Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/The Futuristics
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. -- Cirt (talk) 19:32, 17 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- The Futuristics (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)
- (Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
Non-notable group, fails WP:BAND Only trivial coverage CTJF83 23:22, 3 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. — Baseball Watcher 00:44, 4 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Delete - I can find no significant coverage about the music production duo going by the name of "The Futuristics". Searches for the names of the individual members also drew a blank. -- Whpq (talk) 16:09, 6 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Keep This page is about a notable production team named "The Futuristics" and should not be deleted. I have posted official ASCAP writing credits, which confirm they have produced for major top 40 artist. I also included many other references, which unmistakably note that they are indeed a production team that has created music that has been listened to by millions of people. -- DerekAC7 —Preceding undated comment added 07:06, 8 June 2011 (UTC).[reply]
- Your sources are poor 3 & 4 don't mention the Futuristics...in fact, do any of your sources mention the futuristics? The ones I looked up don't...well 17 does, but it looks like a poor source...sorry, doesn't cut it. CTJF83 12:00, 8 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Ctif83 - The Futuristics are mentioned on the official Lonely Island webpage (source 17), citing that they produced "The Golden Rule" featuring Justin Timberlake and Lady Gaga. Please don't make this more difficult than it has to be. They are obviously a notable production team if they have had a placement with these two artist.
- So...they are on 1 out of 17 sources? Plus, who knows how reliable "the lonely island" website is. If they really produced a Gaga or Timberlake song, it would either be on their website, or one that is clearly reliable. CTJF83 07:41, 9 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment - ASCAP credits are useful for verifying facts, but are not so useful for establishing notability. All that the ASACP credits tell us is that one or both of the production duo wrote the song. Writing a song does not establish notability. -- Whpq (talk) 12:04, 8 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment - I understand ASCAP credits only verify the writers, however, if you look at the songs they wrote they happen to be for major label artist, which have sold millions of copies. This production team had their track played on Saturday Night Live last week featuring Lady Gaga and Justin Timberlake. This should be a no brainer. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.167.155.161 (talk) 07:30, 9 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- "'Comment"' - "The Futuristics" are a notable group. There are credits to prove it and therefore should be no issue. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.75.113.225 (talk) 21:10, 9 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- "Comment" - Your questioning how reliable The Lonely Island website is seems to not hold much weight. This is a group of writers/comedians on Saturday Night Live, signed to Universal Republic, whose music features huge artists. This is their official website so unless proven otherwise shouldn't we assume all the content is valid?
- Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.
- Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Roscelese (talk ⋅ contribs) 05:15, 10 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment - Please see WP:RS to understand what Wikipedia considers to be a reliable source. And in any case, simply being credited with production does not establish notability. -- Whpq (talk) 11:07, 10 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment - I have read the above mentioned link and Wikipedia does consider my sources reliable as they meet all of it's requirements. Also, thank you for acknowledging that they were credited on these productions. Now, please look a step further to understand that the productions they were credited on were with major label artist and have been heard by millions. This draws me to the conclusion that if the songs they have credits on are notable, they indeed should be considered a notable production team. Thank you
- Reply - I doubt that the The Lonely Island website would pass muster as a reliable source. In any case, none of the sources provide significant coverage about the production group. A bunch of credits doesn't establish notability. -- Whpq (talk) 18:03, 13 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Reply - Let's be clear that this is a production group and not an artist. Production groups, especially new ones, don't have significant media coverage because they are behind the scenes. Nevertheless, they are notable and should be covered by Wikipedia because they have songs that have been heard by millions, which can be inferred by the production credits provided. For example, "Boomerang" - DJ Felli Fel ft. Pitbull, Akon, and Jermaine Dupri is a song that ASCAP lists The Futuristics as official writers. "Boomerang" has been played on Big Boy's Neighborhood (Power 106), a nationally syndicated program (http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:rruI94QppvkJ:www.power106.fm/playlist/index.aspx+big+boys+neighborhood+playlist+boomerang&cd=2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&source=www.google.com). Although you must look at two sources to draw this conclusion, the fact that The Futuristics have had placements on nationally syndicated songs heard by millions can be made nonetheless. Therefor, there should be no argument regarding this productions teams notability. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.167.155.161 (talk) 19:28, 13 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Reply - In order to be perfectly clear, they are in production, and are also songwriters, but are not performing artists. Correct? As producers, they still need to meet inclusion criteria, and production credits don't cut it. They haven't for other producers, and they won't here. If they have won a Grammy, or had an entire article written about them in Billboard, or something like that, then there would be a leg to stand on. I have found no evidence of any of these things. If you are aware of articles written about them, please bring them forward. Being credited for producing songs, no matter how performs them, will not result in the artcile being kept no matter how may times you insist that credits should be enough. -- Whpq (talk) 20:00, 13 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Reply - If you are insisting that a producer must have an article in Billboard or a Grammy in order to be included in Wikipedia then you should delete many long lasting producer pages on this site. You are attempting to strip this production team of credits that they rightfully deserve by not allowing them to list their notable production credits and biography on Wikipedia. They are credited on Lonely Island's Wikipedia page and haven't had a problem http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:GNtmgXHTM_kJ:en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dick_in_a_Box+%22lonely+island%22+%22the+futuristics%22&cd=20&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&source=www.google.com. If this precedent is set then you shouldn't refute the idea of them having their own page.
- Reply - I am not insisting that they must have won a Grammy or must have coverage on Billboard. Those are examples of the types of awards or coverage that would establish notability. What happens in other articles is not relevant to this discussion. Nobody has a right have their production credits listed on Wikipedia. -- Whpq (talk) 10:27, 14 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Reply - With all due respect, I feel you are arguing at this point for the sake of arguing. What is the next step? Who inevitably makes a decision? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.167.155.161 (talk) 19:05, 15 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Reply - An administrator reviews the discussion and weighs it against Wikipedia policies and guidelines to come to a decision. See WP:AFD#How an AfD discussion is closed. -- Whpq (talk) 20:34, 15 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Reply - Thank you — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.167.155.161 (talk) 23:57, 15 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Reply - An administrator reviews the discussion and weighs it against Wikipedia policies and guidelines to come to a decision. See WP:AFD#How an AfD discussion is closed. -- Whpq (talk) 20:34, 15 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Reply - With all due respect, I feel you are arguing at this point for the sake of arguing. What is the next step? Who inevitably makes a decision? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.167.155.161 (talk) 19:05, 15 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Reply - I am not insisting that they must have won a Grammy or must have coverage on Billboard. Those are examples of the types of awards or coverage that would establish notability. What happens in other articles is not relevant to this discussion. Nobody has a right have their production credits listed on Wikipedia. -- Whpq (talk) 10:27, 14 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Reply - If you are insisting that a producer must have an article in Billboard or a Grammy in order to be included in Wikipedia then you should delete many long lasting producer pages on this site. You are attempting to strip this production team of credits that they rightfully deserve by not allowing them to list their notable production credits and biography on Wikipedia. They are credited on Lonely Island's Wikipedia page and haven't had a problem http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:GNtmgXHTM_kJ:en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dick_in_a_Box+%22lonely+island%22+%22the+futuristics%22&cd=20&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&source=www.google.com. If this precedent is set then you shouldn't refute the idea of them having their own page.
- Reply - In order to be perfectly clear, they are in production, and are also songwriters, but are not performing artists. Correct? As producers, they still need to meet inclusion criteria, and production credits don't cut it. They haven't for other producers, and they won't here. If they have won a Grammy, or had an entire article written about them in Billboard, or something like that, then there would be a leg to stand on. I have found no evidence of any of these things. If you are aware of articles written about them, please bring them forward. Being credited for producing songs, no matter how performs them, will not result in the artcile being kept no matter how may times you insist that credits should be enough. -- Whpq (talk) 20:00, 13 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Reply - Let's be clear that this is a production group and not an artist. Production groups, especially new ones, don't have significant media coverage because they are behind the scenes. Nevertheless, they are notable and should be covered by Wikipedia because they have songs that have been heard by millions, which can be inferred by the production credits provided. For example, "Boomerang" - DJ Felli Fel ft. Pitbull, Akon, and Jermaine Dupri is a song that ASCAP lists The Futuristics as official writers. "Boomerang" has been played on Big Boy's Neighborhood (Power 106), a nationally syndicated program (http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:rruI94QppvkJ:www.power106.fm/playlist/index.aspx+big+boys+neighborhood+playlist+boomerang&cd=2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&source=www.google.com). Although you must look at two sources to draw this conclusion, the fact that The Futuristics have had placements on nationally syndicated songs heard by millions can be made nonetheless. Therefor, there should be no argument regarding this productions teams notability. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.167.155.161 (talk) 19:28, 13 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Reply - I doubt that the The Lonely Island website would pass muster as a reliable source. In any case, none of the sources provide significant coverage about the production group. A bunch of credits doesn't establish notability. -- Whpq (talk) 18:03, 13 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Delete. It appears that the subject has produced songs for notable musicians, however I can find no significant coverage for the production team itself in reliable sources. I don't see that they meet WP:GNG or WP:MUSIC at this time. Gongshow Talk 16:07, 17 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.