then mention the existence of the newest trial by citing a news article about it. I'm still hesitant to reference anything that contains the possibly non-peer reviewed statistics in there, but I will at least refrain from mentioning those questionable statistics myself. Thanks for the help, everyone! Willmskinner (talk) 05:33, 16 May 2024 (UTC)

References

Methylphenidate redux - clinical trial quality, risk of bias - comments?

More discussion on the efficacy and quality of the evidence base for methylphenidate! Opinions for consensus sought. Those knowledgeable about systematic reviews and risk of bias in clinical trials particularly appreciated. Feline negativity (talk) 21:05, 2 May 2024 (UTC)

• direct link Talk:Methylphenidate#Balancing article information about methylphenidate; call for consensus--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:29, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Bot_requests#User:RetractionBot,_v2

Some of you may have some thoughts on the proposed bot task. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 20:11, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Methionine

User is restoring a bunch of old animal models on Methionine. Content such as "A 2009 study on rats showed "methionine supplementation in the diet specifically increases mitochondrial ROS production and mitochondrial DNA oxidative damage in rat liver mitochondria offering a plausible mechanism for its hepatotoxicity" isn't good evidence. One of the listed sources [6] describes a calorie-restricted diet on fruit flies. I am not sure why this is relevant to the article. Per WP:MEDANIMAL I do not believe we should be citing small scale cherry-picked animal studies like this which are clearly weak evidence. Psychologist Guy (talk) 02:00, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

There are over 120 review articles with 'methionine' in their title on PubMed over the last 5 years. There would seem to be little need to cite any articles older than those (as there are plenty of good recent ones to choose from). If one were to flesh out the clinical use paragraph in Methionine, then one should probably not dwell on its use for aging, but also include a balance of review articles covering all of its uses (and potential uses). Over a dozen of these 120 review articles discuss aging, so it is appropriate to include aging as part of a balanced coverage - but please use these more recent review articles as references. Jaredroach (talk) 02:58, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:TOPS System#Requested move 20 May 2024

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:TOPS System#Requested move 20 May 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Alpha3031 (t • c) 04:12, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Recreation: Anesthesiology task force

Hi, I'm writing this message in relation to the old anesthesiology task force. I was curious as to the interest in recreating and maintaining this task force which had never been truly established. If anyone is interested, or would like to provide a comment, please reply to this topic. Thanks,Neuropol^Talk 17:44, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi Neuropol, you're most welcome to unilaterally edit the task force pages, and to set them up however you see fit. I'll gently warn that the engine of each WikiProject/task force is the people, not the pages. Many WikiProjects/task forces were setup in our headier days, but over the years most haven't drawn a consistent group of editors to support them, and have lapsed into disuse. Thus, my advice: if you want an anesthesiology task force, focus on recruiting and cultivating a group of anesthesiology-interested editors, rather than organizing the task force pages. If the group is so large/active that you need the separate page to coordinate your efforts, then the task force is well on its way. Best of luck, Ajpolino (talk) 22:54, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Metastatic carcinoma

Should Metastatic carcinoma be redirected to Metastasis. I know the terms are technically different but Metastasis covers the topic of Metastatic carcinoma pretty well and I feel like if Metastatic carcinoma was expanded there would be a lot of overlap with the page Metastasis. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 01:24, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Perhaps a reader interested in metastatic carcinoma would be better served by the article carcinoma? I agree with your basic premise that developing an article on "metastatic carcinoma" is (while possible?) probably not the best context to present that information in. Ajpolino (talk) 01:35, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

That's a good point, I'm honestly not sure which article would make a better target for a redirect. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 01:41, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

I would definitely put "Metastatic carcinoma" as a subheader in the article Carcinoma. It does not stand on its own as a separate article. Indeed, there is already a Carcinoma#Invasion and metastasis subheader. The text could just go there — no need for new subheader. Jaredroach (talk) 02:49, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for your help! CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 02:31, 23 May 2024 (UTC)

Factitial dermatitis

I noticed that the template for Factitial dermatitis (see below) has the subsections labelled as 1010. Does anyone know what classification was being used here? CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 04:27, 24 May 2024 (UTC)

CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 04:27, 24 May 2024 (UTC)

Here's the edit as part of an attempt to action this bot request (a follow-up to this WT:MED discussion). I'm not clever enough to figure how "1010" ended up as the text, but I believe the intention was to replace the ICD code numbers with something human readable. Ajpolino (talk) 05:19, 24 May 2024 (UTC)

Thank you! I will manually edit the sections! CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 17:36, 24 May 2024 (UTC)

New paper on Wikipedia's medical coverage

I happened to run into this while reading PeerJ's recent publications and thought it'd be of interest:

• Li X, Chen K, Jia Y, Yin F, Wen X, Wang C, Li Z, Zhang H (2024). "Assessment of medical information on irritable bowel syndrome information in Wikipedia and Baidu Encyclopedia: Comparative study". PeerJ. 12: e17264. doi:10.7717/peerj.17264. PMC 11129691. PMID 38803580.

Looking at the supplementary material, it seems they reviewed Irritable bowel syndrome, Functional constipation, Constipation, Dysbiosis, Flatulence, Functional gastrointestinal disorder, Indigestion, Intestinal malrotation, Levator ani syndrome, Neurogenic bowel dysfunction, Proctalgia fugax, and Small intestinal bacterial overgrowth. The conclusions are reasonably flattering. Notably, the authors seem aware of talk pages and content assessment. Vaticidalprophet 05:57, 27 May 2024 (UTC)

interesting read--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 11:24, 30 May 2024 (UTC)

Baidu is a fork of the Chinese-language Wikipedia. WhatamIdoing (talk) 16:36, 30 May 2024 (UTC)

Transvestic fetishism article

Edit: Never mind, disregard. – 104.177.77.7; 03:03, 30 May 2024 (UTC)

104.177, total re-writes on hot-button subjects are rarely successful. I suggest trying to make changes stepwise. Add or change one sentence, paragraph, or section at a time, and let people have a while to "get used to" the new content before making the next change. It sounds like one of the improvements you should prioritize is differentiating Transvestic fetishism from Cross-dressing.

By the way, one thing that you absolutely cannot do is quote the full DSM criteria (which are copyrighted). We don't allow this in any article, even under fair use claims. So your change would have been reverted even if everyone agreed with it.

Please consider going to Special:CreateAccount and creating an account. This is to protect your own privacy. WhatamIdoing (talk) 16:51, 30 May 2024 (UTC)

Free access to high-quality sources

If you need access to books or journals from these publishers:

• Taylor & Francis 
• Springer
• Nature
• De Gruyter
• American Psychiatric Association
• Perlego (online library, includes Wiley)
• Wiley (publisher) itself
• MIT Press Journals
• Oxford Reference
• Science (journal) (and others from American Association for the Advancement of Science)
• American Speech-Language-Hearing Association
• Journal of the American Medical Association
• Annual Reviews (publisher) (51 journals, all review articles)
• Cochrane Library
• Elsevier's ScienceDirect
• Future Medicine (and Future Science, which does pharmacology)
• SAGE Journals
• World Scientific

then please see Wikipedia:The Wikipedia Library.

Note that you have to individually sign up for Perlego and MIT, and some of them (approximately the top half of this list) aren't integrated into the search box at the top of the page. In those cases, you have to find, e.g., the box for Nature, click on "Access collection", and search their website directly. WhatamIdoing (talk) 02:58, 11 May 2024 (UTC)

I got approved for Perlego. So far, I've found a (complete, legal) copy of the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, Fifth Edition, Text Revision (DSM-5-TR). I recognize a few titles (e.g., The Royal Marsden Manual of Clinical Nursing Procedures, Neal's Medical Pharmacology at a Glance, Hoffbrand's Essential Haematology...), but there are several thousand recent books about health and medicine (including vet med and dentistry) on this website, and the search is designed for a student who has been assigned a specific textbook, so assembling a highlights reel is a little challenging.

If anyone has a favorite book that they'd like to find, please post the name, and I'll see if it's in the list. I'm also willing to do searches for topics (e.g., 150 books on COVID, 22 books during the last five years on epilepsy, ), if you are working on an article and want to see whether it's worth the 60 seconds to apply (It is! And TWL still has almost two thousand unclaimed accounts available for Perlego, so you don't worry that you might taking something away from another editor if you sign up now). There are also books available in several other languages, in case anyone regularly edits at another Wikipedia. I think this is going to be a great resource for editors. WhatamIdoing (talk) 00:51, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

Does anyone need the 2021 edition of Maudsley Prescribing Guidelines in Psychiatry? TWL > Wiley > MPG.

How about the 2024 edition of Rook's Textbook of Dermatology? Same song, second verse. Once you're logged in to the TWL system, then I think that this link will take you there. (This set is $610 today at Amazon, or free with TWL.)

I've been working with the 2022 update to Holland-Frei Cancer Medicine. Find your favorite chapters at TWL.

Here are some more names:

• Burger's Medicinal Chemistry and Drug Discovery
• The Cancer Handbook
• Comprehensive Physiology
• Encyclopedia of Cognitive Science
• Encyclopedia of Drug Metabolism and Interactions
• Handbook of Contemporary Neuropharmacology
• Handbook of Evidence‐Based Practice in Clinical Psychology
• International Textbook of Diabetes Mellitus
• Management of Genetic Syndromes
• Pharmaceutical Sciences Encyclopedia: Drug Discovery, Development, and Manufacturing
• Reviews in Cell Biology and Molecular Medicine
• TNM Online
• Wiley Handbook of Current and Emerging Drug Therapies

This is not a complete list by any means. There are 200+ books on dentistry, 500 on health and healthcare, 2800+ on medical science, 275 on nursing and midwifery, 475 on veterinary medicine. No matter what you're writing about, there is likely to be a textbook or reference work here that is relevant. WhatamIdoing (talk) 06:47, 1 June 2024 (UTC)

Hip replacement

I've just tagged the hip replacement article based on widespread inclusion of unsourced biomedical information. Given the importance of this procedure, editors may be interested in looking into this topic. Sunrise (talk) 14:44, 23 May 2024 (UTC)

did a few edits[7]--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:18, 1 June 2024 (UTC)

Help request

Hello, Mental health in South Korea is in need of significant expansion, and any help is appreciated. Mental health is a pretty significant issue in the country, and on articles like this we have a chance to make an impact by spreading needed awareness. Fortunately, there seems to be a decent amount of literature in the English language on the topic; if you can help out please do. 104.232.119.107 (talk) 05:25, 26 May 2024 (UTC)

thanks for posting--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:18, 1 June 2024 (UTC)

Highly malignant oligodendroglioma, grade IV

I would like to start this text "Highly malignant oligodendroglioma, grade IV" as an article. Where could I find more information, like glioblastoma? On anaplastic oligodendroglioma you can already see where there is already. Wname1 (talk) 18:14, 2 June 2024 (UTC)

Anaplastic oligodendroglioma -- CFCF (talk) 01:25, 3 June 2024 (UTC)

What's the distinction from glioblastoma? My understanding of the WHO criteria is that so far, most grade IV brain tumours are lumped into "glioblastoma". Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 06:58, 3 June 2024 (UTC)

Medulloblastoma or Subependymoma it also has nothing to do with glioblastoma. Wname1 (talk) 08:10, 3 June 2024 (UTC)

https://repository.ubn.ru.nl/bitstream/handle/2066/74412/74412.pdf?sequence=1 Page 47 + https://flexikon.doccheck.com/de/Oligodendrogliom?utm_source=www.doccheck.com&utm_medium=DC%2520Search&utm_campaign=DC%2520Search%2520content_type%253Aall&utm_content=DC%2520Search%2520anaplastisch%2520oligodia .German text. Wname1 (talk) 11:53, 3 June 2024 (UTC)

As per the current 2021 WHO classification, there's no grade 4 oligodendroglioma. There's also no anaplastic oligodendroglioma anymore, as stated in the template I placed at the top of the article. The sources you've linked are outdated and not MEDRS-compliant.

This has been previously explained to at the articles talk page [2] and over at deWP [8]. MaligneRange (talk) 08:31, 4 June 2024 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Ketone bodies#Requested move 25 May 2024

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Ketone bodies#Requested move 25 May 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Safari Scribe^{Edits! Talk!} 00:15, 2 June 2024 (UTC)

commented--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 11:55, 4 June 2024 (UTC)

Prurigo simplex

The page Prurigo simplex currently is a stub and there was an interesting conversation regarding the classification of it here. I'm not quite sure what to do with the page. The 2020 guidlines for Prurigo made no mention of Prurigo simplex. This article does a pretty good job of summerizing the controversy surrounding the term but I'll mention some of the highlights here:

"Subacute prurigo, characterized by small papulovesicles, is the most controversial category of prurigo (1, 4). Besides many eponyms, it is also known as prurigo simplex, prurigo simplex subacuta or urticaria papulosa chronica perstans (1, 2). Lately, the classification of prurigo into acute, subacute and chronic forms has been questioned (5). It is discussed whether subacute prurigo (prurigo simplex) belongs to the prurigo group of diseases, or if it is just one of many papular eruptions. In American literature, it is better known as “itchy red bump” disease. The term was coined by Ackerman (6), who described it as a “maddeningly pruritic, persistent condition that clinically resembles dermatitis herpetiformis with histologic features similar to papular urticaria”."

"Another controversial issue is whether prurigo simplex or “itchy red bump” disease is a clearly defined entity or a variant of chronic prurigo. It has been suggested that it is a transitional stage of prurigo that transforms from an acute to a chronic form"

It seems to me that Prurigo simplex should be a redirect to Prurigo, however the page Prurigo needs to be expanded as well (which I am happy to do).

I'm interesting in others thoughts on this topic. If anyone has anything to add or any opinions please let me know. For now I am going to focus on expanding Prurigo. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 20:17, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

• As the editor who had stubbed the simplex article, I concur with the suggestion of making Prurigo the main article on the subject and redirecting Prurigo simplex to it. The latter seems to be a minor and likely obsolete category with a PubMed search for prurigo simplex/prurigo simplex subacuta/urticaria papulosa chronica perstans/subacute prurigo finding only one review article: the 2021 Wallengren article mentioned above, which too calls the category and definition controversial. Cheers. Abecedare (talk) 22:00, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

For completeness sake, I'll note that I had checked the 12th (2016) edition of Andrews' Diseases of the Skin: Clinical Dermatology, which is cited in wikipedia's Prurigo simplex article, and that that reference work devotes less than half a page to prurigo simplex calling it the "preferred term for the chronic itchy idiopathic dermatosis" while noting that "the term prurigo continues to lack nosologic precision." I don't have instant access to the current (13th) edition of Andrew's to check if it says anything different. Abecedare (talk) 22:27, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

Rook's Dermatology says only that "There is continuing debate about conditions such as prurigo simplex acuta or prurigo simplex subacuta and their nature remains to be properly investigated."

Griffiths, Christopher E. M.; Barker, Jonathan; Bleiker, Tanya O.; Hussain, Walayat; Simpson, Rosalind C., eds. (2024-02-12). "Pruritus, Prurigo and Lichen Simplex: Psychological, Sensory and Neurological Disorders and the Skin". Rook's Textbook of Dermatology (10 ed.). Wiley. doi:10.1002/9781119709268.rook081. ISBN 978-1-119-70921-3.

This textbook is available to experienced editors at Wikipedia:The Wikipedia Library (under Wiley). WhatamIdoing (talk) 23:01, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

Looking through Rook's led me this EADV consensus statement on chronic prurigo from 2018, which could be useful in further developing the Prurigo article and which says, "There was a discussion among experts regarding the spectrum of the so-called prurigo simplex – acute and subacute. It was noted that there is no clear definition of these two terms." Consistent with other sources we have seen so far. Abecedare (talk) 01:04, 7 June 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for adding this. I'm going to wait till I expand the Prurigo article to include classifications before making the redirect. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 03:07, 7 June 2024 (UTC)

Dealing with Cochrane Review retractions

Hey all, seeking some knowledge from the experts here!

I've recently started RetractionBot back up, however there appears to be an edge-case I want to seek comment on in regards to Cochrane review papers.

Now, the Cochrane review appear to do odd stuff with replacing old papers and withdrawing the replacements, an example can be found here

In that example, doi:10.1002/14651858.CD003498.pub3 has been marked as retracted due to being replaced by a new paper (doi:10.1002/14651858.CD003498.pub4). That paper has then been withdrawn in favour of the older version. For this reason, the citation is flagged up as retracted/replaced in both CrossRef and RetractionWatch, and the bot normally would try and add a {{retracted}} template to it.

I have supressed this for now, so any article published by Cochrane Review will be ignored, however I wanted to check...

• Is tagging as {{retracted}} desirable in these instances or is ignoring it the best way to go?
• Does anyone know if this is a common thing to happen?
• Are there any views on how to handle these? Detecting this sort of thing is possible if I do a check on crossref for the newer paper, however these withdrawn papers are not reported as retracted as they are not reported on another DOI/PMID.

Thanks, Mdann52 (talk) 12:12, 30 May 2024 (UTC)

I think we used to have a Cochrane-specific bot; see User:JenOttawa#Cochrane Bot Updates. WhatamIdoing (talk) 17:03, 30 May 2024 (UTC)

Cochrane retraction notices are generally dumb in that database. However, a true retraction should be flagged, if possible.

I think the following conditions would work, for Cochrane Reviews: if v+1 is retracted (e.g. pub4), but v is not (e.g. pub3), then ignore matches to v (e.g. pub3).

Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 02:56, 31 May 2024 (UTC)

This Signpost story will be of interest to many here: RetractionBot is back alive. The userpage will have many relevant categories (all the unintentional citations categories especially need human review).

Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 00:24, 10 June 2024 (UTC)

Sorry, I missed this. The Cochrane update bot is working well. For retractions, I try to review on a case by case basis, aiming to replace with a more recent high quality source when possible. I am now using your list as well. It is amazing! JenOttawa (talk) 21:32, 23 October 2024 (UTC)

Pandemic's over! (2024 edition)

• COVID-19 pandemic (edit | visual edit | history) · Article talk (edit | history) · Watch

The annual push is on to have Wikipedia declare that the COVID-19 pandemic is over. One new argument this year is that the WHO is only saying there's a pandemic as they have a monetary interest in "dragging it out". More eyes could be useful. Bon courage (talk) 17:29, 5 June 2024 (UTC)

This is not a neutral notification, and you nutpicked the arguments presented. The main argument is that experts disagree as to whether or not it is ongoing, so maybe the article should follow WP:NPOV and not take a side but mention the expert disagreement. It's going to be over eventually so you shouldn't be surprised it comes up again and again. Crossroads ^-talk- 17:47, 5 June 2024 (UTC)

Perplexity's Take

Here is what Perplexity Pro (an LLM) has to say:

The question of whether the COVID-19 pandemic is over is complex and multifaceted, with varying perspectives from health experts, organizations, and the public.

1. 1. 1. Expert Opinions and Definitions

1. **World Health Organization (WHO)**:

   - The WHO declared an end to the COVID-19 public health emergency in May 2023 but continues to describe COVID-19 as a pandemic due to its ongoing global presence and impact[3][11].

2. **Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC)**:

   - The CDC has shifted its focus from tracking cases to monitoring hospitalizations and deaths. While acknowledging that COVID-19 remains a public health threat, the CDC emphasizes the importance of vaccination and other preventive measures[12].

3. **Boston University Researchers**:

   - Experts from Boston University highlight that COVID-19 still causes significant illness and death worldwide. They argue that the disease's widespread nature and the millions of cases reported weekly justify its classification as a pandemic[1].

4. **Scientific American**:

   - Maria Van Kerkhove from the WHO notes that while the emergency phase is over, the pandemic status remains due to the virus's continued global circulation and impact[3].

1. 1. 1. Public Perception

1. **Gallup Poll**:

   - A Gallup poll indicates that 59% of Americans believe the pandemic is over, although a similar proportion report that their lives have not returned to normal[4].

1. 1. 1. Current Data and Trends

1. **Global and National Data**:

   - COVID-19 continues to cause significant morbidity and mortality. For instance, the WHO reported over 774 million confirmed cases and more than seven million deaths globally as of March 2024[6].

   - In the U.S., COVID-19 hospitalizations and deaths have decreased significantly from their peaks, but the virus still poses a risk, especially to vulnerable populations[12].

2. **Variants and Transmission**:

   - New variants, such as JN.1 and its descendants, continue to emerge and spread, indicating that the virus is still evolving and circulating widely[15].

1. 1. 1. Conclusion

While the emergency phase of the COVID-19 pandemic has ended, the virus remains a significant global health threat. The WHO and other health experts continue to classify COVID-19 as a pandemic due to its widespread impact and ongoing transmission. Public perception varies, with many believing the pandemic is over, but data and expert opinions suggest that vigilance and preventive measures are still necessary to manage the disease's impact.

Citations:

[1] https://www.bu.edu/articles/2024/is-covid-19-still-a-pandemic/

[2] https://doh.wa.gov/data-and-statistical-reports/diseases-and-chronic-conditions/communicable-disease-surveillance-data/respiratory-illness-data-dashboard

[3] https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/rampant-covid-poses-new-challenges-in-the-fifth-year-of-the-pandemic/

[4] https://news.gallup.com/poll/612230/four-years-say-covid-pandemic.aspx

[5] https://data.who.int/dashboards/covid19/cases

[6] https://www.who.int/publications/m/item/covid-19-epidemiological-update-edition-166

[7] https://www.usnews.com/news/national-news/articles/2024-06-03/5-key-takeaways-from-faucis-covid-19-testimony

[8] https://www.verywellhealth.com/covid-by-the-numbers-5083007

[9] https://www.cdc.gov/forecast-outbreak-analytics/about/rt-estimates.html

[10] https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2024/06/03/opinion/covid-lab-leak.html

[11] https://time.com/6898943/is-covid-19-still-pandemic-2024/

[12] https://www.cdc.gov/ncird/whats-new/changing-threat-covid-19.html

[13] https://apnews.com/article/fauci-covid-pandemic-origin-congress-a66625482f25824476ee315484790230

[14] https://www.kff.org/coronavirus-covid-19/issue-brief/global-covid-19-tracker/

[15] https://www.idsociety.org/covid-19-real-time-learning-network/diagnostics/covid-19-variant-update/

[16] https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/republicans-poised-grill-anthony-fauci-covid-19-response/story?id=110677611

[17] https://covid.cdc.gov

[18] https://www.cnn.com/2024/06/03/politics/fauci-testimony-house-hearing-covid-19/index.html

[19] https://www.usnews.com/news/the-report/articles/2024-05-03/what-to-know-about-the-latest-covid-19-milestone

[20] https://www.politico.com/news/2024/06/02/fauci-covid-research-investigative-panel-00161109

Jaredroach (talk) 15:07, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

As much as I would love for AI to make our lives easier, I don't think LLMs are at the point yet where their "opinions" are of any weight or help. Digging up citations could theoretically be useful, but even here they don't always represent them accurately. For example, it cites this Boston University article as saying that experts there support classification as a pandemic; however, reading it makes clear that two out of the three lean towards or outright say it is not a pandemic, while the third (Murray) seems to lean that it is, but even she acknowledges that definitions of the term vary by saying e.g. this is where governments have flexibility in deciding whether we are in a pandemic. This Time article is cited to refer to what is on WHO's website, but what other experts in it say (including WHO's COVID lead Maria Van Kerkhove) is totally ignored. Crossroads ^-talk- 16:13, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

Still, it's interesting to see what the state of development is for LLMs. WhatamIdoing (talk) 18:05, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

Update: There is a proposal to re-write the first couple of sentences, so that we can avoid saying either "the pandemic is" or the pandemic was". Please take a look if you're interested. WhatamIdoing (talk) 07:13, 10 June 2024 (UTC)

AFIB Technology

Any thoughts on the AFIB Technology article? It looks distinctly promotional to me, though I have no subject-matter knowledge. AndyTheGrump (talk) 02:47, 10 June 2024 (UTC)

It looks a bit overly detailed to me. If you're interested, I suggest re-writing the "one study found" paragraphs to be more in line with WP:MEDSAY.

(My first thought was that it would be related to the Apple Watch health monitoring patent dispute, but it's not.) WhatamIdoing (talk) 06:39, 10 June 2024 (UTC)

Thanks Andy, I noticed that NICE have withdrawn their guidance originally cited in the article. CV9933 (talk) 10:09, 10 June 2024 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Idiopathic ulnar neuropathy at the elbow#Requested move 13 June 2024

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Idiopathic ulnar neuropathy at the elbow#Requested move 13 June 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. ASUKITE 13:50, 13 June 2024 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Mary Fletcher#Requested move 12 June 2024

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Mary Fletcher#Requested move 12 June 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Safari Scribe^{Edits! Talk!} 07:50, 12 June 2024 (UTC)

commented--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:12, 14 June 2024 (UTC)

Infoboxes changed?

Have the infoboxes for medical conditions been changed or is my computer just not working right? Is this a site wide thing or just that specefic template? CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 04:44, 14 June 2024 (UTC)

@CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath, please tell me more. {{infobox medical condition}} hasn't been edited directly for a few months. Did you change your font size or zoom level? WhatamIdoing (talk) 15:01, 14 June 2024 (UTC)

it seems to be a site wide issue but it has been fixed for me! CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 20:51, 15 June 2024 (UTC)

There are many reports of problems at VPT. Johnuniq (talk) 03:38, 15 June 2024 (UTC)

Lichen myxedematosus/Papular mucinosis

There seems to be an issue with the classification of Lichen myxedematosus/Papular mucinosis. The terms papular mucinosis, lichen myxedematosus, and scleromyxedema have all kind of been jumbled and I'm not sure how to classify them. Here's what I've found:

ICD-11 lumps the terms Lichen myxoedematosus, Papular mucinosis, and Scleromyxoedema all under the term Lichen myxoedematosus. [9]

MeshID lumps the terms Lichen myxoedematosus, Papular mucinosis, and Scleromyxoedema under the term Scleromyxedema.[10]

Orphanet lists Lichen myxedematosus as a group of disorders,[11] with the terms Atypical lichen myxedematosus,[12], Localized lichen myxedematosus (Orphanet uses Papular mucinosis as a synonym for Localized lichen myxedematosus),[13] and Scleromyxedema.[14]

Disease database lumps them all together as well.

However it seems that they are different disorders with different sources using different names. For example UpToDate uses Papular mucinosis for a synonym of Lichen myxedematosus.[15] This article[16] goes over the classifications and seems to imply that Papular mucinosis is a synonym fot Localized lichen myxedematosus, and that Scleromyxedema is a seperate disorder.

From what I understand it seems like generalized lichen myxedematosus is a synonym for scleromyxedema, Papular mucinosis is a synonym for Localized lichen myxedematosus and lichen myxedematosus is the the group of disorders.

Before I change any redirects I'd like to hear others input on the topic as it's quite confusing to me. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 03:27, 8 June 2024 (UTC)

[17]..I'd go with this(just my opinion)--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:11, 21 June 2024 (UTC)

The disease database just lumps all of the terms together which doesn't make sense since they seem to be different disorders. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 15:13, 21 June 2024 (UTC)

Merge proposal for Somatization disorder and Somatic symptom disorder.

I've started a discussion regarding the merging of Somatization disorder and Somatic symptom disorder here and I would really appreciate if others could give their input on the topic. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 05:52, 24 June 2024 (UTC)

Village Pump discussion

There's a village pump discussion at Wikipedia:Village pump (idea lab)#Resources on severe mental illness pages that may be of interest to this project. I've given my thoughts there, but the participants of this project probably have the best judgement on this topic. Thebiguglyalien (talk) 22:56, 24 June 2024 (UTC)

thanks for post--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:23, 27 June 2024 (UTC)

Expert attention needed

I've been working with Pete Nelson from UKY (and by "working with" I mean mostly doing some minor cleanup on his work) on User:WikiDan61/LATE which is intended to replace the current contents of Limbic-predominant age-related TDP-43 encephalopathy. As can be seen from the existing article, Nelson is clearly a recognized expert in the field for this condition. I got involved when he made a major wholesale edit to the article, basically blowing away the existing citations. Once I was able to mentor him through some Wikipedia basics, and help him with some article organization ideas, he has cleaned up the article (now living in my user space as a drafting location). I'd like to have someone from this project assess the present state of the draft and see if it is ready to be copied into place of the existing article. I might also need some Wikipedia expertise on how to do the merge to preserve the proper authorship attributions (his and my edits in my userspace). Thanks!! WikiDan61^ChatMe!_ReadMe!! 21:44, 27 June 2024 (UTC)

Thanks Dan61. Just to clarify, I wrote the prior version as well, this is just an update to flesh it out a little bit and conform more closely to (what I understood to be) Wikipedia formating.

Best regards,

Pete Nelson Pete Nelson from UKY (talk) 21:53, 27 June 2024 (UTC)

Here's a cross-page diff of the sandbox vs current article, if anyone wants to take a look at the changes. It quadruples the amount of readable prose and doubles the number of sources cited. I haven't looked at the quality of the sources, but everything else looks good to me. WhatamIdoing (talk) 22:32, 27 June 2024 (UTC)

How to deal with the overwhelming amount of pages with unsourced statements.

I think the majority of the active editors here know that WikiProject Medicine has an issue with unsourced statements in articles. I'm not blaming anyone; a lot of the citation issues come from editors not familiar with Wikipedia. Regardless of how this issue started, I think we need to have a conversation about how to fix it.

I've noticed that there are typically two different types of pages that have unspurced statements: pages that are almost completely unsourced (for example, 1q21.1 duplication syndrome), and pages that have one or two unsourced statements but are otherwise well cited (for example, 3-M syndrome).

For the first type of page, I believe it's best to do a quick literary search to see if you can find where the information came from; however, I've found that this is usually quite low-yeild, especially when the whole page is unsourced. I believe most of these pages need to be rewritten. Obviously, this is a time-consuming task, but something needs to be done about the issue.

For the second type of page, usually I can find where they got the statment by searching keywords from the unsourced statement in Google. When I can't find the original source, I think it's fair to delete the unsourced passage, assuming it is not somehow vital information (however, if it were vital information, there should be a source somewhere with that information).

I'm looking for other ideas, suggestions, advice, and knowledge on this topic. I'm still a fairly new editor, and I haven't worked much on correcting this problem, so if anyone with more knowledge could share their opinions, that would be great. I just want to emphasize that this is not me trying to bash any editors; I just think it's time we have a conversation about this very prevelant issue. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 15:42, 16 June 2024 (UTC)

Are you thinking about the articles tagged as having no refs, such as these?

• COVID-19 pandemic in the British Overseas Territories
• Dipsogen
• Health forecasting
• List of strains of Escherichia coli
• Medical practice consultants
• Pulmonary pathology
• Stabilization (medicine)
• Therapeutic support staff
• Videoscope
• Walking-stalk skin flap

WhatamIdoing (talk) 19:49, 17 June 2024 (UTC)

I'm refering to any page with the citation needed template. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 20:03, 17 June 2024 (UTC)

There are over 12,000 WPMED-tagged articles with a {{fact}} tag somewhere in it. (There are more than half a million tagged articles overall.) That's a bit much to handle all at once.

This link to Citation Hunt will give you just the ones that are in Category:Top-importance medicine articles. If you try that out and like it, we can set up another for Category:High-importance medicine articles, or perhaps using the Wikipedia:WikiProject Medicine/Popular pages list. WhatamIdoing (talk) 02:44, 28 June 2024 (UTC)

That's a great idea thank you! So far I've just been going through the list alphabetically. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 04:27, 29 June 2024 (UTC)

New form of B12 deficiency discovered

A new form of B12 deficiency affects the nervous system only, with B12 levels remaining normal in the blood: Transcobalamin receptor antibodies in autoimmune vitamin B12 central deficiency - Pluvinage et al., 26 Jun 2024. I wonder if it merits a mention in B12 deficiency or even a standalone article. The condition reminds me of cerebral folate deficiency. --CopperKettle (talk) 05:43, 28 June 2024 (UTC)

Perhaps "mooted" rather than "discovered". Any WP:MEDRS ? Bon courage (talk) 05:58, 28 June 2024 (UTC)

So we have one confirmed case in humans reported by a primary source? Seems interesting and something to take note of, but all the same too soon for the encyclopedia to be rewritten. Draken Bowser (talk) 10:40, 28 June 2024 (UTC)

Maybe we could justify a single sentence in Vitamin B12 deficiency#History ("A single case study claimed..."). I do not think that a standalone article is warranted. WhatamIdoing (talk) 18:57, 28 June 2024 (UTC)

I find this very interesting, but am inclined to agree with WhatamIdoing, but I don't think we need to point out it was a "single" study, rather it makes sense to mention "A case study describes ...". Anyone able to understand what a case study is, should also inherently understand its limitations. CFCF (talk) 10:26, 29 June 2024 (UTC)

Covid-Organics; contextualizing trial in predatory journal

Presently, Covid-Organics mentions a Phase III trial, published in a journal from Fortune Journals (who's apparently predatory per Beall's List), as if it was in a typical, credible journal, without further comment/context. I'm hoping someone with more experience and energy than me could e.g. add a sentence or two properly contextualizing the quality of the journal/trial. Cybercobra (talk) 22:31, 28 June 2024 (UTC)

I think you ought to feel free to just remove it. CFCF (talk) 10:27, 29 June 2024 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Three-dimensional electrical capacitance tomography#Requested move 14 May 2024

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Three-dimensional electrical capacitance tomography#Requested move 14 May 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Polyamorph (talk) 15:38, 28 June 2024 (UTC)

thank you for post--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 11:58, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

Corinne Peek-Asa draft at Articles for Creation

On behalf of the University of California, San Diego, I have submitted a draft article about American epidemiologist Corinne Peek-Asa (red-linked in this list and at WikiProject Women in Red/Fellowships) as part of my work at Beutler Ink. Sharing a notice here in case any WikiProject Medicine participants are interested in taking a look. Thanks! Inkian Jason (talk) 17:33, 1 July 2024 (UTC)

AFC[18] are the ones that take a look at this, thanks--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:29, 13 July 2024 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Ober's test#Requested move 6 July 2024

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Ober's test#Requested move 6 July 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Safari Scribe^{Edits! Talk!} 16:58, 13 July 2024 (UTC)

This appears to be another round of "we must/mustn't use apostrophes in eponymously titled subjects". Nobody has replied. I'm sure it would be appreciated if anyone with an opinion – any opinion – posted a comment. WhatamIdoing (talk) 06:42, 16 July 2024 (UTC)

RetractionBot

I posted this story from the Signpost last month. Things have evolved a bit and now Retraction bot handles {{Erratum}}, {{Expression of concern}}, and {{Retracted}}. These populate the following categories:

• Category:Articles citing retracted publications (129)

• Category:Articles citing publications with expressions of concern (76)

• Category:Articles citing publications with errata (65)

If the citation is no longer reliable, then the article needs to be updated, which could be as minor as the removal/replacement of the citation with a reliable one, to rewriting an entire section that was based on flawed premises. If the citation to a retracted paper was intentional, like in the context of a controversy noting that a paper was later retracted, you can replace {{retraction|...}} with {{retraction|...|intentional=yes}}/{{expression of concern|...}} with {{expression of concern|...|intentional=yes}}/{{Erratum|...}} with {{Erratum|...|checked=yes}}.

I put the list of articles within the scope of WP:MED in collapsed sections. Any help you can give with those are greatly appreciated. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 20:06, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

Feel free to remove/strike through those you've dealt with. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 20:17, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

441 problems is a pretty big project. If we fix 10 a day, that will take more than a month. WhatamIdoing (talk) 18:04, 17 July 2024 (UTC)

It's definitely a large effort, but for WP:MED, it's about 120 articles. Luckily, there's some overlap with a list I've made at WT:MCB and the notices are rather prominent in the articles, so the count goes down overall. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 18:23, 17 July 2024 (UTC)

missing info on Sarco Pod

the australian euthanasia activist Philip Nitschke announced earlier this month that the sarco pod, a device used to help carry out assisted suicides, would be used for the first time. i found headlines saying switzerland was gonna ban the device, but its only been sort of banned in 2 swiss cantons.

problem is, most news outlets reporting on this are listed in wikipedias section on reliable sources as untrustworthy and only swiss news outlets have reported reliably about it. I dont think i have the full picture tho. this is a sensitive subject and i need help finding sources.

i need a bit of help on adding the info mentioned above to the page on the sarco pod. i need help finding out whats going on exactly. i cant find any announcements on these developments on Exit Internationals website or on swiss agencies regulating medicine.

Bird244 (talk) 20:08, 17 July 2024 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Transgender hormone therapy#Requested move 15 July 2024

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Transgender hormone therapy#Requested move 15 July 2024 that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject.

This also affects Hormone replacement therapy Void if removed (talk) 09:09, 18 July 2024 (UTC)

• give opinion(gave mine)--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:20, 19 July 2024 (UTC)

Requested input at Talk:List of common misconceptions over lede

Looking for uninvolved editors opinions on the discussion at List of common misconceptions on whether the lede meets sourcing requirements. Conversation seems to have stalled. Rollinginhisgrave (talk) 23:25, 7 July 2024 (UTC)

thank you for post(seems to be a wide topic)--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:21, 19 July 2024 (UTC)

Spondyloarthritis (SpA)

Would someone from this WikiProject mind taking a look at Spondyloarthritis (SpA) and assessing it? It was created yesterday directly in the mainspace and never received any type of assessment. Given WP:MEDRS and all of the other things involved with creating/editing content about this type of subject, it would probably be a good idea for others more experienced with such articles to look it over. -- Marchjuly (talk) 22:12, 18 July 2024 (UTC)

@Marchjuly, it's a C-class page, but the important question is whether it's the same subject as Spondyloarthropathy. Damjana12, what's the relationship between spondyloarthrITIS and spondyloarthrOPATHY? WhatamIdoing (talk) 22:24, 18 July 2024 (UTC)

@Marchjuly It seems to me that spondyloarthritis and spondyloarthropathy are synonyms. However the icd seems to use the term spondyloarthritis[19]. This article seems to go over the terminology quite well. I'll give you kinda the highlights:

"Spondyloarthritis and spondyloarthropathy are often used interchangeably. Some experts prefer the term spondyloarthritis rather than spondyloarthropathy because the ending “arthritis” indicates inflammation of the joint, whereas the ending “arthropathy” can refer to any type of joint disease."

I personally don't see the need for a seprate page for spondyloarthritis. In addition the page itself doesn't follow the formatting for diseases and the sources aren't great. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 00:18, 19 July 2024 (UTC)

Thank you both for taking a look at this. Perhaps one of you could try explaining this to the article's creator? -- Marchjuly (talk) 03:02, 19 July 2024 (UTC)

I left a merge proposal template on both the pages however I think I'll reach out directly to the user on their talk page since they seem to be a new editor and I'll see if they are interested in helping me fix up the page Spondyloarthropathy as I personally feel it needs some work. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 20:13, 19 July 2024 (UTC)

That sounds great. Thanks for doing that. WhatamIdoing (talk) 20:43, 21 July 2024 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Wiki Ed/UCSF/Foundations II (Summer 2024)

Some members of this WikiProject might want to take a look at Wikipedia:Wiki Ed/UCSF/Foundations II (Summer 2024) because it appears all the participants in that course have chosen articles about medical topics to try and improve. Given the added difficulty associated with editing such articles, it might be a good idea for someone to check their work to see whether it's OK, and perhaps also offer suggestions on how such articles should be edited. I've already asked the course's Wikipedia Expert about this at User talk:Ian (Wiki Ed)#Wikipedia:Wiki Ed/UCSF/Foundations II (Summer 2024) because of some edits I saw made to Overmedication, but other articles might need to be checked as well. In addition, given the apparent interest of these students and their course instructor in this genre of article, they might be good candidates to join this WikiProject. -- Marchjuly (talk) 05:16, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

These are all grad students. They've been doing this for years. It's the best group of newbies we see all year. WhatamIdoing (talk) 17:53, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

Link on Category: Orphan Drugs is dead

The FDA link on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Orphan_drugs is broken. I have marked it with a dead link template, but haven't been able to find a like for like replacement. The nearest I have been able to find is this - https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/opdlisting/oopd/index.cfm Would that be suitable? Does anyone have any other suggestions? Red Fiona (talk) 18:45, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

We could alternatively just add the archived version from the wayback machine. Here's a working link I found. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 21:33, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

Wouldn't that go out of date as more drugs are added (unless they've stopped the programme and I've not noticed). Red Fiona (talk) 23:37, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Spondyloarthropathy#Requested_move_21_July_2024

I made a request to move Spondyloarthropathy to Spondyloarthritis at Talk:Spondyloarthropathy#Requested_move_21_July_2024. I would really appreciate others input on the subject! CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 22:29, 21 July 2024 (UTC)

commented--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 00:47, 25 July 2024 (UTC)

Li-Fraumeni syndrome / Additional Resources

Assistance is requested: With the wonderful help of the Wiki educators and LFS specialists at the National Cancer Institute's Division of Cancer Epidemiology and Genetics, I have been able to update this page with clarifications to most all of the headings during my "Wiki science" course. However, due to potential conflicts of interest, I need to request assistance from another editor to add the "Li-Fraumeni Syndrome Association" (aka LFS Association / LFSA) as a reputable source that promotes LFS research and supports LFS families, as well as connecting families with the best providers known, world-wide. The LFSA is comprised of an all-volunteer board, with medical and scientific boards comprised of the top international LFS researchers, along with a genetic counseling group of very active LFS/cancer genetic providers who contribute greatly. The LFSA holds the top international scientific symposiums on LFS wherein families are also involved every two years and we offer an international Youth Program with fun and educational workshops every other year. I volunteer for the LFSA, so if someone else could add our website to this page, it could help many cancer-prone families connect with each other and the best resources for care. Thank you. Li-Fraumeni Syndrome Association website: www.LFSAssociation.org Germlinep53 (talk) 20:21, 19 July 2024 (UTC)

thank you for your request...however before doing so per MEDMOS you may want to add reference/NIH(etiology section) as all conditions acquired/genetic have a 'cause' section,(and the article is missing one) thank you--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:31, 27 July 2024 (UTC)

Intensive Interaction

Hi, i wonder if I could have some extra eyes on the article for Intensive interaction?

The article was raised at WP:COIN earlier this year after it was edited by an account called user:Intensive Interaction Leeds and some form of COI was suspected. The user turned out to be an ex practitioner who wanted to improve the article. As the article had previously apparently been curated by non independent users from the Intensive Interaction Institute I gave this user some advice on the article talk page re: how the article might be improved.

The article is now, I think, somewhat improved - especially re: the removal of PROMO text. The user has now asked me if the 2017 flags for addl citations, promo and original research can be removed. I am unsure if this would be appropriate and thought it best to ask here. Any assistance gratefully received. Axad12 (talk) 00:29, 25 July 2024 (UTC)

@Axad12, the maintenance templates are not meant to be a badge of shame. As soon as the problems are solved, they should be removed. In this case:

• If you think the article has approximately enough citations, then you should remove the "needs additional citations" tag. For comparison, I've heard that the median Wikipedia article has about four inline citations. In borderline cases (which this probably isn't), sometimes the best thing to do is to remove the generic whole-article tag and replace it either with a couple of specific {{citation needed}} tags or to change to a {{more citations needed section}}.
• If it no longer appears to be written like an advertisement, then you should remove the "written like an advertisement" tag. Sometimes looking at Wikipedia:Identifying blatant advertising can help. Or just looking at the ordinary advertisements you see each day, because this isn't supposed to be used as a sort of code word for 'not an ideal encyclopedia article' or 'happens to say something true but positive about the company'.
• The original research tag was probably never correct. Original research means something that has never been published elsewhere. Think things made up by you and your friends one day, The Truth™ about how Einstein was wrong (a Usenet personality who thought he'd disproved the theory of relativity is why WP:OR was created back in the day), and ordinary instances of claims that "everybody knows", except it's not actually true, or not everybody knows it.

MO iIt would be reasonable for any editor to remove any or all of these. WhatamIdoing (talk) 17:08, 27 July 2024 (UTC)

Many thanks for your help here. I will remove the tags shortly. Axad12 (talk) 17:42, 27 July 2024 (UTC)

LATE (Limbic-predominant age-related TDP-43 encephalopathy) web page

Hi, my name is Pete Nelson (wiki username is Pete Nelson from UKY),

I wrote a web page about LATE: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limbic-predominant_age-related_TDP-43_encephalopathy It generally gets around 300 hits per month; not a ton but it's a disease with high public health impact.

I had written the web page in a somewhat essay-like format and I noted that it had a poor formatting score according to Wikipedia editors. Thus, I rewrote the web page and, under the advice and help by WikiDan61, we produced a Wikipedia page (in his sandbox) that conforms better the format and has a bit more info. Apparently this replacement (of my web page, by my web page) has struck the senior medical editors as problematic, and therefore WikiDan61 suggested I contact you on this page.

Can you help please?

Thanks, Pete aka Pete Nelson from UKY Pete Nelson from UKY (talk) 00:03, 9 July 2024 (UTC)

Hello, @Pete Nelson from UKY. It looks like @WikiDan61 removed it. This is not necessarily a permanent thing, and it's reversible. He summarized his objection as "That comprehensive rewrite discarded 36 sources, and retained only one. See WP:NOR."

As a general rule, Wikipedia articles should be written in ordinary paragraphs rather than bullet points, and in an ideal world, there would be more inline citations (which I know you were working on). May I suggest that you look at User:WikiDan61/LATE again, pick just one little section (maybe User:WikiDan61/LATE#Society and culture?) and move just that one section over to Limbic-predominant age-related TDP-43 encephalopathy? (It doesn't have any normal sections at the moment, so just edit the page and paste the new section above the ==References== section.) Then see if there are objections to that specific edit. It's more challenging to discuss whole-page changes, so I think that focusing on a single section would be more practical. WhatamIdoing (talk) 01:46, 9 July 2024 (UTC)

Thanks WhatamIdoing!

I guess there was a miscommunication since the number of references went from 36 to 65 or so? I don't think I discarded any, or only a few to lessen the number of references I was an author of because the Editors were focused on this problem.

Is WikiDan61 reading this? I hope he can, so he could perhaps redo that summary that was quite inaccurate. (WikiDan61 was very helpful in the rewrite and I am grateful for that.)

Thanks again,

Pete Nelson from UKY Pete Nelson from UKY (talk) 01:53, 9 July 2024 (UTC)

(Looking at the link you sent from WikiDan61, it confirms that there were 68 references cited and bibliographied) User:WikiDan61/LATE

I'm a bit confused because there seemingly is a Wikipedia-wished-for headings and organization format, and the updated wiki page now conforms to it? Pete Nelson from UKY (talk) 02:10, 9 July 2024 (UTC)

So just to be clear, I've done all that work to make the Wikipedia post for LATE better, and it's all for nought? Bummer. Lesson learned I guess. Pete Nelson from UKY (talk) 17:46, 12 July 2024 (UTC)

@Pete Nelson from UKY, your work is not lost. But, please, take it stepwise. Move just one of the new ==Sections== into the existing article, instead of replacing the entire page all at once. Then post back here, and I'll take a look at it. WhatamIdoing (talk) 06:40, 16 July 2024 (UTC)

Will do! Thanks! Pete Nelson from UKY (talk) 19:32, 16 July 2024 (UTC)

alright, I added a section but it wouldn't let me add a figure which is pretty important (depicting cognitive trajectories). Pete Nelson from UKY (talk) 19:41, 16 July 2024 (UTC)

I collected the refs for you from User:WikiDan61/LATE#Cognitive symptoms. When you're copying between pages, you need to open the 'source' page in the editor, and copy from that. Otherwise it loses all the formatting, links, refs, images, etc.

Where's the figure that you couldn't add? Is it already in the article? WhatamIdoing (talk) 18:01, 17 July 2024 (UTC)

Ack I didn't see this note yet, sorry. I would like to add another figure if possible Pete Nelson from UKY (talk) 20:16, 25 July 2024 (UTC)

I have made some more suggested edits, mainly adding citations and whatnot. When possible, I'd like to add another figure?

Thanks so much! Pete Nelson from UKY (talk) 15:04, 27 July 2024 (UTC)

@Pete Nelson from UKY, what is the other figure that you would like to add? WhatamIdoing (talk) 16:20, 27 July 2024 (UTC)

I think that I figured it out? (I did add the figure using the insert method).

Thanks so much for your help, WhatamIdoing, I think it's gotten a lot better! Pete Nelson from UKY (talk) 16:27, 27 July 2024 (UTC)

Congratulations. WhatamIdoing (talk) 17:56, 27 July 2024 (UTC)

Request to merge Frisson into Goose bumps

I have noticed that these two articles talk about the same thing. I have created a proposal on Goose bumps's talk page to discuss a merger. 80.0.166.171 (talk) 01:05, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

IMO not the same...frisson is an emotional experience, goosebumps are the physical reaction that may come after--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:48, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

References

Hello

Hello, I’m writing to introduce myself as a subject expert in medicine! I first joined Project Pharmacology and was referred to join WikiProject Medicine by WhatamIdoing. I’ve been in medicine for 15 years, spanning clinical and translational research at the bench and in the clinic. My current focus within clinical trials is administration and operations, along with regulatory work. I look forward to contributing and am always open to constructive feedback! Thanks!

Please note that I have access to hundreds of academic databases and journals, so I’m able to cite work, including works that may be behind a paywall. On that note, if you need access, contact me, and I’ll see what I can do to help! Gobucks821 (talk) 14:57, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

Merge proposal

Please see Talk:Human epigenome#This article should be merged into epigenome. At this point, I think they would love to hear from anyone who has glanced over the two articles, even if you don't really know much about the subject area. WhatamIdoing (talk) 20:44, 21 July 2024 (UTC)

FYI: This has been merged. Thnx! Gobucks821 (talk) 15:16, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

Opinions needed on the topic of if the word rare is appropriate in the lead of Addison's disease

For some time not the first sentence in Addison's disease has been "Addison's disease, also known as primary adrenal insufficiency, is a rare long-term endocrine disorder characterized by inadequate production of the steroid hormones cortisol and aldosterone by the two outer layers of the cells of the adrenal glands (adrenal cortex), causing adrenal insufficiency." However there's a bit of a disagreement going on between me and another editor.

They removed the term rare stating "unquantified relative terms are meaningless". I reverted this edit with my reasoning being "taking out the fact that Addisons disease is rare doesn't make sense as it is well sourced and helpful to readers (eg. the average reader knows what rare is but may not understand that 1 in 10,000 is considered rare for a disorder" perhaps I didn't word this very well but i stand by this point. To which the other editor reverted my revert with the reaoning "an unquantified relative term does not provide the information that you seem to believe was taken out. the number you quote remains in the lead section" and started this conversation on the talk page.

I have weighed in on the talk page as to why i think rare should be kept in the lead but I'm not going to add it back as I want to prevent conflict and would appreciate some unbiased opinions on the topic. If anyone could weigh in on the talk page that would be greately appreciated. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 15:49, 17 July 2024 (UTC)

In some contexts, and countries, "rare disease" is a legally-defined term - see here for a starting point. Don't we have rare disease - yes, apparently we do. In most countries, Addison's disease would seem to meet the criterion. Johnbod (talk) 16:34, 17 July 2024 (UTC)

Interesting! In my comment on the talk page I did list the FDA definiton which is the same as the one you linked. I didn't feel like digging up an international source as I doubted that Addison's disease would fail to meet other criteria used. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 16:52, 17 July 2024 (UTC)

Yep, it’s 200,000 or fewer (in the US). I worked on a couple rare diseases in years past. Here’s the link to FDA, as mentioned.Gobucks821 (talk) 16:20, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

Low-dose naltrexone

Hi all, I'm not someone who usually edits medical topics but I have some concerns about the tone and content of Low-dose naltrexone and would appreciate having some more experienced editors look it over. I don't feel that I'm personally equipped to address this so I've gone ahead and tagged it for promotional content, but as this is a medical matter I wanted to raise it here to get some extra eyes on it. Cheers, Ethmostigmus 🌿 (talk | contribs) 05:33, 27 July 2024 (UTC)

@Ethmostigmus, after you posted this, the page was substantially changed because of WP:COPYVIO problems. Did that happen to resolve your concerns? WhatamIdoing (talk) 17:11, 27 July 2024 (UTC)

Yes, the tone is much better now thanks to the removal of the copyrighted text and CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath reworking the lead. It still has plenty of room for expansion, but I'm very relieved that there is no longer any problematic content to worry about :) Ethmostigmus 🌿 (talk | contribs) 09:16, 29 July 2024 (UTC)

@Ethmostigmus @WhatamIdoing @CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath I left some comments on the talk page. I understand that WP:MEDRS prefers secondary sources, so I'd appreciate your opinion on whether to incorporate newer RCTs that haven't yet been included in reviews. ScienceFlyer (talk) 21:56, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

Thanks very much, really appreciate your input :) Ethmostigmus 🌿 (talk | contribs) 02:43, 4 August 2024 (UTC)

Redirect for Discussion: Medical coding

Medicine adjacent topic: I've listed medical coding and clinical coding over at RfD to see if we can get them pointing at the same target. Never started an RfD before so opinions and suggestions appreciated. Little pob (talk) 22:09, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

I’d tend to agree. Just an FYI: We ought to keep in mind the differences between *billing* coding and “medical” or “clinical” coding. Some CPT codes are not acceptable for billing, just as some ICD codes are not acceptable for billing. Gobucks821 (talk) 13:22, 4 August 2024 (UTC)

Hierarchy of Evidence

I’ve recently been pointed to the WP guidelines advising against primary sources and privileging secondary sources for medical content. As a career clinical research I am surprised by the misinterpretation of the hierarchy of evidence. Many (most?) secondary sources are non-systematic and at least as prone to conflicts of interest as well-conducted large RCTs, and the source of the evidence is important, as large representative and new-agent phase 3 trials in high-impact journals may be more definitive than secondary sources in lower-impact journals or platforms. Not certain if this is the place to raise this broad issue but I’d be happy to work with the community to review and revise the guidelines, or join a community of experienced clinicians and researchers to improve the guidance. Best, EquityAce — Preceding unsigned comment added by EquityAce (talk • contribs) 13:47, 28 July 2024 (UTC)

Certainly don't want that much from 'lower-impact' journals, but in general the job of this encylopedia is to summarize "accepted knowledge" as has been published, which is subtly different from what editors adjudge high-quality evidence, particularly novel high-quality evidence. Are there any examples of where the current guidance has a detrimental effect on an Article, in your view? Bon courage (talk) 13:54, 28 July 2024 (UTC)

Thanks @Bon courage. For convenience I’ll use a single recent example, though I’ve come across questionable citations as I ramp up edits on clinical topics. I’d just added mention of a recent well-conducted clinical trial from a reputable research group showing slowing of progression of diabetic retinopathy with fenofibrate, without any recommendation to take the drug. The trial was a culmination of years of suggestions that the agent is effective from observational studies. The Wiki editor @MrOllie removed the addition because it came from a primary source. The data are more informative than a casual narrative review (a purpose the Wikipedia page itself serves), and it deprives the WP community of knowledge of a low-cost generally safe preventive intervention in favor of the module’s mention of higher-cost injection therapies. It seems a delayed or missed opportunity. I’d say there’s a role for a properly performed systematic or scoping review and/or meta-analysis in fairly summarizing evidence, but that’s not the standard the current guidance encourages (ie any review is sufficient). @EquityAce EquityAce (talk) 19:28, 28 July 2024 (UTC)

There are reviews and reviews, and certainly some systematic reviews have been rejected too because WP:ECREE. I'd resist an overly-lawyerly reading of the guidance, and in a vibrant area like Diabetic retinopathy it's reasonable to wait for the WP:BESTSOURCES. We certainly shouldn't be trying to affect 'real world' decision making in any way. Bon courage (talk) 19:42, 28 July 2024 (UTC)

EquityAce - I think the specific guideline you are referring to is WP:MEDRS, and there is even as we speak a current discussion about this at WT:MEDRS#Reconsidering_a_blanket-ban_of_primary_sources that you are more than welcome to take part in. The guidelines have been shaped by a range of knowledgeable encyclopedians, clinicians, and researchers, of which you could join at meta:Wiki Project Med or here, as are you of course welcome of invite any of your contacts to join or take part of discussions.

What you may note, and bring to your discussion with MrOllie is that there is no blanket ban on primary sources, only a recommendation to give due weight. If there is a high quality clinical trial, that you report correctly (i.e. no recommendation), it may very well be apt to cite it. I would suggest looking at WP:MEDREV (subsection of MEDRS) that discusses how, and when to cite single large studies appropriately. I do not have the time to consider this particular case, but those pages do show where you could find appropriate arguments for including that material (or not). One of the primary arguments against including this specific trial may be WP:CRYSTALBALL or WP:NOTDIRECTORY (i.e. not a page for listing potential treatments/drug candidates). Simply stating that it is from a primary source is not enough if you have strong enough arguments for it that are in line with those guidelines.

(P.S. Additional essay-pages [not guidelines or policies are those linked above] that may be of relevance: WP:Why_MEDRS, Help:Wikipedia editing for medical experts, and one more that I forgot what it was called that covers why Wikipedia isn't cutting-edge [in part because this tends to lead to bloat, as it is easier to add new details than to go back removing old debunked things that were once thought to be novel and cutting-edge, the latter requiring more subject-matter expertise]). CFCF (talk) 13:03, 29 July 2024 (UTC)

Excellent response. Provides much more context. Thank you. EquityAce (talk) 14:21, 29 July 2024 (UTC)

I wholeheartedly and absolutely agree with each and every sentiment expressed by EquityAce, and I too am a seasoned researcher. In many cases, such articles may be the ONLY source of critically needed data, making these so-called primary sources necessary. It would be prudent to cite well-referred articles from reputable journals for such topics—think of rare diseases, in particular. In a sense, due to the editorial process, these have a (slight) degree of secondary source because nonsense would be rejected and go unpublished. This said, it would be absolutely key, as time goes by, to revisit these citations and augment or amend them as science evolves. Gobucks821 (talk) 15:49, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

There was an attempt to list the rare cases where primary sources might be used at WP:MEDFAQ#WHENMEDPRIMARY. Rare diseases are mentioned, Bon courage (talk) 06:58, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

Stachybotrys chartarum

There seems to be some controversy going on over at Talk:Stachybotrys chartarum. I'm really not familiar with this topic; however, the article is quite popular and seems to need some work. It seems like this page may be particularly valuable to WP:FRINGE. I just wanted to put this on people's radar, as I know these controversial topics can cause some issues with Wikipedia pages. (Also commented on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Fungi and Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Plants) CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 06:07, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

thank you for post--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:17, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

How to write pages for categories of medical conditions.

I'm attempting to rewrite the page Connective tissue disease and I've kind of ran into an issue. When it comes to writting about catagories of diseases or more broad terms should we follow the classic format of signs symptoms, causes, diagnosis, treatment etc. or should this be modified a bit? The issue I've come across is that there usually isn't much information on the group of disorders itself as most research is directed on individual diseases. Meaning if i wanted to make a section for symptoms of Connective tissue disease the only resource i could find summerizing the general symptoms is the cleveland clinic page[20] and Cedars-Sinai page[21]. Currently a lot of the disease catgory pages just have the classifications for the disorders. Would it be appropriate to make the classification section its own section (instead of having it as a subsection of diagnosis) and moving it farther up due to it being relevant (like I've done in my draft for connective tissue disease). Sorry if this came off as a bit of a ramble but I've been meaning to ask this question for awhile. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 23:49, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

I think you need much better sources! Pubmed stuff does tend to be on extremely specific topics - you may want to be looking at recent medical textbooks, which you won't find free online. Johnbod (talk) 01:01, 16 July 2024 (UTC)

Any recomendations for how I can find this kind of content? I find that Science Direct can be hit or miss for this kind of thing (example). CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 02:17, 16 July 2024 (UTC)

Yes, that's the sort of thing I mean (about Pubmed stuff does tend to be on extremely specific topics). Medical textbooks are hard to find online, as they want to get the students/doctors to pay their often very high prices. Can you get to a good college or medical school library. These days it is often paywalled online subs. Perhaps other medical editors can advise? Good luck. Johnbod (talk) 03:28, 16 July 2024 (UTC)

I'll start blindly looking in some rheumatology textbooks for now. Thanks for the help! CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 04:49, 16 July 2024 (UTC)

Perlego at Wikipedia:The Wikipedia Library has two potentially useful textbooks:

• The Rheumatology Handbook for Clinicians (ISBN 9781550599053), especially the chapter "The Patient Who Is Systemically Unwell: Is It a Connective Tissue Disease?"
• ABC of Rheumatology (ISBN 9781118793206), which has a bit on pediatric connective tissue disorders and a chapter at the end on epidemiology that includes a section on connective tissue disorders.

There are probably other sources available in TWL. WhatamIdoing (talk) 07:08, 16 July 2024 (UTC)

In the U.S., you can usually get just about any book you could imagine via a process called interlinbrary loan (known to librarians as “ILL”). Just about any municipal library could do it, otherwise find a county level or state library. Many states have state libraries for which some residents qualify.

For these kinds of works, you’ll likely get your ILL fulfilled by an academic medical center’s library in your state or from another state (if your state doesn’t have it).

Larger libraries let you make the request online. Others use paper forms. Be prepared to provide a LOT OF SPECIFICS of your desired textbook.

Gather key info like publisher, edition, and the likes.ALWAYS provide an ISBN. Be careful to NOT provide the e-book ISBN, as these are unique. If there are multiple formats or reprints, just provide as many ISBN options as you can so the librarians can try.

Amazon is an easy place to start your search for those identifiers. WorldCat is the authoritative source for this.

good luck!! Gobucks821 (talk) 18:42, 6 August 2024 (UTC)

Oh by the way: typical loan period is 3 weeks, minimum. You’re allowed to renew as many times as the lending library allows. Often this is 3 renewals. Cheers!! Gobucks821 (talk) 18:44, 6 August 2024 (UTC)

PubMed is useful, and recall there are hundreds upon hundreds of academic journals spanning so many topics beyond medicine. Another free source would be Google journals.

If you find a great journal article via PubMed etc., but it’s behind a paywall, I propose commenting on the article’s talk page to ask for somebody with access to check that journal.

For example, I have access to plethora journals, and I’d be happy to find the requisite data/citations that are behind the paywall.

However, I of course cannot respond to every single post by myself. We’d need folks to volunteer their access. Gobucks821 (talk) 15:14, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

A quick-test regarding rabies

Another English-language wikipedia has an "article" about [simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabies_antigen a quick-test regarding rabies].--Does English-wiki need (or want) the linked title? 2001:2020:30B:E14C:19ED:F846:28E5:B3AB (talk) 10:22, 7 August 2024 (UTC)

Looks like an advert, and is up for deletion over there. Bon courage (talk) 12:42, 7 August 2024 (UTC)

•  Done - that article has been deleted (so there is nothing to be gotten from the article, anymore). 2001:2020:30B:E528:DC4C:FF34:D4A4:DC9F (talk) 18:47, 7 August 2024 (UTC)

Anyone have an idea why Limonene is the most popular WikiProject Medicine Page?

It is currently dwarfing all other pages. I find this totally mystifying... Willmskinner (talk) 19:58, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

Pretty sure it gets mentioned a bit in O-Chem courses as an example students work on that may play a part, but Limonene#Uses may be better hint. When I see dietary supplement or cosmetics, that may mean some advertising on it is driving views to the page, but use as a cleaner/solvent may be doing it, especially if it's for "natural" cleaning ingredients posted on social media. That's at least my guess, but those seem like likely avenues. KoA (talk) 20:39, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

@Willmskinner: Do you have a link to a tool indicating the relative level of popularity here? We had discussion of a phenomenon earlier this year where the rather unremarkable article on "Neatsville, Kentucky" was dwarfing all other Kentucky topics, which was not resolved but led to speculation that some kind of external bot activity was involved. BD2412 T 20:44, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

From the list here... Wikipedia:WikiProject Medicine/Popular pages Willmskinner (talk) 00:39, 6 August 2024 (UTC)

Slightly relatedly, Lil Peep also shows up in the list of most popular WikiProject Medicine pages, clearly added to the WikiProject in error. I'm somewhat new here - can someone show me how to remove that page from being included in the WikiProject? Thanks! Willmskinner (talk) 00:52, 6 August 2024 (UTC)

I think you have to remove {{WikiProject Medicine|importance=Low|toxicology=yes|toxicology-imp=low}} from the its talk page. Bendegúz Ács (talk) 19:15, 7 August 2024 (UTC)

CT / MRI viewer

We at Wiki Med Foundation have been working to develop a CT / MRI scan viewer. Currently it is functionally on EN WP as a trial and works fairly well on mobile and desktop. Thoughts? Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 23:56, 30 June 2024 (UTC)

this is a very good idea, I believe this needs to be supported--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 14:37, 1 July 2024 (UTC)

That looks interesting. I think the UI needs a little more information. So first, for anyone who wants to take a look (do it!), just go to User:Doc James/CT scan viewer, and where it says "(requires turning on the gadget under preferences or this)" in the section heading, click on the word 'this'. (If you do that, you can test it without having to do anything to your prefs.) In the picture, a ► play button will appear. Click that.

Then wait several seconds for all the images to load. In this instance, there are 248 images. It'll give you a vertical bar with a slider dot at the bottom. After everything's loaded, you can slide that up and down to step through the images. If you want to view it image-by-image, then look at the text (sideways) that says "← (177/248) →" and click on the individual arrows.

I think this would be particularly interesting on CT scan, because it gives people an idea of what the results are. For that page in particular, I'd love to see a head-to-toe scan with a few labels (spine, lungs, liver?), so they can stay oriented.

Also, I wonder whether this could be integrated into MediaViewer. MarkTraceur, do you know a multi-part image has ever been considered there? WhatamIdoing (talk) 17:26, 1 July 2024 (UTC)

As a member of Wikipedia Radiology task force, I always wanted this kind of gadget in Radiology related articles. Thankyou @Doc James for fulfilling this wish. I see this as a good starting point to move forward to its implementation. I agree with WhatamIdoing's comment about UI, and would also request this support to be extended to MR Scans as well. Thankyou. _signed, 511KeV ^(talk) 03:53, 2 July 2024 (UTC)

Yup it works for MRI images aswell. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 04:04, 26 July 2024 (UTC)

Okay CT/MRI viewer is now fully live. You can see an example of it here Appendicitis#Diagnosis. We have collected about 5,000 CT/MRI sets that are public domain here on NC Commons. Basically these are image sets from Radiopaedia that have been uploaded by US authors. And per the US copyright office are thus in the public domain. We have built a tool NCC2Commons that make moving the sets to Commons much easier. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 05:56, 10 August 2024 (UTC)

For those, like me, who weren't aware of this "per the US copyright office are thus in the public domain" thing. It's explained briefly here. Thanks for the info DJ! Very helpful to know! Ajpolino (talk) 15:30, 10 August 2024 (UTC)

Input requested on Talk:Myalgic encephalomyelitis/chronic fatigue syndrome

Trying to reach consensus on best wording to convey status of genetic testing on illness in section Description genetics in lead Thank you. Ward20 (talk) 01:08, 10 August 2024 (UTC)

•  Done Ward20 (talk) 09:36, 11 August 2024 (UTC)

Not updated for years

How in the world has nobody actually noticed that the current page for Medical Collaboration of the Month hasn't been updated for 3 years now? Did nobody bother? Mox Eden (talk) 17:50, 12 August 2024 (UTC)

I think you will find it hasn't been properly maintained since 2009 when Jfdwolff stepped down from it. Perhaps the process was formalized too much that no one dared. Feel free to change it, I don't think the nomination page should be considered essential if it only means it isn't updated. CFCF (talk) 12:23, 14 August 2024 (UTC)

Lucy Letby has an RfC

Lucy Letby, which is within the scope of this WikiProject, has an RfC for possible consensus. A discussion is taking place. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments on the discussion page. Thank you. NebY (talk) 17:24, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

per [22] other relevant Wikiprojects that should be notified as well--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:31, 14 August 2024 (UTC)

Input needed on Vasculitis

I've started a discussion on Talk:Vasculitis#Signs_and_symptoms and I would appreciate input from this wikiproject!CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 16:17, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

thank you for post--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 12:32, 14 August 2024 (UTC)

Wikicommons picture on cover of CMAJ

As per the heading: the July/August 2024 Print Edition of the Canadian Medical Association Journal (CMAJ) used a WikiCommons picture of eosinophilic esophagitis.

Does any one happen to know User:CoRus13? (He doesn't seem to be around much. I wonder whether he knows the CMAJ liked his image enough to use it.)

Note: The article was published electronically in February.

Nephron  T|C 22:53, 21 July 2024 (UTC)

I will check out their website, but my very first guess is that this is a fake journal to churn papers. We see this all the time from companies that invite even the least experienced folks to publish. Hate to speculate, but this is in line with the practices of such pseudo journals. Gobucks821 (talk) 15:18, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

This journal is old enough that it's unlikely to be a fake journal. Regional journals aren't usually prestigious, but most countries have a medical association that publishes papers of interest to the practitioners in that country. The big journals may not want to run a "Prevalence of common cold in Ruritanian Kindergartens" article, but the Ruritanian Medical Association might think it an excellent piece for their little journal. WhatamIdoing (talk) 18:29, 16 August 2024 (UTC)

PS - CMAJ previously used one of my images of diffuse alveolar damage on the cover (for an article about ARDS in July 2021)... and violated the terms of use. (I saw the image when it was published. They ended-up publishing a correction.) Nephron  T|C 22:53, 21 July 2024 (UTC)

Special:EmailUser/CoRus13 might work. WhatamIdoing (talk) 00:23, 22 July 2024 (UTC)

Copyright issues with diagnostic criteria

I'm currently trying to improve the page Mixed connective tissue disease and I've ran into a bit of an issue. For context Mixed connective tissue disease (MCTD) has 4 different sets of diagnostic/classification criteria. Usually when I add in classification or diagnostic criteria for a disorder I'll just re word it a bit. The issue is that the diagnostic criteria for MCTD is so specefic that it's hard to reword it without losing meaning. I'm not super familiar with the details of copyright rules but I believe some of this falls under WP:LIMITED. If someone could check out the classification section of my draft for the artcle (User:CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath/sandbox3) and let me know if what I have is appropriate, that would be much appreciated. I also used an open access article for the diagnostic criteria (link) so I think it would also be okay to leave the text the same and put in an attribution template but I'm not fully sure if that's needed or what the logistics of that are. CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 22:23, 30 July 2024 (UTC)

Diagnostic criteria are not copyrightable. Only the expression of a work is protected, not the contents. It would be perfectly acceptable to publish the criteria exactly as worded. In fact, re-wording the criteria could be injurious to the article and its readers.

I haven’t reviewed your article, but in many cases, such criteria are presented in table format—or it’s much more convenient to do so. Thus, if you haven’t already, I suggest word-for-word content in a table. Hope this helps!

Of course, I welcome input from senior/other editors. Gobucks821 (talk) 15:53, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for the clarification! I decided not to go with a table as I couldn't find a way to format it in a way I liked however the information is presented in a way that could be easily put into a table if anyone chooses to do so!CursedWithTheAbilityToDoTheMath (talk) 11:59, 6 August 2024 (UTC)

The copyright question is very much "it depends". Copyright applies to expressions but not to facts. If there's only one way to express a given fact (e.g., "≥40 mcg/dL" or "has low back pain"), then it's not copyrightable.

When the diagnostic criterion is just a number or other simple fact, then copyright is not a significant concern. When the criteria are expressed as complex sentences/paragraphs (e.g., anything in the DSM), then we always need to re-write them in our own words. The complicated moment is when it's somewhere in between the two extremes. The dividing line between "just simple enough to not be copyrightable" and "just complex enough to require re-writing" is not always clear. WhatamIdoing (talk) 18:42, 16 August 2024 (UTC)

Intersex healthcare draft feedback

EDIT: Nevermind, draft was accepted:D I you still have any feedback though feel free to add it to the article's talk page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Urchincrawler (talk • contribs) 04:21, 17 August 2024 (UTC)

Hello. I saw that there was a page of intersex-related redlinks including intersex healthcare since the intersex medical intervention page focuses mostly on intersex children. I whipped up a draft but I've never made such a hefty article from scratch (especially not a medical related article) so I'd appreciate some gentle feedback. Here's the draft. Thanks. P.S. feel free to add stuff if you happen to be knowledgeable about this subject.

Urchincrawler (talk) 21:58, 15 August 2024 (UTC)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Jansen_deVries_syndrome

I'm struggling to get my article approved for publication (this is my first time working on an article for wikipedia). I was hoping you could help me identify (and possibly fix) my mistakes. DEF2051 (talk) 17:31, 18 August 2024 (UTC)

Lets see:

• https://copyvios.toolforge.org/?lang=en&project=wikipedia&title=Draft:Jansen_deVries_syndrome&url= copy vio
• MEDRS https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Why_MEDRS%3F
• MEDMOS https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Medicine-related_articles

(BTW per the copyvio which indicates https://jansen-devries.org/about-jdvs/ might you have a https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Conflict_of_interest)

...though it is notable per https://www.orpha.net/en/disease/detail/653767 and https://www.omim.org/entry/617450, you may want to start over (slowly) and then submit...IMO--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 17:46, 18 August 2024 (UTC)

Expertise in evaluating systematic review & adding appropriate language to an article

There is currently a discussion at Talk:Tribulus terrestris regarding the evaluation of a small systematic review & how to include its findings in the article. The thread is Male sexual performance. The discussion is about the topic Tribulus terrestris. Thank you.

A IP editor posted a study about the efficacy and safety of Tribulus terrestris. I responded that we avoid primary sources. I also found a systematic review concerning dietary supplements for erectile dysfunction. Since this out of my league, I am requesting help in some WikiProjects where this be more apropos. Peaceray (talk) 18:16, 19 August 2024 (UTC)