Change 321478 had a related patch set uploaded (by Sbisson):
Special:RC filters: hide page edits, new pages, log entries

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/321478

Change 321478 merged by jenkins-bot:
Special:RC filters: hide page edits, new pages, log entries

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/321478

@SBisson - Presently, pages that are marked with 'N' in RC can be Flow boards topics (e.g. cawiki production). The filter hidenewpages does not exclude them (new wikitext pages are excluded) . Is it intentional? Topics have page id.

Also, any restriction on pages in other namespaces to be classified as new for hidenewpagesfilter?

Flow new topics are marked as new pages visually but Flow is not stored in recentchanges so that's why they are not filtered. But from the Flow extension, we can make it respect the hidenewpages filter and I think we should.

Also, Flow conversations can be pretty noisy, we should consider a "conversation" entry in the type of changes group in the UI so we can filter them out. Ping @jmatazzoni , @Pginer-WMF

In T150060#2898679, @SBisson wrote:

Flow new topics are marked as new pages visually but Flow is not stored in recentchanges so that's why they are not filtered. But from the Flow extension, we can make it respect the hidenewpages filter and I think we should.

Also, Flow conversations can be pretty noisy, we should consider a "conversation" entry in the type of changes group in the UI so we can filter them out.

So if I understand you correctly, you're saying that in Flow wikis, new Flow topics show up in RC page results with a big N. And there are a lot of them. They are not currently being captured by the New Pages filter, but they could be.

So, I think that yes, we should make it so that the New Pages filter picks those Flow topics up. I mean, each topic does have an associated page, right? So it makes sense, I guess.

But at this time, I'm not sure we should get involved in defining and creating a "Conversations" filter to capture them—even though, use-case wise, someone who wants to patrol new pages probably does not want to see Flow topics. I say this mainly because that hypothetical new page patroller can use the Namespace filter to remove those entries (or most of them) from results, right? But also because I'm not sure we want to deal with this right now, as there is some complexity involved. E.g., we'd presumably only show the Conversations filter to Flow wikis....

I could be persuaded otherwise. @Pginer-WMF, what do you think?

In T150060#2899557, @jmatazzoni wrote:

I could be persuaded otherwise. @Pginer-WMF, what do you think?

If new flow topics are marked by the "N" as new pages, I think it makes sense to make them to be affected by the new page filters.

Given that new pages are already shown by default, we are not increasing such volume with this change. In addition, currently it is already possible to filter by namespace: reviewers can focus on the article namespace if that is what they want to focus on, or exclude discussion namespace if that's what they want to ignore.

In T150060#2899557, @jmatazzoni wrote:

In T150060#2898679, @SBisson wrote:

Flow new topics are marked as new pages visually but Flow is not stored in recentchanges so that's why they are not filtered. But from the Flow extension, we can make it respect the hidenewpages filter and I think we should.

Also, Flow conversations can be pretty noisy, we should consider a "conversation" entry in the type of changes group in the UI so we can filter them out.

So if I understand you correctly, you're saying that in Flow wikis, new Flow topics show up in RC page results with a big N. And there are a lot of them. They are not currently being captured by the New Pages filter, but they could be.

Yes, captured as T154486: Special:RC - have 'hidepageedits' filter out all Flow changes

While it's possible to filter everything by namespace with a combination of *_talk and Topic, I think presenting conversations as a type of change, next to wikidata, edits, log, etc makes it more discoverable. But I agree there's probably more work involved in figuring out for which users and in which circumstances this is a problem and how to best solve it. I've filled T154489: Filter Flow conversations in or out for if/when we want to address this.

@Etonkovidova, did you confirm that the "Page creations" filter (formerly "New pages") returns Flow conversations, as we decided above (and that those Flow conversations get the "N")?

Also, the names of these functions have changed, as documented in T149385. See below for corrected filternames. To the extent the code can be consistent with the filternames, it will keep everyone from getting confused. @SBisson, please confirm the new names are used to the extent possible. (I've updated the descriptions above with the approved names.) Thanks.

• Page edits
• New pagesPage creations
• Category edits changes
• Wikidata edits
• Log Logged actions

In T150060#2915109, @jmatazzoni wrote:

Also, the names of these functions have changed, as documented in T149385. See below for corrected filternames. To the extent the code can be consistent with the filternames, it will keep everyone from getting confused. @SBisson, please confirm the new names are used to the extent possible. (I've updated the descriptions above with the approved names.) Thanks.

The filter names are consistent with the field or concept they filter on, as described in the code. I would prefer to leave it like that so the code is more consistent with itself, even if it's not always identical to the UI.

@SBisson rc_type = 142 (Flow post edits) won't be filtered out by hidepageedits=1

In T150060#2918546, @Etonkovidova wrote:

@SBisson rc_type = 142 (Flow post edits) won't be filtered out by hidepageedits=1

At this time Flow doesn't provide any filtering.

We talked about having it respect hidenewpages in T154486 and I filed T154489 to think about the general issue. Having it respect hidepageedits is an interesting idea that would help at least with some scenarios.

@jmatazzoni: Edits on Flow boards won't be filtered out by hidepageedits (the similar issue is with hidenewpages which is being addressed with T154486: Special:RC - have 'hidepageedits' filter out all Flow changes). Should we filed it as a separate ticket?

QA recommendation: Product should weigh in.

In the scheme we've defined, Flow edits (excluding Flow edits that create a new topic) belong with Page edits and only Page edits. That should be our goal.

So, to use a negative example, if I uncheck everything except Category changes, I should see Category changes only—and no Flow edits. If that is not what is happening—if Flow edits are slipping through because they're not addressed by the RC page filters—then we should fix that.

@SBisson, can you clarify? Will Flow edits be included with Page edits and only Page edits? (If not, do you want to fix it in this ticket or should we create a separate ticket?)

In T150060#2922068, @jmatazzoni wrote:

In the scheme we've defined, Flow edits (excluding Flow edits that create a new topic) belong with Page edits and only Page edits. That should be our goal.

So, to use a negative example, if I uncheck everything except Category changes, I should see Category changes only—and no Flow edits. If that is not what is happening—if Flow edits are slipping through because they're not addressed by the RC page filters—then we should fix that.

@SBisson, can you clarify? Will Flow edits be included with Page edits and only Page edits? (If not, do you want to fix it in this ticket or should we create a separate ticket?)

tldr: I'm working on T154486, which rolls new topics into the "new pages" filter. I will include all other Flow changes in the "page edits" filter as part of the same ticket, which I've updated accordingly.

It's unfortunately not as simple as it sounds since from RC's perspective, all this data is only tagged as "Flow". There's no notion of "new" or anything else. It makes it quite hard to filter. I'll probably have to change how data is stored.

The "N" is added during rendering when all the data is loaded and we can check a number of Flow-specific conditions (first version of the first reply to a non-moderated topic - it has nothing to do with the related Topic page).

The team met about this today and made the following decisions:

• As per T154486, all Flow edits will be captured by the Page Edits filter.
• We will NOT distinguish between new Flow topic creations and other flow edits, which means Flow topic creations will not be captured by the Page Creations filter.
• However, new Flow Topics will continue, as now, to be marked with the N by the system.

@SBisson and @Mattflaschen-WMF, let me know if I've misstated or missed anything.

So, given the above, can we close this ticket?

In T150060#2924130, @jmatazzoni wrote:

So, given the above, can we close this ticket?

yes